Ohhhhh, that's good. May not be fair, but it's still good. I'm gonna ask my Mom that next time I talk to her (she's an ordained minister).

 

Nope, that was a fine answer.

 

Thank you!
I was just wondering. I can't get people to talk about the evolution.

 

I can't believe you people don't believe in evolution. There is an INSURMOUNTABLE amount of evidence that modern man evolved from a monkey. Take ManualF150, for example

 

LMFAO

There;s a few charactors around here whose knuckles scrape the ground, it should be obvious, lol

 

I have been out of town for a few days... Working late, and going to bed early. It has not been a lot of fun. I see that I need to get back in and mix it up. Some of you Atheists have made some points that definitely need to be addressed. I should get some time during this weekend... And then on Monday, you will all laugh at what busy little beaver than I have been.

Some of yall have quoted scripture... I need to go back, and re read them. If you quote verse 8, I need to see 6,7, then 8 along with 9. Quoting something without the full gist can look a little strange.

 

ooo

 

Howdy! I joined a while ago when I was looking for some info on my truck (Blue Super Crew FX4, for the record) and just saw this thread. As I’ve nothing much to do this afternoon, I thought I’d wade in and offer my views on the last few pages.

First, though, a little about my background and where I’m coming from. I hate labels, but I might best be described as a democratic misanthropic agnostic; I dislike Bible thumpers with the same fervor as I do science is god quasi-atheists. Now, on to the quote stream (starting from page 12 or so; I didn’t read earlier posts):

Not a very good point. We know that there are many, many trillions of stars in the universe; it therefore stands to reason that a 1-in-a-trillion event has happened numerous times.

No, you don’t. If you really knew what was true, you wouldn’t need faith – which I presume you claim to have.

Unfortunately (or interestingly, depending upon your POV) hell has come to be regarded as some sort of fire pit infested with torture devices, guarded and maintained by the most horrific of beings. Why it came to be such is a subject all to its own, but let me show you “hell” in a different light.

Suppose you die, and are taken before god to be judged. You are suddenly made aware of your creator, a god of infinite goodness/beauty/power/pizza/halitosis/whatever. This god has the power to love you far beyond anything that you have ever experienced, and to fill you with the greatest happiness and joy that you could ever know (he is your creator, after all.) However, because of your sin, you are cast from his presence for all eternity – and left without the chance of ever being loved again. That would be a hell much, much worse than any fiery pit, and the hell Christian beliefs might save you from – a hell created by the lack of something (love) and not by the active presence of some sulfuric tortures.

The baby/ignorant savages/mentally retarded/whatever “argument” is a non-starter. There is no punch-card to salvation, no series of tasks, beliefs, or actions that will guarantee you a place in heaven. Everyone is judged individually by god; no man or religion could ever guarantee you success or failure when it’s your turn to be analyzed. I think there’s a parable in the New Testament about different workers receiving the same wages for different work that’s applicable here; the moral is basically mind your own business.

The “baby question” is generally a response to the sense that Christians are all about missionary work and converting the “bad people” of the world – the why of which is indeed an interesting subject. Worrying about status of a baby’s soul, however, is kind of silly.

Science vs. Religion, round eleven billion and one. The argument is futile; science cannot ever hope to prove or disprove the Bible, and the Bible cannot ever be used to disprove or prove science. There are millions of subjects that are “debated” between the two; as you have chosen the dating of the creation event, we’ll briefly take that one apart.

--------- Continued Below ---------

 

The 6000 year old earth from the Bible is kind of silly. It basically assumes the literal infallibility of genetic records and event recordings; given that the people taking these records were living in mud huts and using their hands to wipe themselves, their figures should be taken with a large grain of salt. This does not mean that the Bible is “wrong”, merely that the truth was recorded by people of less than perfect education and resources. Ask a young child to describe any complex event and they’ll tell you the truth as they can comprehend it – that doesn’t mean it’ll be the literal truth as you see it.

The Bible literally says that the earth/universe was created by a sequence of events that all occurred in a day. Unfortunately, when there’s no sun to shine or earth to rotate, defining a day is somewhat tricky. For that and many other reasons, you need to take the point of the story (that god created the universe) instead of getting hung up on exact chronological spacing.

This sword cuts both ways, though; a lot of Bible thumpers claim that there are dinosaurs in the Bible, which is nonsense. Given the length, complexity, and varied sophistication of the Bible’s authors, you can find “evidence” in the Bible for anything that you want to find – dinosaurs, leprechauns, and silver space ships buried in the moon are equally “provable”. Bottom line: the Science vs. Religion debate is useless.

That’s because science is based upon experiences that have been proven undeniably common to all, but religion is based upon experiences that cannot be proven. Their mutual coexistence is neither surprising nor proof of anything.

No. God may have created morals, but moral codes are also quite sensible restrictions on behavior that any lasting society will inevitably come up with. Exact specifics will vary, but generalities like theft/murder/etc. being “bad” will not.

Not really. Islam, just like Judaism and Christianity, is an Abrahamic religion. They all disagree on some points, such as whether or not Jesus was just some dude, a prophet, or the son of god, but they all worship the god of Abraham. Their differences might be more severe than those between a Protestant and a Catholic, but they are extremely slight compared to those between a Hindu and Baptist.

No, free minds are questing minds. Put another way, only a free mind can seek and thus be found.

In the end, you’re right, nothing was given up. However, you are presumptively assuming that there was no risk involved, and that Jesus’ resurrection back to heaven was a foregone conclusion. There are a few reasons why it wasn’t; one is that, if it was, why would the Devil offer Jesus the kingship of earth if he defected?

Of course, the reply here is to ask about the omniscience of God, and how anything could happen that he didn’t foresee – which gets into the nature of free will, a different subject entirely.

Probably because it’s a silly question – cute, but silly. In essence, you’re asking if god could do something that’s undoable. The answer is no, but you cannot therefore conclude that god is limited. For example, take the exact same type of question framed in different language; can god create a positive number that’s less than zero? Obviously, he can’t, but that doesn’t mean that god is limited in some way.


If anyone’s got any other points or wants to go into greater detail on anything, let me know; these discussions are way more fun than watching the minute hand sweep around.

 

Welcome to the site

 

Shhh! You're not supposed to help my simple minded friends and expose my cunning tricks

Welcome to the site!

Getting back to the "Jesus dying for our sins question".

I don't quite understand the risk involved because if God is all knowing and all-everything, he would know exactly how that deal would get played out...wouldnt he?

I can see God in front of a giant blackboard with a piece of chalk...
laying out his game plan to one of his consultants...

"ok, so I'm gonna send the Holy Seed down to Earth"
-Check!

'and the Holy seed will impregnate the Virgin Mary"
-Check! but boss, they aint gonna believe her'

"Too bad, it's my story, my rules, ****!"
-Check!

"Baby Jesus, my son will be born, and spend his life preaching my word"
-Check!

"Then the Jews are gonna beat him into a pulp and give him a very painful death"
-Check!

"Then I'm gonna teleport him back to Heaven to sit by my side forever"
-Check! Good plan boss!!

I mean, if there was a chance Jesus could realistically be tempted by the devil, God would see it coming....wouldnt he?

Habibi

 

Olddogg's question has me a little perplexed. Matthew 1:2-17 and Luke 3:23-38, as of now they have me a little confused. I put out a few calls today. This one really has me irritated... Just being honest, as I am the so called resident bible thumper.

 

JUDGE YE NOT, LEST YE BE JUDGED!!!!! (Probably not spelled correctly, but you get my point.) You may be a Moderator but, did God appoint you the judge?

 

How is stating fact an act of judging?

 

someone that goes to his grave denying God, such as many have and will do , that have posted in this thread.