Wow those post are long I couldn't read them all but I get the idea! lol

Og, Sorry to hear you how you were treated at the religious school by the teachers. I'm no cop or psychologist but that sounds like child abuse and probably explains why you feel the way you do about God.

The only thing I can suggest is not to confuse the message with the messenger. Those same teachers that punished you to an extreme for nothing probably also taught you the sky is blue and 2+2=4 and I don't see you rejecting those truths.

As far as hypocrites I am sure they were and it was literally painfully obvious to you. In fact you will not find any person that I know of to not be a hypocrite in some way. Christians are no different although some try harder than others everyone comes up short and some come up completely wanting with others just pretending to be. None of those people can offer salvation though. My belief is only Jesus can. So I try not to focus on everyone else because sooner or later they will let you down even if its unintentional.


Here is my take on this and I hope a decent analogy. So, if as a Christian you believe that God created the heavens and the earth then the world is his to do with as he pleases then it is very much like modding a truck. You may not like what I did, you may do it different and you may think I did it wrong but as many have said on here many times to others, it's your truck and if you like it it dont matter. I've seen people do things to there trucks on here and think they are nuts but then after they make a few more changes and tie things in it looks great. Parts come off and go on and some that are replaced were perfectly good and some might have been broken and need replacing. My point being if God did create the universe who am I to question what happens in it or why he does or does not do things. He alone knows where it is going and can see the big picture. I guess that is where faith comes in on my part.

It appears to me and my limited knowledge from psychology 101 that you are trying to reconcile things. I hope you get it all worked out and find the answers you are looking for!

 

Well, now that you bring up that ONE verse in the Bible that really impacts on how to live your life; I too, have one that has always impacted my life even though I am instructed to disregard the Old Testament. That one phrase the angels instructed Lot to follow after his wife was left behind as a pillar of salt while "GOD" rained fire and brimstone upon his creation in the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah killing men women, children, the unborn, animals, plants and destroying homes.

"When they had brought them outside, one said, Escape for your life! Do not look behind you, and do not stay anywhere in the valley; escape to the mountains, or you will be swept away. (Genesis 19:17)

Escape for your "own" life, that is what I had to do when I escape my aggressors and was forced to abandon my families and friends. It is now my life's philosophy and I truly abide by said code.

Guess reading the Bible wasn't bad after all.

 

Next time you're going to be in the Phoenix, AZ, area, drop me a PM and I can fix that for you.

 

I got chewed out once when I was a kid for quoting from the RSV. The reason was if the KJV was good enough for Jesus and the Apostles, it should be good enough for me. Yeesh!

 

Thanks for the invite.

Challenge accepted

 

I did a quick search in a Bible program I have and came up with ziltch. I would really like to find out where that comes from (just from a curiosity standpoint; I'm from Missouri--really, I am--and like to verify things).

I love the song about the Mississippi Squirrel! It's on a disk in my truck.

 

Hmmm, Religion has had me asking questions all my life. And the more I learn, the more questions I have. The worst part of an education is it reveals how ignorant one really is.

 

Are you sure Jesus didn't speak Spanish? Cause everything Jesus said in my Bible he said it in Spanish.

Double check on that and lemme know.

 

I'm sure you already know but for the benefit of those who don't, He spoke Aramaic and, possibly, Hebrew. English and Spanish didn't come around for quite a few more years, to understate it a bit.

 

Yes I know I was being facetious..

 

Yeah, but I had to play with the bait a bit.

 

Not only that, I also think you were being facetious.

I admit my bible knowledge is minischool but, I've picked up the pace as I got older.
It's a trick I learned in college, craming for my Finals.

 

No need to completely disregard the Old Testament, we can learn from it, you just don't have to follow everything in it to get to be saved.

 

What is faith? According to this definition:
Faith is hope for a circumstance or thing that is not proven to be true. How could there be virtue in accepting something on faith since it may very well be false. Isn't it clear that it is not virtuous to believe the false?

Here is my take, having had the opportunity to weigh both sides of the spectrum between religion and science, faith has only proven to be an intellectual weakness, and a significant barrier to scientific and moral progress. Through our history faith has proven equivalent to massive hysteria such as crusades, burning times, inquisitions, holy Wars, and the list goes on and on. How can God possibly expect us to view faith as the greatest way to glorify him, let alone demand this of us.

The most important point to remember here though, is that if we don’t believe in him, we go to Hell, and this is a greater evil than a lack of the "virtue" of faith or a stunting of science, or anything else conceivable. If God is truly concerned about the good, he will do what he can to keep us from Hell. Don't you think that withholding vital information from us is the exact opposite of this.

"God is the Alpha and the Omega". Loosely defined, it means the beginning and the end, the all knowing. This of course, implies that all of his actions and the results are fore known to him. I have a real problem with this notion. For if God was to know ahead of time my suffering as a child and then someday he would send me to hell for for lack of faith, I ask what was the purpose in him creating me in the first place? Was it simply to watch me be tortured again and again and then again? I can't think of any other logical or rational explanation, neither has any Christian who I posed this question to.

Some people have attempted to tell me that God has a purpose unknown to us, and that we must simply accept his will. Would you keep a friend who commits evil and offers no self-justification or remorse? Of course not, so why is this same judgment not applied to God? It’s seems rather contradictory that this trait is despised in humanity, yet, it is worshiped in all religions.

"God" is endowed by his followers with all of the following attributes: He is eternal, all-powerful, and created everything. He created all the laws of nature and can change anything by an act of will. He is all-good, all-loving, and perfectly just. He is a personal God who experiences all of the emotions a human does. He is all-knowing. He sees everything past and future.
God's creation was originally perfect, but humans, by disobeying him, brought imperfection into the world. Humans are evil and sinful, and must suffer in this world because of their sinfulness. God gives humans the opportunity to accept forgiveness for their sin, and all who do will be rewarded with eternal bliss in heaven, but while they are on earth, they must suffer for his sake. All humans who choose not to accept this forgiveness must go to hell and be tormented for eternity.

In the event anyone gets offended by my insisting on questioning authority, I may now ask you for your forgiveness.

Thank you.

Okay, now that I have gotten that out of the way, I will ask: What did God do during that eternity before he created everything? If God was all that existed back then, what disturbed the eternal equilibrium and compelled him to create? Was he bored? Was he lonely? God is supposed to be perfect. If something is perfect, it is complete--it needs nothing else.

We humans engage in activities because we are pursuing that elusive perfection, because there is disequilibrium caused by a difference between what we are and what we want to be. If God is perfect, there can be no disequilibrium. There is nothing he needs, nothing he desires, and nothing he must or will do. A God who is perfect does nothing except exist.

"A perfect creator God" doesn't exist.

 

Yeah facetious too just don't tell everybody.

Do you know anymore tricks? Good boy, now sit.