If you were a dissatisfied customer, Why would you want to keep that a secret???



If most people feel that they bought a crap product, they usually want to tell the world about it.

I have never heard of this " Im unhappy and its top secret" behavior?

I think to put things in perspective......Maybe you shouldnt be asking why every one keeps dropping Troyers Name.

Instead, Maybe you should try to figure out why no one is mentioning any other Tuner vendors.......

 

I wondered if anyone would catch that!!


It will be a cold day in HELL before I will use my truck to beta test a programmer!

Keep watching the 04-06 forum.

The crying over there should be huge in a little while!

I can't wait until all these self proclaimed experts use the beta edge to do all these engine adjustments, not based on any datalogging, but a seat of the pants feel.

It should be better than the sunday comics.

 

Wow it has been a while for me to post, but I see nothing has changed. Sorry Mike and Marc for missing the dyno day in october. It would have been nice seeing u guys again. I have been on travel for it seems like forever. They had me in Glynco Ga, Quantico, San Diego, just to name a few. Me and Anita was playing phone tag and I never did get back with her to let her know I couldn't make it down to dyno day. I really wish I could've made it, but when duty calls. I know my truck needs some fine tuning so maybe next time, although next year I was told was going to be worse next year. Like I said though I see nothing has changed, Raider is still up to his usual, which is actually good, I guess. I applaud him for speaking his mind and opinions. I can respect that. But to get back to the original question that kippy wanted to know:

Well kippy back in september my f150 supercrew 5.4 was a test truck just for that reason. It was stock all but the true dual exhaust and just a drop in kn air filter. The stock dyno was in the 210-218 range I believe, I'm at work now so don't have the data. The Hypertech was in the 220-225 range, and Mikes tune jumped it to 270's I believe. Now that is HP, the torque was the hypertune was in the 250's and Mikes jumped it to the 290's 300 range. That was proof enough for me. I know when I left Mike wasn't happy with the air fuel ratio but I had to leave, I had the wife with me and she wanted to go. That's why I was planning to go back in October so Mike could fine tune it. So as far as the difference between the different programmers, I can tell you first hand that Mikes blows the hypertech away. Mike you can correct my numbers if they are wrong, like I said I don't have my data sheet here at work, but I don't think they are far off. Mikes customer service is great, he knew I wanted to make it to the dyno day, and Anita tried several times to contact me, but I couldn't return any calls where I was at. So I give Mike Troyer and his staff a big thumbs up and would recommend them anytime, to anybody. I hope this helps you out Kippy.

 

I would like to add a few things:

First, there is no such thing as a “secret” dissatisfied customer. If someone wishes to remain anonymous then great but they don’t count as “satisfied” or “dissatisfied” but rather just naïve…

Second, are there other tuners? You bet there are at least 3 or 4 who are supporting vendors here on F150online. However, and to my knowledge, other then Mike I don’t think the others have experience with your regular F150’s but rather specialize in Lightning’s.

Are Lightning’s different then your normal F150? I would say, in my inexperienced opinion, yes they are. They have a supercharger, and do not have any functioning knock sensors. Therefore they are on a different level of tuning then your normal F150.

With that said, Mike has many years experience with your normal F150’s as well as Lightning’s.

Finally, is there any conclusive evidence that one tuner is better then another? Not really, there is really only one way to get some factual data that would give some decent evidence and that would be for 3 or 4 identically prepared trucks, with different tunes, running the ¼ mile. Would have to be the same day with the same driver with at least 3 runs each and then you could average and compare ¼ time slips.

Actually the most important aspect of a great tune is not that it provides a few more horsepower over another tune from someone else but rather is the tune reliable. Does it have flaws, does it cause problems, how many years experience does the tuner have with your particular vehicle and finally, what type of customer service do they provide.

Now I have no evidence that shows Mike’s tune will indeed provide more or less horsepower over another tuner so for arguments sake lets say his tunes provide the same horsepower gains as another. The only questions left to ask is how many years experience does the other tuner have and how is their customer service? In the end that’s the most important aspect of a tune which is WHO actually provided it…

Don’t just look at a max horsepower number to determine if one tuner is better then another because that will never give you the complete story. Some tuners will run a motor on the very edge for a number. You want to get as much horsepower as you can “safely” so that your motor remains reliable for years and not a few runs down the ¼ mile. It’s not about a max number but what is “under” the curve as well as the A/F reading. A good solid tune is much more then just a max horsepower number…

If you want a good solid tune, many years experience with F150’s and great customer service then Mike would be the one.

 

boy you guys are sad, raider gets you guys going everytime

if I was a unhappy customer do you think I would post it up here on the forums to make it public? maybe the customers he mentioned contacted the tuner and maybe they still didnt get the results they wanted, why would they need to make there name public after that? just because they dont post up there bad results doesn't mean that there isnt unhappy customers

 

slowduck,

You’re absolutely correct with your statement about unhappy customers. The fact is every single business, including tuners, will always have a few, or sometimes many, unhappy customers.

That is just reality and it will never change. Nobody will ever have 100% satisfied customers. However what you really have to question is two things. First, did that business try everything they could to make things right, to work with an unhappy customer and try to make them happy? Second, are the customer’s expectations in line with reality?

The last one may seem off base but I can tell you from just some personal experiences of my own that in many cases customers are unhappy just due to their unrealistic expectations. You could take “tuning” for an example. While many understand you will never get a tune to take a 16 second ¼ mile vehicle and make it a 12 second ¼ vehicle there will always be a few who for some reason think that is possible, or something close. Or there may be people who expect a tune to get them a 12 second ¼ mile running pump gas and improving their mpg by 2 – 3 mpg.

Some unrealistic comments above for sure, but there are and will always be a few who expect much more then what they are actually paying for or that is possible.

The same could be said about some car buyers who purchase a Focus and expect it to perform and ride like a BMW. Not going to happen, that’s life, that’s reality.

So for anyone to have creditability, at least in my book, as an unsatisfied customer AND then have someone else use them as an example need to give us the “details”, ALL the details, so others can make an informed decision. Doesn’t that make perfect sense, of course it does.

I could be a dissatisfied customer if I had a tune and then expected to speak to Mike in the middle of the night, or 2:00am in the morning regarding my tuning device. I could think well I spent my money I gave him my money so he had better speak to me at 2:00am when I expect him to. I could then tell another person I am dissatisfied with Mike but not to use my name or what happen. All anyone would know is there is a “dissatisfied” customer out there in the dark.

There are ALWAYS two sides to a person’s dissatisfaction, the customer and the business in question. So unless both story’s can be told, unless the facts can be brought out the unsatisfied customer is most likely looking for unrealistic results and knows it…

 

And it does not mean there is either.

We can sit here and talk about these fantasy customers all day.

You claimed in a previous post that you are a customer and have the right to your opinion.

I ask again, HAVE YOU EVER BOUGHT ANYTHING FROM TROYER??

Are your posts based on this legion of fearful fantasy customers, actual experience, or just trolling the board to pass time??

If you just want to BS thats cool, but this invisible customer show is getting sillier by the minute.

If you really have some sort of problem with Troyer, why not call him??

I know I sure would if he had me as irritated as you apparently are.

Hiding behind a keyboard is a great thing, but its amazing how docile these people become when brought out into the open.

 

```

 

wtf u talking about harbor? I never said I had a problem with anyone, or are you talking to raider?

 

I disagree, any time anyone says anything even remotely seen as negative about MT on this forum they get jumped on and called all kinds of names. I am a TP customer, I have an Xcal2 and AF1, and while I feel they improved the performance of my truck there are probably other tuners out there that can do similar upgrades. I thought the original post was asking to post dynos or some sort of "proof" other than just opinion, that TP was the way to go. So far all that has been done is a gang tackle of anyone that doesn't see TP as the ONLY way to go all while just using opinion or seat of the pants performance. Now, I realize there are too many variables in how a truck will dyno given temp, elevation etc, to really make any 2 seperate dynos from different trucks usefull. But has anyone had different tuners on the same truck w/o any other mods and had them dyno'd? I don't have any problems at all with my tuner, but in hindsight I wouldn't have bought a tuner at all- from anyone. For the cost of the tuner, dyno time, laptop PC to datalog(if you don't have a Windows PC), we're talking $1200-1400 for 40 or so HP?

 

good post wheelerfreak

 

Why do you guys respond to their crap????

Is there other tuners here capable of besting Troyer....maybe!

One question.....why don't they post here? To dam busy to take the time and try and help future customers. That pretty much was the deciding factor for me. Some guys call it advertising....I call it an incredible work ethic dedicating ones self to customer service, support and sales. Nothing wrong with being a salesman if you dedicate yourself to the product your selling.

TROYER takes the time to post here not the OTHERS and there isn't an excuse that I care to hear as to why they don't.

 

Is there a better, cheaper, safer way to make 40 hp?

The people that consistently get bashed are the same people in all of the threads. They come looking for an argument and they get it. I'm sure there has been an unsuspecting person who posted a legitimate question and was jumped by an overzealous TP fan but that is not the norm!

 

I think that you have to look at the whole picture of which tuner to get and just not numbers. If you want to look just at horsepower numbers then I am sure someone can show you a number and it will look impressive. There are many things to consider and how much do you have to spend is probably a big part of the decision. You don't want to waste your hard earned money.

I only have the X-Cal1 as a mod and got it from Troyer. It improved throttle response and shifting is much firmer now. I did not do a lot of research for others but TP was not much more than some other tuners. The biggest reason I chose TP was customer service. Being able to talk to somebody about questions I have is a big plus. I also appreciate the fact that Mike answers a whole bunch of questions on this forum. Any other suppliers doing that in this forum??? I can imagine some debates if there was.

The most important thing is to get the tuner/mod that YOU want and fits YOUR needs. My truck is a daily driver and for right now just need the tuner. I want to do more but the Chief of Financial Planning says not now. I am fine with that.

Bottom line is to get what you think is best for you.

Kevin

 

Not quite true.

I have yet to see anyone provide any sort of proof when they bash Troyer.

If you read the posts it is all based on conjecture and innuendo.

I have asked repetedly for any sort of concrete information of any sort of bad experience with Troyer performance and received none.

I have yet to see anyone jump on a legitamate Troyer customer with a gripe.

I fail to see why it should be ok to come here and bash any company you have no experience with.

Fair is fair, and its ok to have a opinion but don't you think is should be based on the truth and not fairy tales???

Why try to ruin a guys rep when you aren't even a customer???