I imagine that his 'problem' was that he took offense to the wholesale child abuser stamp that you've painstakingly fashioned and attempted to post squarely on anyone who spanks their kids. Considering that's about the craziest thing I've ever heard, that'd be my guess.

Although he can't 'speak for everyone', he CAN speak for himself. Last time I checked, he doesn't have to get your approval to disagree with you or even quote you. Ain't America great?

So, now it's wrong to even disagree with you? Perfect. Makes sense.

 

Yea, I'm defensive. I'll fight for someone who can't yet.

 

If that had merit he would not have quoted me. When it comes to abusing kids, - you can't make that right by me. Try to brush it off all you want, - reach here and there, it's just wrong and your not going to make it right. No matter how you try to twist it.

 

*taking the gloves off...THIS 'beating' I WILL enjoy!*

We agree again! There's no doubt in me. I absolutely DO believe that God has EVERYTHING to do with parenting! And since you obviously do too, let's talk about that aspect for a moment, shall we?

Since you believe in God and his direction for raising kids, I'm guessing you also believe the Bible. Ever read it? I have. LOTS of times! Wanna know what the Bible has to say about corporal punishment? Sure! Here are just a few tidbits:

Prov 13:24: "He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes (diligently)."
Prov 19:18: "Chasten thy son while there is hope, and let not thy soul spare for his crying."
Prov 22:15: "Foolishness is bound in the heart of a child; but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him."
Prov 23:13: "Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die."
Prov 23:14: "Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell (Shoel)."
Prov 29:15: "The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to shame."

And Solomon's writings were actually translated as 'beat' or 'beating'!

There are more, but I assume you're quite adept at using the google search function.

I'll 'cross post' if I damn-well please! If you don't like it, stop contradicting yourself! You really are making this way too easy!

Aha! I was wondering when you'd pull out the name-calling. 'Dirt bag' and 'low-life bastard', eh? That's right, when you're argument runs dry, fling that mud! Very intelligent of you!

I refuse to stoop.

 

No worries, you covered that.

Might wanna put those gloves back on, - protect that slapping hand. Heaven forbid.

 

No problem man, you read me wrong and I wasn't too clear. I didn't know what you were saying by the behind closed doors comment, and as I tend to do went off into my own thing. Didn't mean for you to feel like that was an attack. With my buddy, the mom at walmart, future BIL and so on, they need the whoopin, not their misbehaving kids. Their kids are just looking for attention. I'm in the middle on this whole thing, I don't want to spank my kids, but
if a need arose, they would get spanked. At this point I cannot define what that need would be. I can't speak for everyone, nor can I speak against others who do spank their kids. There are those who spank and it's
effective, and there are those who spank and it's not effective, same with time outs. I certainly
don't feel like I have all the answers. I started reading this with the thought "what would I do if I were him?" And seeking answers myself. Unfortunately the subtopic of spanking has taken over, which I stand guilty of taking part in. I see both sides on this and chose no sides.

 

Thanks, sorry, thought that was towards me.

 

There is a difference.
I got my fair share of whippings when I was a kid ( that I rightfully deserved ) but my dad never abused me.
I only got a whipping ( and manual labor grounded for a month at a time ) when I did something wrong. There was a section this was the norm, but I was falling off the tracks.

When I finished what I was supposed to do ( chores & school work ) I got to ride my bike and play with my friends. What are considered the normal things as a kid.
If I did something additional I got a small reward ( as in a trip to DQ for a cone ). I did not qualify for this very often, but it was from my actions, not dad's lack of actions.

This is not abuse, and to call it that is an insult and minimizes children that really are abused ( get a beating just for waking up, or burned with a lit cigar ).

I have a clear idea of what abuse really looks like, and what others are describing here is not abuse.
- Think back to the PM chain and what we could not find in your area.

Please do not minimize what they go through by calling what happened to me as a thick headed youth the same thing.

You can try to.
Dad started this way with me, but by time I reached the age of basic reasoning and logic ( ~ 5 or 6 I would guess ) he had to step up the method used, as it was not getting in my thick skull.

By time I was 13, I learned not to do wrong things.
I mean not do, not just don't get caught.

 

Surprised this is still going.


I'm gonna jump in here and side with Brew on this one.

And Dewser... If the first time you saw your dad cry was out of remorse for spanking you, don't you think there is something to be said for that? Feeling so wrong about something that it brings a grown man to tears afterwards is what you are arguing.

Here's the thing, the biggest problem with physically disciplining your child is there is no way to draw the line between right and wrong when everyone has there own interpretation of it. And one instants may be worse than the other or one time get out of hand. Who is to decide that? That is why the system has grown so much toward preventing/stopping any child abuse. There is no way to tell between who is just swatting their kid on the butt or someone who is outright abusing their kids until it is too late. Even to one parent who has only layed a few butt swats down in a childs entire life may someday lose it and decide to take it a step further when the butt swat is not working. And no body can control the amount of anger someone has while spanking their kid.

What is the purpose of "innocent" spanking that all of you are arguing anyways...
To teach a child right from wrong by physically causing pain. And don't forget the verbal abuse/damage and negative body language incorporated with the spanking. You can't say you just call them over, smile and say im going to spank you now for what you did....no. The fact is that you go stomping across the room saying crap like "I told you not to do that, why don't you listen" *whack* All that to strike fear into a defenseless kid. I mean that's what makes it work right? For them to fear you and the consequences related to whatever it is you are teaching them. I don't agree with that.


I spanked my daughter one time when she was 2 years old because she was throwing an out of control fit and it seemed I had tried everything to control the situation but nothing was working. So out of arrogance and as a last ditch effort I thought a good swat on the butt will work. It worked but the fact that right afterwards she looked at me like I had just broke her spirit was enough for me to never do it again. She wouldnt even come near me for the rest of the day.

There are other ways to teach a child something in positive ways. But it takes more time and effort to be effective vs spanking which stops the child in it's tracks. So, those of you who are lazy and or lack the capacity to use positive things to teach them right from wrong are going to spank their kids.

 

Outstanding post, and I simply couldn't agree more!

 

I've never felt the need to resort to that. It makes me sick just thinking about it. I've realize where one could, and hell, life's full of challenges. You don't HAVE TO send the message through bodily harm to get it across. It's a choice you alone are responsible for. There's better ones; that one in particular didn't exist growing up and/or in my own household once I got there. No, it wasn't always easy, but it was accomplished successfully.

I think it's terrible, wrong and absolutely unnecessary. Some make it sound so casual and just. Makes me puke Scully.

 

In my case growing up, yes it did HAVE TO.
Took many years to sink in to not do bad things.
- Actually not do them, not 'try to not get caught' doing bad things.

Again this is not abuse.
To try to say I was abused, you might as well say I was zebra'd.
Both are a misapplication of the word used in the sentence.

Something that makes me puke; trying to equate that disciplining children is the same thing that abused children go through.

Night and day is not enough of a polar opposite to this comparison.

 

Physical abuse is an act of another party involving contact intended to cause feelings of physical pain, injury, or other physical suffering or bodily harm.

There isn't a line in the sand.

 

Instead of using the time to try to convince me that the discipline that I got as a child is the same thing as abuse, spend that time locating the topic in that PM chain we had. Make some calls to your county, and locate it.

I would say no more than 5 hours up close and personal, will make you think how silly it is to call the two the same thing.

To call discipline ( actual discipline ) abuse is minimizing what abused children ( and wives ) go through on a daily basis.

DO NOT minimize what abused children and wives go through.

 

I don't need to do that. I was raised, kids are just about there. Hit,slap, punch and kick free.. Over.

So, the definition is incorrect and should be changed ? Is that what your trying to say?

Of course there's many forms of it, no brainer; I'm not stupid, - I really hope not. Confident enough with it that I don't need to call every Tom, Dank and Sally to figure that one out.

So, a little abuse is just fine correct? What level would that be? Level 1 perhaps? Is there a rating ?

Not by definition, not that I see. Rather, -it spells it out, simply.