Well said man

 

Fixed it. Although, I'd want a ZF6 behind it....

 

Where its made is insignificant? Wrong Genius. How about we lay off all American automobile workers and send the jobs to Mexico? I'm sure labor is cheap over there and Americans really don't need jobs.

The Ford Fusion has only 30 percent American part content, compared to a Camry's 85+ percent American content.

The money won't stay in the US if you buy the Fusion, it will go back into Mexico where its assembled, to provide work and food for the Mexican family and support their local economy. It will help give jobs to those foreign countries that supply the 70 percent of its imported parts. It will also help pay the wages of those super rich CEO's at FORD which doesn't give 2 ****s about you. At least when you buy a Camry, the money is being used to pay the wages of the AMERICAN workers who assemble it, and AMERICAN workers and companies that provide the 85+ percent of its AMERICAN parts, supporting OUR Economy and giving American jobs.

 

Another thing to think about....

Ford is targetting the Fusion against the Camry correct? They want to take sales away from Toyota.

Toyota employs Americans to build the Camry, and relies on American Companies for its 85+ percent parts, which again, employs Americans and uses American resources..all those Americans are going to put their money right back into this country.

Ford employs Mexicans to build the Fusion, and relies on foreign countries to supply the majority of its parts (only 30 percent is American) which employs foreign workers at foreign factories making the parts, and uses foreign resources. All those Mexicans and foreign workers are going to put their money right back into THEIR country, NOT AMERICA.

So in reality, Ford is trying to take Jobs and Money away from America by pushing the Fusion on us.

 

Say what you want, but Ford and GM invest far more money in America than Toyota does.
One fact you forget to mention is that the majority of the vehicles Toyota sells are not made in the United States and no matter how many of the parts in a Camry are American, its still not an American car.

 

I posted this thread because I hear a lot of people talking about Toyota trucks- not all are even seasoned truck owners- just people who would like to own a truck some day. Yeah, the marketing is working- people are becoming hooked on a vehicle that hasnt even had the bugs worked out.

I personally would probably always own a Ford truck. There is a little bit of prestige to owning an American Icon.

 

AMEN !!!!

A friend of mine has a father-in-law who is an automatic transmission mechanic. We were installing a FTVB in his Lightning and Jim was telling us how almost every Toyota he works on has MAJOR sludge buildup in the transmission. He said if you own one, you are crazy to drop the pan and service it after 30,000 miles. He guarantees you will be paying a shop like his to repair it...

I've owned nothing but Fords since 1986 - a '86 Mustang, a '87 Ranger, 2 Taurus wagons, 1998 extended-cab F-150, '01 'Screw and my current ride, an '04 Lightning. Had to fix the A/C in the Mustang in 1994 (8 years and 158,000 miles on the car); had to replace the tranny in the Ranger (work truck) after 160,000 miles; NOTHING done to either Taurus (60,000 on each before lease return); nothing on the '98 F-150 (traded with 65,000); replaced the water temp sending unit on the 'Screw (warranty) and traded it with 63,000 on the clock. My L just turned 70,000 yesterday - no visits to the shop for anything...

My point is that, across both the car / truck platform, I've had very few problems with my Fords.

Americans have only themselves to blame for what has happened to the manufacturing industries here.

Letting Wall Street investors dictate expected returns on investments created the "build it elsewhere" scenario we now live with.

Uneducated consumers making purchases with skewed information (Toyota is perfect / USA made is junk) has furthered the decline of American business.

Shopping for the cheapest price is just starting to show how expensive it truly is...

WantsAHemi - You are a tool. Instead of frequenting an F-150 site, go hang out on whatever site you are really interested in. The fact you have bought into the marketing hype that is the Hemi shows too well you do not have the mental faculties to do battle with the folks who frequent this forum.

If the "hemi" head is so great, why doesn't the SRT-10 engine have it ? Isn't that the mighty Mopar flagship engine ??

Don't get me wrong - the hemi head is a good design. Ford actually made one in the 60's that stomped the snot out of the Mopar version in power output, on pump gas. But, it takes more than a hemi head design (which, by the way, current Mopars do NOT have true, classic hemi heads) to make a great vehicle.

 

Well, say what you like- but Toyota is a solid company, and they built great vehcles.

Call them plain, call them ugly, call them plain ugly- but they still sell.

50:1, or 1,000,000:1 (which no car sells at a rate equal to), they still sell.

I like Ford's too, but let's take the medicine. If Toyota gave away Tundra's the way Ford gives away F-150's, you'd see a lot more of them. I got my last F-150 for $10,000 off sticker. I got my 2003 Expedition EB for $13,000 off sticker, and my 2000 Expedition for $9,000 off sticker. A far cry from the mere $2,000 I got off sticker on my 1999.

When was the last time you ever heard of anyone getting $10,000 off sticker on a Toyota? Call me when you do: 1-800-BULL-SH*T. The fact the Toyota, Honda, and to a lesser extent Nissan don't have to "gift wrap" their products, speaks volumes for why they are doing better as a company. Nissan was swirling the bankrupcy drain a few years ago. Enter Carlos Ghosn, and a few sweet new models, and bingo...

So yes, with a price range of $11,995 - $40,000 Ford offers a truck for every budget. Toyota doesn't. So, based upon selection, you're gonna see more Ford's. Toyota will probably never sell more Tundra's than Ford sells F-150's... But, that will not stop Toyota from making more money, taking the #1 auto manufacturer slot, and having enough cash on hand three years ago, to outright buy GM.

Toyota will probably never buy Ford or GM, simply because of the UAW, and their saddlement with all that overhead from retirement benefits.

 

The Japanese make good Kool-Aid.

 

My father works in the service department of a Ford dealer in northern Wisconsin and says much the same. He hates when Toyotas come in for oilchanges because they are a pain to work on.
A few weeks ago a gentleman brought in his new Camry to get an oilchange done and my father asked him how his liked his car. The man told him, "Ive driven a Camry ever since the first model came out and owned pretty much every generation of Camry, but I think this is my last Toyota. The quality has really gone downhill lately." Im hearing a lot of the same from other Toyota owners. Ive owned Toyotas in the past and they were nice vehicles but I cant see myself owning another Toyota. I can get so much more truck for the money with a Ford or Chevy and IMO the quality and dependability of the domestics is just as good, plus the domestics are a lot easier to get parts for and are cheaper to fix.

I agree. People believe too much of what the magazines say and the magazines obviously have a preference for Japanese brands.
I couldnt have said it better myself. The term, "Hemi" is nowdays nothing more than marketing. Chrysler is trying to tap into some nostalgia by bring back the Hemi. Chrysler's current engines arent any more Hemi than the Triton engine in my F-150 is.

 

Have you been living under a rock wearing headphones?

The Tundra promotion going on right now is ZERO down and 229.00 per month.

I know two people with really, really bad credit that got them.

 

Ppl believe the "hype" of Toy Yoda because they are sheep. I'll even admit that they had decent quality... years ago. Now they are just sacrificing quality for qauntity in order to try and top FoMoCo, GM, Dodge, and it's the consumer (read: Americans) who will suffer for it.

I honestly do not understand why anyone would pay $40k+ for a Tundra. It'as absurd. I "built" a Tundra to have the same options on it as the FX4 I'm patiently waiting to buy... and it was ~$7k more! WTF?! Half the standard options on the FX4 were 'optional' (read: pay more for) on the Toy.

I also agree with B-Man about WantsAHemi. Why are you on a Ford enthisiast site if you're a Mopar boy? Must want to see how the other half lives huh. You believe in the Hemi engine so much... when was the last time a true Hemi was placed in a production vehicle?

LoL... I love how the magazines create hype for sheep to follow. Hopefully, that hype leads all the sheep off a cliff... more room for true enthusiasts.

 

I bet they're proud of themselves. "I've got sh*t *** credit, have a hard time saving money, but I got's me a brandy new crap-tastic Toy Yoda."

This is the other type of ppl who Toy Yoda and credit companies LOVE. Ppl who can't keep on pace with regular payments, thus the crappy credit, and will prolly default or be late on payments, thus accruing fees/charges. More sheep.

 

but your missing one important point. Giving the mexican people jobs in mexico, close to the American boarder, is slowing down the illegal immigration some. There is nothing wrong with bringing up a poor neighbors economy some to help equalize things. Plus they buy a lot of goods from us Americans. Unlike japan, who won't trade fair and allow much of our products over there. Fair trade is the biggest problem I have with the japanese. I won't support them if I can help it.

 

Two things make that happen.

1.) The vehicle you are leasing (And at $299 a month, it's a lease, make no mistake) has an insanely high resale value. So, you only pay the amount the vehicle is expected to depreciate from it's current value- resulting in a lower note than one could otherwise expect.

2.) The seller/manufacturer is overestimating their residual value (or intentionally inflating it) to move units.

***************************
Seeing someone with bad credit get financed, or the offering of 2.9% APR, doesn't mean the same thing as:

"We're gonna take $13,000 off the sticker, and give you a great finance rate..." Not the same thing Keller... Not the same thing.

Did I mention that on top of the $13,000 I got off the sticker, I also received 0% financing on the 2003, and 0.9% on the 2000? Those are incentives for your ***...

When everyone else is making it easier for you to get into their vehicles, the Japanese have to too, but you will rarely see 0% financing 1.9, 2.9, 3.9- but rarely will you see 0.

Of the large Japanese dealers though, I see Toyota and Nissan offers more incentive than Honda.

In fact, my wife is the only person I've ever known to get more than $500 - $1,000 off on a Honda- she got $4,000 off on the 1993 Accord we bought from Cleo Bay Honda, Killeen, TX... It ws a demo with 4,000 miles, and the new bodystyle 1994's were on the lot. But, she used to sell cars too, so she knew the game. (I learned a lot from her.)

***Why do you think you see so many Lexus, BMW's, and Mercedes on the road? It's not because so many people can afford to BUY them. But, many can afford to LEASE them. With E-Class Benz's starting at $50,000- one could expet to pay damn near $1,000 a month for that car...

Not many Americans can do that... But, when you can put $3,900 down, and lease the same car for $499- $599/month then it becomes reachable for many. Such is the case with the Tundra, F-150, etc...

Remember when leasing wasn't an option for everyone? Now it's used by many. It's offered by the dealers more so than 60 month financing.

If we were paying MSRP, and 6.9% financing, a lot of people on this board would not be driving F-150's. If so, it'd be a LOT more XL's and XLT's, and not so many Lariat's, King Ranches, HD's, etc... Not at $600 - $700 a month.

So, people lease.