I dont think I'm implying anything.

But, commodity markets with fungible goods might be.

 

Learn something new every day. Fungibility and Conspiracy Theory aside. What I was saying is that "the Arabs" or OPEC has just as much to do with sucking us dry as the large oil corporations. Alternative fuels cut into both of their incomes.

 

Raoul,

Do you have any conversion kits available. Do I have to buy a goat too or is that in the kit?

JMC

 

[QUOTE=Raptor05121]You're wrong, but then right. I just did a Hydrogen Term Paper for Physical Science class and I learned that the element hydrogen does NOT exist on earth. We have to "mine" it from water with electrolysis methods which are vagely expensive and only produce a very minimal amount of hydrogen. Also, hydrogen is an energy carrier like electricity not an energy producer like fuel. Even then, a hydrogen fuel cell will have to be at the minimum 5x larger than a gasoline tank to hold the same amount. ALSO....the vehicle is run on a motor (I know the British are going to disagree with me on this one, but by definition, a motor is an electrically operated machine while an engine is one run by internal combustion or other means) so basically your "motor" is getting power from an energy "carrier" in this huge-a$$ tank that is holding a very lethal substance (when mixed with an oxygen environment). An example of this is is if you puncture your fuel cell and hydrogen is mixed with O2 and a spark appears, your car is the next Hindenburg, but on a smaller scale. So let's hope the recdnecks don't go off-roading in their hyrodgen-powered "H-150's" (as I assume Ford will name them, pun intended)

-Alex


Actually, if you look into further, it wasn't Hydrogen that made the Hindenburg burn up. Something to do with the material used to create it. Also, Hydrogen is safer than gas for this reason. If you puncture a gas tank, it falls to the ground and is in a pool of flammable liquid. If you puncture a fuell cell, it leaks upward (b/c its a gas) and dillutes itself into the air, therefore, its potential of "exploding" becomes exponentially less almost immediately. So what did you get for a grade on that paper anyway?

 

^^^ it was the lining of the "balloon" part. It was something in the paint.







Thank you Myth Busters.

 

Batteries pollute more than most think.

 

I hope teachers check wiki as the grade "research" papers. I'd give no higher than a C if somebody used that as their primary source. But sadly, I doubt that happens.

- NCSU

 

If you hadn't heard, its not our use of gasoline that drives the price of oil up. In fact it is my understanding that of all the oil we import, a little less than 30 percent is used in transportation. The majority of the oil we import is used for electricity. That's right. So no matter what we do to our cars, it is our energy infrastructure that needs re-vamping. Heating oil for homes and for refineries to make electricity are the real culprits ya'll. Next thing you know some one is going to jump on the global warming band wagon. now THAT is a load of goat dung for ya.

 

Just to add, electrolysis is only one form of refining Hydrogen. There is also Steam reforming, Ammonia dissociation (produces hydrogen and nitrogen ),Partial oxidation as well as Hydrogen being a byproduct of other processes. Storage of hydrogen wouldn't be in gas form anyway, since it is around 90 odd percent lighter than water in its liquid form, weight is no issue. The problem with liquid form is keeping it cold. Even very well insulated you will lose some each day, maybe a percent or so. The major problem I see with Hydrogen is that it acts as an asphyxiate, So being that it is tasteless, colorless and odorless, if one was to have a leak inside a vehicle, the outcome wouldn't be good. Huge liability. My next F150 will either be Goat Dung powered, or a Flux Capacitor!

Just a note, many of the plastics made are from crude as well. Lots of things come from the stuff, not just our gas.

 

malexander: your going to tell me there is "no" global warming???

 

That is right my friend. There is ZERO proof to show that global warming is infact an epidemic. This doesn't mean that certain places are getting warmer, some places are, but globally speaking the global average temperature since 1847 has actually decreased a little over 1 degree. And the polar caps......do you have any idea how big antarctica is? Try one and a half times larger than the north american continent. And another thing Al dumbass cant believe the SOB got a nobel prize wont tell you. The polar caps are getting thicker. That's right my friend. THICKER! Ill make sure to back up all this with some "non-wiki" links. Sea level isn't rising becuase the polar caps are melting, they are rising (arguably) becuase the polar caps are increasing in density. Kind of like when you add more ice to a glass of water. In fact on the scale of things, we are due for another ice age and the earth is gearing up for it. A lot of people assume that ice age means the planet is covered in ice. This is simply not true. Everybody freaks out about forrest fires and loss of the red woods. Another little known fact is that the seeds of a redwood tree are only able to propogatge under extreme conditions. I.E. the heat of fire causes them to burst open. The native americans knew this thousands of years ago and are largely responsible for the redwoods as we know them today. When it comes to wildlife management, man doesn't get it and we almost wiped out yellowstone! All of this is scientific fact. The majority of scientists don't agree on gobal warming, but they do agree that out cliamte is changing whether we like it or not.
How about green house gases. CO2. Let me give you an analogy that is also scientific fact and will help all to see the "big" picture.
Lets compare the atmosphere to a football field. The first 89 yards of the football field represent the inert gases and stuff that we dont breath. The next ten yards or so to the field goal line represent the nitrogen and oxygen we depend on to breath. The 8" painted stripe that seperates the inzone from the rest of the field represents CO2 in the atmosphere. Scientists agree that the amount of CO2 humans have contributed to this stripe since the industrial revolution amounts to about 2 inches of that stripe........
Hopefully that gives you some perspective.
Here is another documented fact.
Shortly after the end of the cold war (fall of the berlin wall) the use of the words catastrophe, climate, and global warming increased in the media by almost 1000 percent.
Fear is how you keep people in line.
If there is no cold war, how do we convince the people that the government is doing what is in their best interests? Global warming, terrorism, etc...
To believe that the human race can truly affect the cliamte on this planet is asenine. We can strip her of her resources and like a virus "eat out selves out of house and home". But as for the weather, we are along for the ride.......
Links to follow.

 

I would hope any refence to a Wiki term paper leads directly to an F.


Seriously, if you are using Wiki to write anything or fact check anything, academia is not your forte.

 

Malexander: The only thing I would like to argue with you about (peacfully and like men) would be the issue over the average temp dropping and the ice caps GROWING???? The first part I can beleive but the latter is just crazy talk. There is physical evidence and too much proof to even justify this arguement. Most everything you said I partially agree with. i feel this is a normal earth cycle and has a lot less to do with our input (we may have sped up the process... but im talking miniscule) but I have been starting to waiver a bit from this stance and would like to start talking to you (and anyone else with REAL input) about this whole mess. More knowledge the better IMO . I too will go home and gather what facts and "proof" I can to combat your statement. And lets try to stay away from little kiddie analogies about the football field. Give me some respect! This is stuff i learned back in high school. I am not some teenager who is repeating wiki "facts" (lol) or saying ANYTHING Al ***** said was correct. His movie was propaganda at it's finest.

 

Keep in mind, in the scale of time, humans really haven't been around long enough and recording events long enough to establish the THEORY of global warming. we know that the Unitedstates was hotter 50 years ago than it is today. No matter what is happening, it is still our duty to be good stewards of this planet. I think we can all agree on that.

Arctic current circulation form JPL labs
http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.cfm?release=2007-131

1934 was the warmest year in US history so far The goddard insitute
http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/updates/200708.html

Australia was COLDER and 1998 global temperatures were the warmest on record (they are lower now despite china and india pumping out tons of CO2)
http://www-das.uwyo.edu/~geerts/cwx/...obal_temp.html

CO2 concentrations and temperature over the past 350,000 years
While there is no argument that humans are affecting the climate, the fact is that every 100,000 years the earth goes through this glacial cycle. DOWNLOAD THIS PDF as it contains valid arguments for both sides of the global warming issue.
http://dels.nas.edu/basc/?gclid=CMTY...FQ8nawodz0fFLw

the global warming hoax website an interesting and educated read
http://www.theglobalwarminghoax.com/

I didn't want to spout off with out backing up my claims. I have a son whom I love very much and I want to leave a better planet for him. We have to be mindful of what we are polluting the planet with. I am more concerned with what is going into the air only to fall back into the ocean, our water supply and our soil. Global preservation should be the issue, not global warming.
Peace to my friends here.

 

wow that was quick! well i don't have time now to look over the link as soon as I get home I will definately take a look. Thank you!