Yesterday, I sent this e-mail to Ford Customer Assistance:

Quote:

I have just spent $1,200.45 at Superior Ford in Plymouth, MN to replace engine gaskets that should have lasted another 100,000 miles.

On 10/01/02, at 78,730 miles, the front cover gasket was replaced for a charge of $780.45 due to an external coolant leak. Ford had issued recall campaign 99B29 but apparently decided that my truck was not going to develope this problem. Considering that it did, as have many others, the previous recall has obviously been inadequate.

On 10/09/02, at 78,816 miles, I returned to Superior Ford because I was losing coolant again. It was at that time determined I had a new leak from the lower intake manifold gasket. The Service Advisor, XXXX XXXXXXX #763-XXX-XXXX reasoned that this leak was caused by pressure testing the system and stressing an already weak gasket. The failure of the lower intake manifold gasket is a Ford design problem that is addressed in TSB #99-20-7 and was corrected on 1998 and later model 4.2L Ford engines.

The replacement of the lower intake manifold gasket totaled $420.00 with a discounted labor fee.

I do not believe this to be a Ford dealership or service issue. This is a Ford Engineering issue.

I have been purchasing Ford Vehicles most of my life and own 3 at the moment. I would certainly like to continue owning Ford products however, after these problems, my confidence in Ford engineering has been shaken.

If these issued stated above are not resolved to my complete satisfaction, I will not purchase another Ford product again, at any time.

Please consider my value as a future Ford customer and address the engineering issues and costs I have been so needlessly inconvenienced with.

Thank you,
XXXX XXXXXXX
Crystal, MN
Hm #763-XXX-XXXX

A few hours after sending this e-mail, I received a call from a gentleman stating he was with Ford's Executive Office and was responding to an e-mail I'd sent. We spoke for about 10 minutes and it seems that the purpose of his call was to convince me to take up my concerns with the dealership that performed the work.

I had to keep bringing his focus back to this being a very well documented Ford factory defect and not a Ford dealership problem. He even tried to refer me to a service advisor at the dealership that would convince me that all gaskets fail by 80,000 miles, literally. A assured him that I will continue to view this as a very common Ford factory defect and will not be purchasing any more Ford products until I am reimbursed for these repairs.

The way I see it, I shouldn't have to be dealing with this. It should have been resolved during R & D, not at my expense. The only reason I still have this truck is that no one wants to buy a 1997 4.2L F-150 because they have so many problems.

He said he'd speak with his managers and call me again Friday. I then had to call the SA he tried to refer me to at the dealership and assure him that I view this entirely as a Ford factory issue and not a dealer service issue.

 

AJ,

I think this would be an excellent time for us all to begin an e-mail campaign to make sure that they know this is NOT going to be absorbed as a dealer problem, unless of course they would like to suggest that all the dealers across the nation are worthless.

I for one can provide about 6 or so participants.

Post this effort on a few boards in an organized fashion and I'd bet we can get Ford really aware of some pissed off customers.

Your e-mail is well written and doesn't throw in emotional outburst. Maybe even start an organized form letter campaign.

Good job AJ. I think you may have hit on a way to launch the campaign from now. But it needs to keep it organized and current. Keep the database ready for an attorney to look at someday maybe. Ford will sense this too once they see the organization and insistence we show them.

We need to provide VINs etc and a well thought out attack.

 

I have searched for a way to e-mail FORD Motor Company but could never find one....could you please e-mail me to let me know where to send my concerns? Customer-No-Service has always blown me off...and I'm talking since NOVEMBER 2001!

Someone mentioned a class action suit concerning this recall #99B29 however I have yet to find any information on this. Anyone know who to contact or where to go to find out? I've called several lawyers in my area and none seem to be interested-small cities do have their limits.

AJ, I'm right there with ya! Been there-in fact, still there! Keep up the fight cause you know you're not alone.

 

The Customer Assistance e-mails have been coming from crcfmc@customersupporctr.com I haven't responded to any so I don't know where it goes. I don't believe that Ford Customer Assistance was set up to actually help customers though. I think it's more of a brick wall to stop us and convince customers to take up their concerns with dealers.

The Ford e-mail system is set up as 1st initial, last name @ford.com You could theoretically e-mail just about everyone at ford, limited only by your own creativity. I did send an e-mail to wford@ford.com It wasn't returned so it must be valid. It may or may not be Junior's e-mail but someone at Ford received it.

Customer care has since responded to my e-mail. This is what they said:

Quote:

Thank you for your message of 10/24/02 regarding your 1997 Ford F-150. We appreciate the time you have taken to write us regarding your cooling system concern.

The circumstances that you have outlined in your original e-mail have been given careful consideration.

Our records indicate that on 10/24/02, you contacted the Customer Relationship Center (CRC) via phone and our Customer Service Representative provided an answer to your inquiry.

If you require further information in regards to this matter, we would appreciate you letting us know.

We do appreciate the fact that you are a loyal customer, and we apologize that we have not given you an answer that you are satisfied with. We thank you for the opportunity to address your concerns but unfortunately at this time, there is no change in the previous decision.We certainly do want to thank you for taking the time to contact us and letting us know what your concern was. We do appreciate your feedback, and hope that you will continue to be a loyal Ford customer.

At Ford Motor Company, we consider the satisfaction of our customers as one of our most important objectives. If you have any other inquiries or concerns, please feel free to contact us and we will be happy to address them.

Thank you for contacting Ford Motor Company.

Sincerely,
Jacqueline
Ford Motor Company
Customer Relationship Center

It's really quite pathetic, in my view. I actually like the F-150 and had planned on buying a new one in the spring. The way I look at it now though is that I bought a product from Ford that had problems with the basic design. Problems that you really don't expect a vehicle to have. All I was asking is for them to give me what I thought I was purchasing; what they advertized. I had to spend money to fix their mistakes.

What I offered Ford was perfectly reasonable. Give me back the money I spent to fix your mistake and all will be forgiven.... I'll buy a new truck and grin ear to ear They would have recouped their loss when I purchased my next truck.

Now what they get instead is a very pissed off, resourceful and determined fellow that will work very hard to make them pay not only for my engine repairs but everyone elses as well. I can't in good conscience give them any more money. It's an insult to my inteligence and morals to throw good money after bad.

If anyone doesn't think this is a problem, all you need to do is look in the V-6 forums of the F-150 message boards. This is a very relevant problem. I thought it was bad about 6 months ago but it looks as though the incidences have tripled since and there are new failures almost daily. Ford will end up paying for all of these failures.

 

These are the Ford contacts, valid as of 10/25/02:

Kathleen Ligocki Vice President, Customer Serice Division. North America
Ann O' Neill Executive Director, Customer Service Division. North America
Mike Richards Director - Customer Service Organization
Jamy Cureton Director - North American Business Development

Notice that, Ann O' Neill was not only in charge of the original 99B29 Recall for the timing cover but also handled the '95-'96 Windstar headgasket failures.

 

Excellent information AJ. Very well written and professional. When dealing with things like this that is the only to do it. Lose your cool and you will definitely be shut out. So far I have lucked out with 97. When I bought it I had no idea about these issues of course and didn't learn about them until I found this awesome board. I had my dealer give me a copy of all of the work that had been done on my truck since it arrived there. I found out through the printout that they had done the gasket recall when I bought before delivery among with a ton of other stuff. Then this year I was having tranny problems and starting to lose coolant. Took it in had both the tranny and the engine looked at. The dealer did right by me and I only covered $330 for a new clutch, entire tranny rebuild. They also did the gasket replacement again, pulled the engine checked and speced everything and threw it back together. Over $5K of work for 330 very nice. However I am very worried that when my extended warranty runs out in the next month that something big will go wrong.
Staying on top of what is going on here with the excellent information that is provided can help us all and like you mentioned if Ford gets enough hassle from people armed with the right information maybe they will step up and do the right thing.
Sorry to be long winded here
Thanks

 

AJ-

You're right, Ford's handling of this situation is pathetic! Thanks for all the info you are providing-I just picked a name and sent an email explaining my situation, I'll let you know what happens.

THANKS!

 

I am the owner of a 97 F150 4.2. The front cover gasket problem was repaired in 99 when I found coolant on the ground. Now at 77,000 miles I have coolant in the #4 cylinder. Intake gasket I suspect. Ford says "you never know when a part might fail" I am all for flooding Ford with complaints so these things can get resolved. I feel this is a design defect and Fords responsibility to repair.

 

not sure what is wrong with mine but i think it is the head gasket ,or intake gasket ,the other day i went to start it after it had been siting for about 10 hours it cranked over twice and locked up let off key tried again this time it started,but it was skipping bad when i took off it left a cloud of smoke behind me so i stopped and it smelt like antifrezze.My truck is 97 with 4.2 71,516 miles ford said to bad.

 

Snow, That is exactly what happened to me. If you pull spark plugs you will likely find coolant in one or more cylinders. I can't believe Ford is willing to lose all these customers over shoddy engineering. Come on Ford...Get with it.. Steve Crowe

 

My '97 just had the same problem last week. Had to have head gaskets replaced because #4 cylinder had water in it. Also had all intake gaskets replaced for less than $700 for the total repair.

Ford really sh_t on us and I won't forget it. The only thing that makes it better in my situation is that my truck has 162,000 miles on it. I feel sorry for you guys with less miles-I'd really be pissed. Other minor repairs I can understand. Engine destructing internal gasket failures-unacceptable. My timing chain cover gasket failed at about 80,000 miles. Is Ford buying these things from Kmart or something? Are they on a self destruct timer?

Good luck guys-I feel your pain.

 

I've had a 97 4.2 for about 2 years now. Had 51K when I bought it, about 75K now. Seems like the coolant is always down a little, but I guess I never paid much attention to it, it always run fine. What should I be looking for? How do I know if I've got a problem also? Thinking about doing some mods, but don't know how far to go if I'm going to have problems with the engine.

 

Hey Fabmanrich, Mine started with a slight miss on cold start up. But would smooth out after a few seconds. Then it started giving a check engine light after the miss. I just kept disconnecting the battery because Ford wanted 65.00 to hook up the computer to it. Then one day I got a hydro lock. I thought the battery was dead or something. Then a loud bang and white smoke out the tailpipe. #4 cylinder got full of anti-freeze. I have it stopped now by using Bars Leak sealant. Don't laugh, it has been OK for a few weeks now. Oh yes, Ford says tough

 

All owners of 1997 F-150 trucks equipped with the 4.2L engine need to pay extra attention to their coolant level. If the level drops: get it in for diagnosis. You'd be amazed at the number of 1997 4.2L engines that have failed as the result of coolant in the oil or lower intake.


Fabmanrich,

In your case, if the coolant level has dropped, you need to have the system pressure tested to verify where the leak has developed. Any 4.2L F-150 built prior to 01/01/97 was included in Recall 99B29. This was for the replacement of the engine front cover gasket. If your engine was built up until 05/01/97 you also have a faulty front cover gasket but Ford did not bother include your truck in the recall. Just being included in the recall doesn't mean that you have had the updated gasket installed. It looks a though Ford didn't try very hard at all to contact all of the afftected owners.

The next most common gasket failure is the lower intake manifold side gaskets. These were updated on engines built after 01/15/98. If your front cover gasket has been replaced, this is where the next leak tends to develop.

The lower manifold gaskets can fail and allow coolant to leak into the cylinders (very similar to a failed head gasket with the results) or they can allow coolant to leak into the oil.

If the coolant goes into the cylinders at a small rate, it will burn up in the combustion process. If it leaks at a higher rate or if the vehicles sits for some time, the engine may hydro-lock when started because a cylinder will be filled with coolant.

If the coolant gets into the oil, the lower end bearings experience extremely accelerated wear. This wear on the bearings can cause the engine to knock very suddenly. It's very common to hear an owner say that the truck sounded loud last night when I turned it off. But, when I stated it this morning, it sounded like someone was hitting it with a hammer.

Most lower intake gasket failures are right around 80,000 miles.

If anyone would like a very detailed expanation of these gasket issues, you can certainly e-mail me as well, through the link in my profile.

 

Adam i tried to talk to Don Moore at ford today and he told me the info you were giving out over the internet was not true, and he did not know who you are.told him about my problem and he said to bad.All i know is all fords i have owned i will not buy another one . FORD SUCKS