Remember my earlier example of the dog that gets smacked around? And one of my posts waaay earlier that defined terrorism and what it does?

This is the effect... Yeah, it creates bias and hate and discontent... It's what the extremists want... For us to hate Muslims, so they have a better reason to tell their followers to kill us...

And it is working! But at what point to we lay down arms and get ran over? Just because that stray dog looks friendly and hasn't attacked you yet doesn't mean that he never will... It all goes back to trust, and the extremists have destroyed that though terrorism... We can be as understanding and tolorent as the next guy, but that doesn't mean we can ever stop being vigilant about our safety and security.

I wish it wasn't like this... That world peace would dominate... But it hasn't, therefore, we have to look out for our own... If America went to hell in a handbasket overnight, plunged into total chaos, would you not do anything to
keep your kids fed? Would you kill a complete stranger, so your kids can have that scrap of food that you found that he wants? Would you let said stranger put you or your families lives at risk?

 

Longshot

You just made a statement about me that I never said: I NEVER said that I thought that every Muslim was a terrorist. You completely fabricated that.
What I did say was that if they claim to be a true muslim, then they will not speak out against acts of terror. Doesn't mean that every turban wearing man is plotting to drive his bomb-laden car into a WalMart, it simply means that they are living among us, working with us every day, in quiet support of their religious counterparts carrying out attacks against anyone who doesn't profess the Islam faith. I found the perfect example that night at WalMart; a guy that I had been in school with for 2 years. At first glance, he was very appealing, loving, and caring, but behind that smile and love was an approval of acts such as 9/11. He would not condemn the killing of innocent Americans when I asked him to; he would only smile at me. (and yes he is fluent in English, so don't try and start any BS about how I was intollerant of his native language or that he did not understand me)

I don't know about you, but I just don't care to live among people like this who approve of their radical Islam affiliators killing people like me. I don't wish him dead...I just wish they would go 'do that over there, not over here.'
If they wish to do that over here, then I am all for hitting them 1,000 times harder than they hit us.

 

Sorry people but I need to interrupt this program one last time, promise.

TUMBA, you must have a low opinion of people if you think they're your equals but I understand you, (even though millions don't) you have an inferiority complex.... and it's fully justified.

I suggest "we" stop derialing this thread. Any more snide remarks you may have to direct at me, please use my PM box or e-mail address, and then I will do the same.

Thank you,

Seriously, guy… stop it!

Leonardo

Back to our scheduled program.

 

Thanks OG, to reinforce, Not directed to 98Lariet4x4 and 98_Green, guys we are having a REAL discussion. Either get with the program or leave. Anyone can post some juvenial picture off google or resort to mudslinging but try coming up with solid arguement like Lariet has time and time again.

So are you fine with playing into their hand? I never said we trade our guns for teddy bears. True, Americans will not be able to trust all Muslims until the extremists have been erradicted but blind hatred is only going to help breed more hatred. That has been prooven time and time again. I didn't say we forget security, I'm all for heigher border security and down here I wish there were more. But what I am addressing is the blind label of "Muslim = EVIL!!!" That simply is not true for everyone. I sure do believe in kill or be killed but that is under the premise you can spot your enemy. Green was saying ALL muslims are an enemy because the enemies cannot be picked from the innocent. Would you kill an innocent person to protect you family, even if they were not a threat? We are getting side tracked a bit. I'm not talking about KILLING anyone. If you can prove that someone is a threat, have at it! Fry 'em, dont throw them in prison. But how do you decide if they are a threat?
Let me go back to something I posted earlier.
When we look at this, a good muslim desires to improve themselves. The last part shows where jihad is used for violence. All they see is a bunch of Americans saying "we dont want you here, so get the he// out...btw, you worship a false god." If you still wanted to live in America, the greatest country in the world, wouldn't you want to improve the society to create a friendlier environment for you and your family? They have no foothold to improve society here without encountering massive resistance. The muslims in the middle east see us as attacking the poor and vulnerable so they retaliate in whatever way they can. Did you know one of the strategies they are using is fight the Americans, run out of ammo, surrender as a POW. Many of these POWs get released. They then tell others the "atrocities and corruption" of the American government. How easily could you hit a muslim you obviously dislike on the basis they are muslim in a warzone? One hit and just like here in America by whiney people wanting to sue others, that is going to be called abuse.

Answer this question green. Is there a difference between an enemy and a terrorist? They both want to cause as much disruption and destruction as possible. You dont want to be living next to either one, but when I change to a more polarizing word things change? You already said that to you EVERY muslim was an enemy. Are you going to deny something you have said and I have quoted multiple times?

I have seen many members on this forum get into nasty arguments with OGTerror for not believing in God. There have been wars over who's god is better. You tell them they have a false god and then get upset when they retaliate?

I have talked to muslims about how this topic. The ones I talked to do NOT agree with the radicals. They (the radicals) take the fundamentals and apply them not for the greater good but for destruction and pain. If I were a Jewish person saying all following the Christian faith are like Hitler and want to exterminate the Jews. You are a Christian, Adolf Hitler was a Catholic. Both have the same God but I'd hope you would not say, "Yeah, me an' 'ol Hitler are like two peas in a pod!"

The guy encountered at Walmart should probably be on a suspect list if he isn't already. I have never met him so he might be the twisted character you make him out to be. I do know that not ALL are like that. Innaccurate blanket statements such as yours are EXACTLY what helps persuade people to be violent. Earlier there was a comparison made that if you hit a dog it will be more likely to bite. Christians have been fighting them for hundreds of years. They have been fighting Christians for hundreds of years. Hit a dog and it bites back. You are only helping the circle of hit and bite, then hit harder because you got bit. We've already covered this aswell, what is it called when you do the same thing over and over but expect different results?

BTW, I'm NOT referring to building a mosque at ground zero as being a decent action on their part because that is a bunch rich people wanting to **** other people off...otherwise they wouldn't be planning on opening it on the 10th anniversary of the bombing.

 

My sincerest apologies to the people participating in this thread. I will not interfere anymore, unless I have something on the relevance of this thread.

Sorry the thread got derailed early on , and I then contributed to that.:o

But, Is it really true, that this Mosque is to be dedicated on 9/11?

 

Sadly I think it is. I have read various articles and they all seem to say that.

 

It's a pretty good idea... on paper.
The trouble is how do you keep the sneaky "evil doing" Muslims from mingling in with the good group of Muslims?

I like the idea, if nothing else it would show the world that they are speaking out against terror etc, but then again, who would want to be the spokesperson for that group? It would be like putting a gigantic bullseye on your back.

"Gihad Joe" would strike that dude and his family down so fast, all in the name of Allah because he would feel betrayed by his own people.

It's a tough situation and the only way to truly defeat ignorance is through knowledge. We have a hard time doing that here in our own countries (Canada & USA) where we have everything going for us, and still we have loads of ignoramus's with their hateful and bigotted beliefs living among us.

Look at these KKK and white supremist groups still active today right here in our own countries. I don't know the answer, but at least we're taling about it and thinking about it.

It's a start.

After rereading everything in this thread, and looking over Green's comments about wanting them all to leave etc, I get a sense (and maybe i'm wrong) those words were written out of frustration more than anything else, and that deep down he even knows its not the solution. (knee-jerk reaction)

Sure, we could kick out all the muslims, then the blacks, then the mexicans, then where does it stop?
Next thing you'll be kicking out the Canadian's, and that's where I have to put my foot down.
We don't have any Cracker Barrel's here, and you ****'s arnt gonna deprive me of my chicken and dumpling, f--- that, lol

 

Religious zeal, (especially between Muslims and Christians) has all too frequently and unfortunately propelled men into violent conflict, unleashing barbaric cruelty. The world's history is littered with the corpses of those slain because of their religious differences.

As you can see, religious hatred and conflict still festers and continue to threaten the security of the entire world with their religious/power/territorial wars. Every generation has many religious martyrs willing to die horrible deaths for their various gods, convinced that their death in a holly war guaranties a special place in heaven.

Take for example, in 1985 President Reagan even referred to the Bible to support his military Budget citing the New Testament passage of Luke 14:31 to shore up his argument for strong defense against the Soviets.

A Biblical view of reality is solidly behind the "Armageddon Theology beliefs" being taught in churches across the nation in that Christ will not return until after Word War III. This final, inevitable war is prophesied in Scripture, thus arms negotiations are useless. In fact, anyone attempting to prevent WWIII could be the "AntiChrist", or working for Satan.

How many Americans actually believe this? Sadly, literally tens of millions! These are Americans who might have worked to bring peace to this planet, but who are now almost silently hoping that Armageddon (the end of the world as prophesied in the Bible) will come in their lifetime so that they can experience the second coming of Jesus.

As I have stated here a few times, I support a world free from superstition, from irrational religious guilt, from unreasoning fears of hell and damnation, from religious bigotry, intolerance and oppression, and from religious wars.

 

That in itself is a morale outrage. There is hardly room for denial by the people in charge of selecting that date, that it is intended to inflame the US citizens.

Religion may be the guise of this happening. But History proves, there will always be an enemy of one form or another. Just as in the Crusades. The Church sent the war to the Middle East , just to keep the people from fighting among themselves.

 

That's been my opinion all along - if they build the mosque there, so be it (but I don't like it one bit). But, dedicating it on the 10th anniversary of 9/11 is just WRONG WRONG WRONG. That's just rubbing our noses in it.

 

Yup, me too. And that's where this thread should have stayed...discussing this point. Not bringing all this religion crap into it. There are plenty of Muslim houses of worship. To put one near ground zero is bad enough. But HUMAN DECENCY should tell them that the opening of this particular mosque should not be on 9/11.

 

The only reason that date has been selected (IMHO) is to unite a group of people. That is a very obvious observation.

10 years, it doesn't seem that long.

 

You mean...to stir up a group of people. No good can come from this. There will be animosity and riots and who knows what else.

 

Lets hope it don't go that far. It would be better to take one on the chin, just to prove we are better people than they are. As sickening as it may be, it would be better to ignore them. If they can't get us Irate, it would more or less be a defeat to them.

 

It would be such a shame if there were some kind gas leak in the building!!