Check post #34 for the dyno!

 

When will it end??? Speaks volumes of Troyer that he spoke he gave his opinion (thats all it is guys) and walked away and has not came back to debate or add fuel to the fire. He gave his recommendation - take it or leave it.

After +40 posts - I think this issue has been beat long enough. Bottom line - its your vehicle - do as you will. No matter what combo you pick - someone will find fault with it.

Lets get to a more substantive issue - what you you think about the Turbonator?

 

If you put a turbonator in your exhaust pipe will it help with scavenging???

 

I WOULDNT TOUCH YOUR CUSTOMERS TESTIES!!!

regarding the dyno chart for the F150, if you look at the section from 3000 -3800, it looks like a Z! As i said, i am not being negative, I just want to know why it does that, thats all. Nothing more, nothing less. I know some people have been hard on you (myself included), but getting a chip on your shoulder is NOT the way to further your f150 business. Not getting drawn into petty bickering and providing a proven and superior product and service is!

I DO appreciate you posting the dyno charts, most folks on here will not post theirs for some reason..

 

Sorry, that's the stock run and a down shift. It's hard to get a good clean run with out the tranny shifting up or down.

 

I WOULDNT TOUCH YOUR CUSTOMERS TESTIES

I appreciate that..

 

I know nothing eh? Well, lets see. Here's a poster from our boards with dyno result before and after open air and stock box

Lets keep at it smart guy.

Here's a link to a Truckin Magazine article. An astounding 9HP was found with an open air element filter with the hood open, and a whopping 4HP with it closed. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but 2 lbs of boost in my book is worth more than 10HP. But I bet these guys are idiots who don't deserve a response either.
http://www.truckinweb.com/tech/0103tr_projectlight/

Kenne Bell, a quite well known leader of hte industry had this to say:

"Ford did their homework on exhaust, headers, throttle body, mass air meter and filter. Except for a chip, they just didn't leave much HP gains for the aftermarket."
http://www.kennebell.net/techinfo/ford-techinfo/Lightning54only/history.pdf#search='lightning%20air%20filter%20boo st'

So, only you know about lightnings and how to get power out of them, a full two pounds of boost that even Kenne Bell couldn't seem to find.

 

Good grief, what some people will do to attack me and promote themselves - amazing, especially given the fact that I have not attacked that product!

A product that I *am* familiar with, by the way, despite some of the claims here. We don't have to purchase products directly ( and many times do not, for obvious reasons) to get a look at them or to test them, as anyone with a brain can quickly figure out. We have been looking at JLT products for quite some time, ever since all the debacle in the Mustang & especially the 03-04 Cobra world.

And I wish him nothing but the best, despite all the juvenile nonsense & public & private messages to me along with the attacks & assumptions to the contrary here - the lack of maturity on the part of some people is really amazing - but it's no mystery when it comes from those with an obvious agenda - the clear agenda to promote the product here at any opportunity.

The fact is, I hope he hits a home run - but that dyno chart I sure as heck wouldn't be touting to promote the product, as for anyone who actually knows anything about proper tuning & proper dyno testing procedures, etc., it doesn't even come close to showing the before & after info that is actually required to give a proper picture. And I will be happy to explain all of that to Jay, if and when he returns my phone call.

And by the way, I beg to differ - no, it is NOT hard to make a properly controlled dyno run without any downshifting or upshifting, etc. That is extremely simple to do, as any tuner would know - that's 101 stuff.

I said what I said WITHOUT making *ANY* type of attack on this gentleman's product - now with all that having been said, I will be more than happy to PROPERLY test the product, and have left a message with Jay, who sent me a rather presumptive, though probably well meant, private message here - and I appreciate him sending me that message. I have called him, but only got his voice mail when I called at 4:58 pm.

So Jay, it's up to you to "step up" - you have my phone numbers, and I will be happy to speak with you about this - and I look forward to us having a friendly & productive discussion!

Last - despite some of the needless self-promotion and unfounded attacks on me, usually when this kind of nonsense starts up, there is usually some type of positive outcome, and with reasonable people, that shouldn't be hard to do.

Oh, I just had to mention this before I forget it - one thing I DO agree with Jay on is the fact that when dealing with supercharged vehicles that are actually breathing heavily enough to induce additional "artificial" restriction in the air intake tract, you CAN actually increase boost thru reduction upstream of the blower in the air intake tract - again, that is 101 stuff.

Take a Harley at stock 6 PSI boost, and you don't' see significant power gains from most intake kits - but crank that Harley up to 12 PSI boost, and suddenly you do see a slight increase in boost along with power gains due not only to the small gain in boost, but to the reduction of restriction.

It's all about proper design, which must go further than just slapping on a huge diameter air tube - you must also maintain air intake velocity to have proper part-throttle driveability. In fact, one of the reasons we spent so much additional money on our eddy-current dyno is so that we can do just that - do proper part-throttle testing in addition to the typical foot to the floor stuff that is usually the only thing seen & promoted. See, it's not worth getting an additional 5 peak HP over the best designed intake kit when you lose torque on part-throttle at lower rpms - or have to re-write how these 3V systems are controlled so that the throttle opens up so much more to compensate that mpg drops - there is so much more to this than meets the eye, or than could ever be communicated by that one rather incomplete dyno graph. And no, once again, that is NOT an "attack" on Jay or his product, this is just for discussion purposes. And for the gentleman who claimed "all we do" is sell other products, *we* designed the Air Force One intake kit for the 5.4 3V F-150 - and in that process went thru many iterations of diameter, bend location, dimensioning & airflow direction, and numerous other aspects that went into us finally offering 2 version of that kit - as anyone who actually knows anything about us knows, we do a rather significant amount of R&D for a number of manufacturers of many different parts for these trucks - this is what we specialize in, and why manufactures of everything ranging from intake, exhaust, tuning & other products come to us for our expertise on this platform - so I hope that this information will help clear up "turboscrew2005's" misperceptions about what we actually do here at Troyer Performance.

At any rate, I thank Jay for his message, and I sincerely look forward to speaking with him at length about this - have a great weekend!

 

Well said Mike....

 

Just to clear a few things up Mr. Troyer.
There is no "debacle in the Mustang & especially the 03-04 Cobra world" as to the JLT. We have the best kit for high HP Cobras, with one on the runner up worlds fastest Cobra in the MM&FF Cobra shotout. There's a JLT on several 6-7 and 800 RWHP Cobras and the worlds fastest 6 spd/IRS car (Jay Knot) is testing it now on his sub-9 sec Cobra. Several low 10 sec cars run them as well. 2 years in buisness and 4000 sold, not because they don't work. Not to mention a JLT was on Bob Cosby's Cobra when he won the WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP in factory stock.

You shouldn't make statements that are not true or missleading.

If you have tested this kit, then the folks at SCT have some explaining to do as they are the only ones who have one until this week when they went on sale.

As far as dynoing, if I tuned the truck for no down shift you would call foul for tuning and that I didn't and did it without touching a thing you still call foul. You know this as well as do I. There will always be something to pick apart.

As for your very first statement, I have not said one bad or false statement about you or your company. Go back and read all my posts. I said it was unprofessional to say what you did without testing it. That's it. That's not a attack. What I think you may have read was others opninions of you and your tactics here in the past, not me.

Your call was missed do to we had to get out of the shop early today for some family time. It's nice to be able to do that sometimes.

I have no problem talking to you about this mess, as why I PM'ed you right away. I think if you re read all the posts that it's more the back and forth of the groupies then anything I personally have said toward you. Some poeple go through life looking for a fight and not believing everything they see and read. It's a shame.

I'm sure the moderators will have a field day with this post, but I'm just correcting some false statements.

Oh well, been here, done that and pulled through with flying colors.

Jay

 

Quite frankly, if you want any of the moderators, including myself, the owner of the site for nearly ten years, to give you any leniency with our posted site rules regarding vendors on the forums, I would strongly recommend you do not take public shots at them. I've already PM'd you with my intrepretation of your eariler posts. We are doing our job and we are protecting the interests of our site...in much in the same way you are doing with your product. The big difference, however, is this is my house and our advertisers pay the bills. If you have an issue with the way it is moderated or disagree with the rules, you can launch and discuss your new products elsewhere, simple as that. Comments like those above are offensive and uncalled for. Our moderators do a fantastic (and thankless) job around here.

 

No disrespect ment and my apologies.
What I was saying was I know the rules and by me backing JLT with all our accolades after MR. T's implied comments, I knew it might be deleted and that I understood.
I see that my intentions in that comment were not clear.
I think this got out of hand and I will watch the wording from this point on.

Jay

 

Thank you, Jay.

 

he doesn't have to-his customers witness them live @ dyno days-there's a reason his customers praise him--it's the respect we haved for him-my.02$

 

As so the satisfied JLT customers