Neal,
You installed a Perma Cool trans cooler with fan and I was wondering what your take was on the installation instructions. Fans on coolers are 20% more efficient pulling air through the fins as compared to pushing air through. I was all set to install the Perma Cool unit with the fan on the engine side of the cooler but then read in the instructions that the fan is designed to push air through to avoid melting the fan. However, the fan blades sure look like they're designed to pull rather than push. So now I'm looking at installing the cooler with the fan "blocking" the cooler i.e. with the fan on the outside of the cooler directly in the airflow.

It's been one of those weekends. I bought an external trans filter from Summit, in fact it's a Summit product but looks identical to the Perma Cool filter system. It even has a Perma Cool pamphlet in the box. Anyway, they show the filter hooked up in reverse, opposite to their instructions. It just astounds me how many errors there are in instructions these days.

So Neal, what did you do and why?

Thanks again.


------------------
'00 5.4L AUTO 4X4 F-150 Lariat
'98 4.0L 5spd Jeep Wrangler Sport
'95 3.8L SC Thunderbird
'02 F-350 PSD CC DRW 6SPD 4X4 Lariat (order this year)
www.hawthorn-engineering.com

 

HI!... GAH : I installed my SUMMIT 10 INCH electric fan in front of the cooler. Between the back of the grill and the cooler it'self. The fan is not really designed to be used while driving. I rarely use it while driving. I mostly use it at the track in the pitts or when stuck in traffic or at a red light. Hope this helps you out.


------------------
NEAL " THE H.P FREAK" E-MAIL :nnewman@sympatico.ca
'99' F-150 XLT SPORT, oxford white, reg cab shortbox stepside,5.4, auto, 4.10L.S, captain's chairs, bedliner, GTS carbon fiber headlight covers, ***** CEPECK clear halogen driving lights, GTS slotted tailight covers (painted oxford white), fiberglass smooth wiper cowl (painted OXFORD WHITE), FORD locking lug nuts, tinted windows,true duel exhaust with 2.5 inch mandrel bent pipes and FLOWMASTER 3 chamber mufflers with 3' tailpipes exiting before the rear wheel like the LIGHTNING, HELLWIG rear stabalizer bar, 3 AUTOMETER guage pods, filled with tranny temp, engine temp, and oil preasure AUTOMETER "PHANTOM" guages,custom fabricated air intake trac and huge K/N filter, TPS mod, BELLTECH 2-inch rear drop, custom programed SUPERCHIP "FLIP-CHIP", BAUMANN ENGINEERING shift kit (on stage 5 setting)BYPASS CLUTCH CONTROL VALVE/PREASURE REGULATOR VALVE, ASP POWER PULLEYS, custom tig welded and ported JBA "JET BLACK coated headers, twin DERALE 16 INCH ELECTRIC FANS, PERMA COOL 14"/10" tranny cooler with 10" electric fan, PERMA-COOL external tranny filter, custom ported (STOCK) throttle body, custom digital air intake temp sensor, custom ported TB intake elbow, relocated ATS, FORD RACING 24LB injectors, RUSSELL stainless steel braided tranny lines with fittings.


FUTURE MODS : BBK 75MM THROTTLE BODY, 80MM PRO-M MASS AIR METER, AADI F1 RAM AIR HOOD WITH CUSTOM FABRICATED RAM AIR SET-UP, CAL-TRAC TRACTION BARS, EXTRUDE HONED INTAKE MANIFOLD, SHM CUSTOM FUEL RAILS, 90/10 FRONT CE SHOCKS, 70/30 REAR CE SHOCKS, BELL TECH 2/4 DROP, EXPEDITION CENTER CONSOLE, HARLEY DAVISON F-150 LOWER FRONT VALANCE (painted oxford white) and a KENNE BELL BLOWZILLA SUPERCHARGER.

ESTIMATED H.P TO DATE : 340H.P / 425ft/lbs of torque.

CURRENT PERFORMANCE : 1/4 MILE - 14.52E.T * MPH - 93.73 * 0-60MPH - 5.8 * 1/8 MILE - 9.2 * 60 FT - 2.0

OTHER TOYS : "83" PRO STREET FORD RANGER : 351-w stroked to 408c.i 625H.P (natural), 875H.P with 250H.P "BIG SHOT" N.O.S kit, tubbed (crome moly tubing), 12 point chrome moly roll cage, 4-link with coil overs, MUSTANG II front suspension, c-4 tranny (race prepped), 4000rpm stall converter(8 INCH), 3" chrome moly driveshaft,AUTOMETER guages, 16.50 MICKEY THOMPSON rear tires, 4" M/T front tires, CENTERLINE CON-VO PRO rims, fiberglass hood - bumper - prostock hood scoop, wishbone trac-link, two chrome moly driveshaft loops, 16 gallon JAZ fuel cell,etc

 

Thanks Neal. I plan on installing the fan/cooler tomorrow. I'm thinking of mounting it (with custom brackets) in a horizontal position with the fan blowing up so as to reduce wear on the fan bearings when the truck is moving. The fan shouldn't rotate due to the airflow if it's horizontally mounted. The Perma Cool unit will be in series with the factory cooler, and as you mentioned, the fan will only be turned on at specific times e.g. climbing long hills.

Thanks for your help.

------------------
'00 5.4L AUTO 4X4 F-150 Lariat
'98 4.0L 5spd Jeep Wrangler Sport
'95 3.8L SC Thunderbird
'02 F-350 PSD CC DRW 6SPD 4X4 Lariat (order this year)
www.hawthorn-engineering.com

 

Gah - That is an interesting choice of location. I assume you are only going to use this for low speed running or off-roading, since you will get almost no ram air effect with that install.

I am looking at upgrading my tranny cooler as well but was thinking of hooking it up in parallel instead of in series with the stock cooler. I want to increase the cooling when towing a trailer. Do you have any info on how much natural airflow is blocked by the fan when it is not rotating?

Where are you tapping in to the existing line?

Ian

------------------
99 Expedition EB
5.4l, 4x4, 4.10 LS
WMS Tube, Bassani Cat Back Exhaust, Superchip Flipchip, PIAA Superwhites

 

Ian,
a few weeks ago I was climbing a grade (unloaded) of 1500' in 1.8 miles and my trans temp got as high as 220F. I probably was going no faster than 20mph with the OD off. This got me thinking about additional cooling and so I ordered a Perma Cool cooler/fan combination.

As Neal mentioned, if you keep the original cooler then the Perma Cool fan is only used when the factory cooler cannot keep up. The fan on the 10"x14" unit moves 900cfm which is equivalent to driving at 18.75mph.

Mounting the Perma Cool close to the factory cooler with the fan in the front as per their instructions will result in the fan spinning constantly under normal driving conditions (20~70mph). This will cause added wear on the fan bearings, brushes etc and the increase in cooler surface area isn't needed under these conditions.

As mentioned, the fan is only needed under certain conditions i.e. low speed/high load where convective cooling from outside air is a minimum. My decision to "possibly" mount the cooler horizontally with the fan blowing upwards is based upon the fan drawing cooler air from beneath the truck. The fan will be out of the main airflow and so won't be rotated by the air under normal driving conditions.

I don't think any or at least much natural airflow will be blocked by the fan because it's free to rotate. I'm not sure about hooking up two coolers in parallel. Series is the usual way to go. I'm installing an external trans filter in addition to the cooler so I haven't figured out how I'm going to do this yet. I'll let you know once I'm done.

I'm always open to, and welcome other perspectives.


------------------
'00 5.4L AUTO 4X4 F-150 Lariat
'98 4.0L 5spd Jeep Wrangler Sport
'95 3.8L SC Thunderbird
'02 F-350 PSD CC DRW 6SPD 4X4 Lariat (order this year)
www.hawthorn-engineering.com

 

HI!... GAH : When you get a chance check out my BURNOUT MOVIE in the COMPUTER CHIPS section under "VICTORIES FOR NEAL" thread. You'll like it, trust me!LOL!

------------------
NEAL " THE H.P FREAK" E-MAIL :nnewman@sympatico.ca
'99' F-150 XLT SPORT, oxford white, reg cab shortbox stepside,5.4, auto, 4.10L.S, captain's chairs, bedliner, GTS carbon fiber headlight covers, ***** CEPECK clear halogen driving lights, GTS slotted tailight covers (painted oxford white), fiberglass smooth wiper cowl (painted OXFORD WHITE), FORD locking lug nuts, tinted windows,true duel exhaust with 2.5 inch mandrel bent pipes and FLOWMASTER 3 chamber mufflers with 3' tailpipes exiting before the rear wheel like the LIGHTNING, HELLWIG rear stabalizer bar, 3 AUTOMETER guage pods, filled with tranny temp, engine temp, and oil preasure AUTOMETER "PHANTOM" guages,custom fabricated air intake trac and huge K/N filter, TPS mod, BELLTECH 2-inch rear drop, custom programed SUPERCHIP "FLIP-CHIP", BAUMANN ENGINEERING shift kit (on stage 5 setting)BYPASS CLUTCH CONTROL VALVE/PREASURE REGULATOR VALVE, ASP POWER PULLEYS, custom tig welded and ported JBA "JET BLACK coated headers, twin DERALE 16 INCH ELECTRIC FANS, PERMA COOL 14"/10" tranny cooler with 10" electric fan, PERMA-COOL external tranny filter, custom ported (STOCK) throttle body, custom digital air intake temp sensor, custom ported TB intake elbow, relocated ATS, FORD RACING 24LB injectors, RUSSELL stainless steel braided tranny lines with fittings.


FUTURE MODS : BBK 75MM THROTTLE BODY, 80MM PRO-M MASS AIR METER, AADI F1 RAM AIR HOOD WITH CUSTOM FABRICATED RAM AIR SET-UP, CAL-TRAC TRACTION BARS, EXTRUDE HONED INTAKE MANIFOLD, SHM CUSTOM FUEL RAILS, 90/10 FRONT CE SHOCKS, 70/30 REAR CE SHOCKS, BELL TECH 2/4 DROP, EXPEDITION CENTER CONSOLE, HARLEY DAVISON F-150 LOWER FRONT VALANCE (painted oxford white) and a KENNE BELL BLOWZILLA SUPERCHARGER.

ESTIMATED H.P TO DATE : 340H.P / 425ft/lbs of torque.

CURRENT PERFORMANCE : 1/4 MILE - 14.52E.T * MPH - 93.73 * 0-60MPH - 5.8 * 1/8 MILE - 9.2 * 60 FT - 2.0

OTHER TOYS : "83" PRO STREET FORD RANGER : 351-w stroked to 408c.i 625H.P (natural), 875H.P with 250H.P "BIG SHOT" N.O.S kit, tubbed (crome moly tubing), 12 point chrome moly roll cage, 4-link with coil overs, MUSTANG II front suspension, c-4 tranny (race prepped), 4000rpm stall converter(8 INCH), 3" chrome moly driveshaft,AUTOMETER guages, 16.50 MICKEY THOMPSON rear tires, 4" M/T front tires, CENTERLINE CON-VO PRO rims, fiberglass hood - bumper - prostock hood scoop, wishbone trac-link, two chrome moly driveshaft loops, 16 gallon JAZ fuel cell,etc

[This message has been edited by Neal (edited 05-28-2001).]

 

The reason I was thinking of parallel rather than series (which I have always done in the past) is that I read an article in Trailer Life saying that some mfg's were denying warranty claims when there was an aftermarket cooler. Some crap about the aftermarket cooler not flowing enough. If you run them in parallel the flow cannot be restricted. (yes, I know about the law on this).

From a heat tranfer viewpoint, series would be better, but why give Ford an out?

Also, I doubt the fan windmilling would put significant wear on the bearings.

As for tie-in location, on my truck there is a loop in the transmission line behind the radiator that doesn't go anywhere. It looks like a great place to splice in.

Interested to hear how it goes.

Ian

------------------
99 Expedition EB
5.4l, 4x4, 4.10 LS
WMS Tube, Bassani Cat Back Exhaust, Superchip Flipchip, PIAA Superwhites

 

Hi gah..
How did your aux. Perma-Cool transmission fluid cooler installation work out? Also, after reading your posts, I think the addition of a transmission fluid filter is a good idea as well. Where did you mount the filter ... on the outgoing line from the transmission before it dumps into the radiator/coolers? Any interesting lessons learned? Hope all went well!!

Thanks for your help as always.
GDG

------------------
Stock Package: 2001 SuperCrew XLT, Silver, 5.4L, 4x4, 3.55 LS, Tow Package, 265x70x17, Sliding Rear Window,
Modifications: Tuff Spray-on Liner, JBA Headers Jet Black Coated, Ravin Z55 SI/DO Sideswept Catback, K&N FIPK with fabricated cold-air box and ram-air, SuperChip, ASP Pullies, 1" Thick Sheepskin seat covers (nice "seat-of-the-pants" feel!), Nerf Bars, PIAA Superwhites, 65W (9006) Fog Lights, Dual 14" Perma-Cool Fans w/ stock shroud, Baumann Shift Kit on Stage 4 with Sonnex Bypass Clutch control Valve, Pillar mounted Autometer Ultra-Lite Water and Tranny Temperature Gages, Amsoil front to back, TPS Mod to 0.999, Custom ported TB.
Future mods - Roots Supercharger, modified sterio system

 

GDG,
I didn't start the installation yet. As soon as I'm done I'll post some pictures. It's been a busy month but I hope to get to it in the next couple of weeks.

I plan on installing the filter in the line going to the radiator. That way, if anything ever fails in my trans, the filter should prevent any crap from getting to the radiator and/or coolers.

I'm a little concerned about lowering the flow rate of the ATF in the circuit that will include the external filter, radiator, oem cooler and additional cooler. Factory_Tech confirmed my suspicion of approx 20psi in the lines but hopefully the oil filter will increase the pressure a little, and the cooler plus additional hoses will lower the pressure by a small amount.

I'll be back!!

------------------
'00 5.4L AUTO 4X4 F-150 Lariat
'98 4.0L 5spd Jeep Wrangler Sport
'95 3.8L SC Thunderbird
'02 F-350 PSD CC DRW 6SPD 4X4 Lariat (order this year)
www.hawthorn-engineering.com

 

gah,
Yeah, I see what you mean now. I had not thought about the aux. cooler and filter as a flow restrictor. My first reaction is that it should be no problem as I'm sure it has been done thousands of times and I havn't heard anything negative. Also, I think the tube inside diameter of the aux. cooler is quite a bit larger than the existing I.D of the 5/16" lines. So I think it's a better situation to add them than to not add them.
GDG

------------------
Stock Package: 2001 SuperCrew XLT, Silver, 5.4L, 4x4, 3.55 LS, Tow Package, 265x70x17, Sliding Rear Window,
Modifications: Tuff Spray-on Liner, JBA Headers Jet Black Coated, Ravin Z55 SI/DO Sideswept Catback, K&N FIPK with fabricated cold-air box and ram-air, SuperChip, ASP Pullies, 1" Thick Sheepskin seat covers (nice "seat-of-the-pants" feel!), Nerf Bars, PIAA Superwhites, 65W (9006) Fog Lights, Dual 14" Perma-Cool Fans w/ stock shroud, Baumann Shift Kit on Stage 4 with Sonnex Bypass Clutch control Valve, Pillar mounted Autometer Ultra-Lite Water and Tranny Temperature Gages, Amsoil front to back, TPS Mod to 0.999, Custom ported TB.
Future mods - Roots Supercharger, modified sterio system