Yes but there is a special place in hell for people like that, those who mis-use the bible to scam people. Don't have time to look it up right now, but Jesus warned people to beware of those who come in my name and...

Pretty much like those who tried to "educate" you in your youth! Remember the verse you quoted about do not hinder the children? You buddy were HINDERED and I believe those people will be held accountable when they stand before their maker!

See I don't completely have CRAFT- I can remember some stuff! ha ha

 

No one will ever accuse you of "throwing" the snowball, but you're damn good at making them

trouble maker

 

That was a good line

 

The rocks always go in the middle!

 

He said this to the apostles, not to everyone that was a believer.

 

Just because there are some counterfeit 100 dollar bills out there, does that mean that you don't want anything to do with them? I'll sure take the ones you don't want. Just because there is a d-bag involved in the church doesn't mean that everyone is that way. There are d-bags in everything, even d-bags who are agnostics and atheists, so if you want to separate yourself from them, you're going to be sorely disappointed in life.

 

Upland on 24th street-I don't think he owns it any more. He got run out because of his scandals!

 

Oh, I see, sill me, sorry. So this people http://tobechristian.org/Chapter%20III-1-commission.htm in your opinion are wrong.

OK, NOW I'm understanding the sacred scriptures a little better. So from John 3: 1-9 and continuing from 10-15 Jesus was talking to a "Pharisees named Nicodemus" But then he switched to speaking to people like you and me in John 3:16 then switched back to speaking to Nicodemus!

I get it now, so even though I don't believe in your Biblical "God" I'm not condemned because after John 3:16 Jesus was not referring to people like me. Oh man I can see how faith can really help in altering ones mind. Wait a minute..............does that mean that my "faith" is starting to surface out? Thanks man.

John 3: 10-15; 10 "You are Israel's teacher," said Jesus, "and do you not understand these things? 11 I tell you the truth, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony. 12 I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things? 13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man. 14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.


John 3: 16-21; 16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son. 19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God."

 

Pick-up Man, I respectfully disagree.
Over the last 5+ years we've had several of these religious threads in this very forum, and I am 99.9% sure I remember a few of the key religious people here (Stealth, Chris etc) mention that in order to be considered a good Chritian, they had to follow God's order and actively spread the word.

If I'm wrong, I'll accept it, but I am pretty certain this is an order by God to spread the word, and not really optional.

Maybe someone else who considers themselves to be a strict Born Again Christain can comment on this? Is spreading the word an optional activity?
Will you still get into Heaven if you do everything else that's required of you, but purposely don't spread the word?

I seem to recall this was a deal-breaker, and this was somewhere in the small print.

The reason I remember this particular point is because when we debated this stuff in the past I thought to myself "Ok, I can do everything on the list, seems easy enough", but when it got to the knocking on strangers doors, that's when I knew I wasn't worthy to be in the club because I just couldn't do that.

Habs

 

Spreading the Word is a direct command for all Christians (the "Great Commission" was directly given to the apostles but was intended for all of Christ's followers). It doesn't mean ramming the Word down people's throats or judging them for how they do or don't receive the word (that's God's job). Even Jesus himself told us not to cast pearls before swine (for those interested: Matt 7:6 "Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and then turn and tear you to pieces." NIV; the entire chapter more or less follows this theme).'

There are more ways than knocking on strangers' doors (most strangers would find that offensive, anyway) to spread God's word. It can be as simple as setting a good example by how one lives (nothing like practicing what one preaches).

 

I've still been following this thread and even though I thought I had nothing more to add I think I can answer this one.

Lady Fitzgerald is right in that Jesus did give us the Great Commission to spread the gospel. She is also correct that that does not specifically mean knocking on doors even though you could and that there are other ways to do it.

First look at John 3:16. The only requirment is trusting in Jesus. Now look at Ephesians 2:8-9. 8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.

No works, even sharing the gospel, are required. However, when a true change of heart happens and you put your faith in Christ you will produce fruit. Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness. In other words your change of heart will be reflected in your life by your actions. Witnessing is just one of many actions that should come naturally.

For example, if you were to hear a few friends talking about trucks and which is the best you would most likely go over and tell them about your F150. Why? Because you belive it is the best and want others to know. So it sort of happens the same way with sharing your faith.

Some prodestant denominations have different views on if you are once saved, always saved. But I believe that if you truly accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior then there is nothing that can cause you to loose your salvation. That does not mean you will never make mistakes or sin again. And it does not give you a license to sin. Someone who views it as a get out of jail free card most likely never really trusted Christ. It just means that your are secure in Christ and his forgiveness.

Hope that helped! Maybe I will chime in again from time to time if I think it will be useful?

 

He was talking about "whoever" that believed in him, not just Nicodemus, and in earlier verses such as 10, he is speaking directly to and about Nicodemus. And ok, yeah, since you don't believe, then yeah, you're already condemned. I already said, I don't want to argue, if you don't believe, then you don't believe and that's fine, that's between you and God. This is not the "5 signs" that we were debating earlier, either, that is something completely different. I didn't even click the link that you provided, either, because I don't have time right now, and frankly, am not worried about it, just having a friendly discussion about it.

 

Habibi, we're spreading the word right now.
And also, I don't think that's a dealbreaker. It's not part of believing in Jesus.

 

I can't accept that if it means that everyone in the world who believes in another religion, no matter how good of a life they've lived, no matter how many people they've helped, no matter how many sacrifices they've made, will all burn in Hell for eternity. If that's how your "God" treats "His" creations, then I, again, want no part of it.

I refuse to believe that every dead Buddhist Monk is burning in Hell.

If during this "spreading of the word" you actually end up turning people away from your religion, does that count against you?

- NCSU

 

wow... what a thread. it'll take a while to read this, let alone digest it. great subject, though!

i consider myself a failed christian. i like the bumper sticker that says "Christians aren't perfect, just forgiven".

the arguments against christianity based on a lack of adherence to the faith are just silly, if fatal. I suspect many who depend on those arguments are simply rationalizing what they want. in other words, they're projecting.

because i am not perfect in my off-roading, should i give it up? because my idea of off-roading is not your idea of off-roading, should we war on each other?

i don't have the answers. my bible is a current translation based on the original works. nobody intreprets it for me. - i listen to people such as those on here, and discuss my questions with you, but i make up my own mind.
i believe Jesus died to save me, and i believe that faith in that act alone will get me in, no matter how badly i err between now and my judgement, so long as i do not turn my back on that gift. i am a roman catholic and i try to live in my church, because it improves my life and makes it easier to accept that gift Jesus gave me; because living in the church makes it hard for me to turn my back on that gift and yield to temptation, but whether i live in the church or not, i'm good as long as i accept His gift. I try to live my church, and i fail at that, too. i'm human; we err, we fail, we sin. He forgives.
i believe that means trying to live my life as Jesus would have us live it, and i believe i will frequently fail to do that. He will forgive me, and i must keep trying.
like many, i have suffered beyond belief. what has been done to me since childhood has cost me a great deal, and i pay for it every day of my life. but we hurt each other because we are free to do so. we are free to accept His sacrifice; so we are free to hurt each other. because someone with the freedom to accept salvation chose to harm you, should you then turn away from the gift?
i don't understand the world, but that there is a world proves God to me. I believe Jesus is His son, and sacrificed himself to pay my bill. no matter how hard it is for me to face the wrongs i have done, and i have done wrong, that is not my problem - my wrongs have been faced, paid for, and wiped clean, and will continue to be so long as i believe that in that sacrifice.
i am not free to do wrong because i am forgiven. i do wrong because i am weak. some do wrong because they refuse the gift, and choose to live as they please, not as pleases Him. oops.
God will not condemn me; he gives me a free pass, asking only that i accept it. if i accept it; accept that my wrongs have been forgiven, how can i do other than try to do no wrong, even if i know i will fail?
Only i can condemn me, by refusing to believe my sins are forgiven; and thus living life as it pleases me.

This is what i believe. i hope to see you all again.