you didnt mention their beyond terrible gas mileage...

 

I agree, the RAM will probably be the biggest threat. Dodge is trying to address their drivetrain problems, and if they do, they will be a significant threat. Toys have the power, and the transmission looks cool, but they have got to get their styling fixed.

I used to believe in that whole "foreign cars are a better quality" b.s. until I actually bought a Toy 4Runner. That was the biggest $26k mistake I ever made. I've since had a Kia and a Mitsubishi. I will never again buy a vehicle that isn't from the big three. Unless I run across a BMW 5 series or better that I can afford anyways. Imports might have ok drivetrains, but the interior quality is crap. And they don't get that mythical better gas mileage that every rabid import owner swears by. I'd rather spend my money on domestic and get a good vehicle for an ok price that will last me the 60-70,000 miles I will drive it.

the biggest problem with Toys and other imports is they are a pain in the butt to modify. Take any of the big three, slap an intake, exhaust and a tune on it. This will gain you instant HP and performance for about $1000 that is reliable and relatively easy to do.

Take an import and you have to send the ECM off to get reflashed, or buy a chip, or get some shop to solder something to the ECM. They aren't as receptive to power mods. Well, at least on the cheap. If you're willing to spend big bucks, you can get there.

 

You mean the unserviceable transmision that if it develops a leak you cant add any more transmission fluid to, so you are just stuck there. Will have to have it towed to the closest dealer to have the leak fixed and transmission fluid added. That would be nice to have happen 400 miles form home on a saturday night..... You'll be stuck there till moday when the dealer opens.

Be careful with your wording, more toyotas are built here in the USA than Fords are....

 

im sorry i should have been more specific

P.S. ( that fits into the dodge truck agenda)

 

its a sad truth

 

wow, I've seen 3 different posts about Unions being crap and nobody has flamed those posts yet. I guess this site doesn't have as many rabidly pro-Unioners as my other favorite F-150 site.

I totally agree with you. If the big 3 could get competative labor at a decent price, I think they would have better footing to fight the import challengers. As it is, the buck keeps getting sent downline to the consumer to pay for these people and their outrageous demands. I wish I could get offered $150 g's to quit my job and go work somewhere else. I could pay off both cars, be completely debt free and still have $100 g's to live comfortably until I got a new job.

PSS-Mag, I agree with you about the transmission thing. as for the foriegn car thing, that is all subjective now. I guess a better way to say it would be that a foreign designed car. Toy is just building them here to skip the import taxes and say they're American built to get people to buy them. I've had 4 different foreign cars, and all 4 have been POS.

 

ya but they are built with foreign design and technology like you said, american hands just put it together

 

Yea.. that would be correct... In fact most of us hate unions.


I agree 100%, I've already heard the argument about "forgien Toy" just trying to figure out the proper wording so they can't argue and claim to be American. I want to redefine "Domestic" so they can't pose any longer.


American Made vs Made in America.

 

Hey guys i know there has been a lot of **** about Toyota and Ford, but i want you to check this simple video that one of my friends produced. This is straight out, no advertisment or commercials.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRfE_XAk2mE

 

Ok, ive seen these arguments on this forum a few times now.........

If your buying a truck to go fast then thats your problem, get a lighting or something if you want to go fast or better yet.........A CAR

I dont give a flying rats *** how fast i get to 60 MPH, Fords look the best hands down, they are extremely comfortable and they get the job done.

HAHA, buying trucks to go fast, thats hilarious

 

Since this thread was started there has been alot of interesting things happening with the Tundra that flies in the face of all of Toyota's marketing for it. Tailgate failures, engine issues, transmission issues, interior, paint, the list just keeps growing. Does it really matter that you can do 0-60 in 6-7 seconds when the truck as a whole is pretty much useless for anything but going fast? The issues for this truck are just getting started, there's bound to be, sooner or later, some Tundra owners that will load their truck to what Toyota says it can handle. That's when we will start hearing about diff failures, driveshaft failures, perhaps even frames breaking.

The bottom line is because the F150 doesn't have that power we'll say you don't need it. If the F150 did have that power we would look at everyone else and laugh they way they laugh at our "underpowered" trucks. When I can load 2500 lbs of gravel in my F150 and haul it 3 miles home at 50 MPH with no worries, that's what I call a solid truck. You won't see many, if any, Tundra owners attempting that.

 

You sure about that? Your first 2 sentences in this paragraph hit the nail on the head. Same issue with braking.

With the frame issue, until I hear or anyone else hears of frames failing under loading because they are "junk" it's all just asumptions. When did Ford started using this "bulletproof" boxed frame in the F150? Were all the F150 frames before it junk also? What about the frame in the SD? When was the last time you heard of a frame failing in a 1/2 ton truck?

 

6 months ago I could have speculated that there would be tailgate failures on the Tundra, and you could have said the same thing, it's just assumptions. Yet there's a 20 page thread on the tundrasolutions site dedicated to just that issue, complete with pictures. I never thought I would see something like a tailgate failing on a full size truck.

When you compare the strength and stiffness of the current F150 frames to everything before it, the truth is that yes, they are junk. The frames on those previous models was good for what those models were designed to handle. The market is so competitive now that those older frames could never handle what a light duty truck is expected to do now. The current F150 could never perform and handle the way it does without that crazy stiff frame. As for the Super Duties, yes, they use an open C channel but it's made of thicker steel then before. This keeps it strong but flexible to handle the weight they're designed for without breaking. It's the same reason the frames on semi's are so twisty.

 

And I would hope that the tailgate issue they are having is just an design oversight. IMHO there is no comparison in the importance in design between a truck frame and a truck tailgate.

If frames do start failing, then yes, they deserve to be ridiculed for not building a strong 1/2 ton and the "weak" frame bandwagon everyone likes to jump on would be justified. But until then....

And don't you find it odd that since the new Tundra was introduced, Ford raised it's towing from 9500lbs to 11,000lbs without any re-design whatsoever? ( properly equipped of course )

Isn't the Tundra a C channel design also? I would imagine built with thinner steel ( or not ) for it's intended purpose. Much like the C channel design on the SD and semi's.

 

Very true, but all you need to do is follow a Tundra and watch how it reacts to even the smallest bump on the road. The rear portion of the frame will shake the box like crazy. It's not just something that's set up in a Ford video.


This shows how the Ford engineers planned ahead when they designed the NBS back in '04. The frame is so overbuilt that they can up the towing numbers as competition demands it with out having to go back and rebuild it every year. I'd imagine those numbers are topping out though, Ford will have to build some flexibility back into the frame to keep it from breaking at heavier loads.


Yes it is, and it's designed for it's purpose (we can hope). Although I doubt you'll see Toyota upping their towing numbers without a major frame overhaul the way Ford can.