Back to what I asked, if I end up doing it I will do a complete built longblock, no Mickey Mouse stuff. I ran into a Mustang on E-bay that I couldnt pass on, so I put a bid on it. Thanks to all of those who replied. About Robs problems, well stuff like that happens, just take it as a learning lesson.

 

Melting plugs repeatedly at WOT is most definately a tuning issue. What hard parts could have caused this? Why were they left in place if they were an issue?
Jim

 

Good choice, you give up too much power with the stock heads/cams.

Jody

 

LOL,,,forgot all about you carlos

 

Originally Posted by Rob_02Lightning
Number one, PSP was the one WHO COULDNT MAKE IT WORK, NOT ME

Rob, to refresh your memory this is where you pissed everyone of the PSP supporters off, including owner/operator Sal... guess you forgot about that post

 

Rich

Talk about taking quotes out of context, You and everyone can continue to bash and talk about me all you want, (as you have been for days now on this post) I didnt come back then, shouldnt have now and I wont again. References were constantly made that "I" cant do this, and "I" havent been able to do that, and all "I" continue to say AND STILL DO is that "I" didnt built and tune it, Sal did.

All I wanted to do was build a new motor using the stock Heads and Cams like so many before me. To tell you the truth the Springs NEVER CAME UP in conversation and if you or anyone thinks I would have had a problem going another hundred or two IF THEY DID, then you are very much wrong.

But the fact is that has nothing to do with what we're talking about here, nor is it to blame for my non stop constant day one to D-Day Plug Melting issue, and surly not for my bogg, as the expression goes It's all in the tune......

lokosvt I am very sorry your post turned into this
Best of luck in either decision you make

 

I can see both sides of this Rob. If you had "dropped it" then we wouldn't be making these posts. Going to say this again since I didn't see you reference it once in your reply - YOU blew the truck up. First time out and you spray the moon? That's your ego racing down the track, not your mind. That's the only answer that makes sense to me why you didn't do a bunch of non-nitrous runs before stepping up to a small shot. A lot of people lose a whole racing season during a build and I can feel your pain there, but I haven't sprayed once since getting my truck back. I told myself long ago that I'd make sure the truck was 100% before spraying. If the first JDM day wasn't rained out, I was going to run all non-nitrous runs.

You know me Rob. I don't run around Team PSP or Team anything. I paid full price for my build and respect Sal, but I don't owe him anything. He might have shaved a few labor hours, but I did a lot of business with him over the years. I have friend and online poster here that has been the test vehicle for a local vendor for a while - getting discounted parts and labor. He hasn't really seen the results, but you don't see the dirty laundry spread out here.

If you didn't blow it up, it could have been fixed. Bottom line.

-Mark

 

WOW...........
with all this back and forth, I expect to never hear the full truth. But that statment is just demanding an explantion...........

All I know is this, to be the truth
Sal did alot of "stuff" for Rob, on the cuff......so to speak
And Rob had alot more patience than I would ever have

Its a shame it had to end like this, but its not the first time a vendor and customer have had a........ falling out

and probably not the last

 

owning several race/show cars over the years, I'll share a few things that I've learned.

1. It WILL break
2. First time at the track, you WILL have problems
3. When adding mods, add them one at a time and see what works and what doesn't. Just because it works for another, doesn't mean squat.
4. You get what you pay for. If you try to go cheap, expect to spend twice that amount when it breaks.
5. It's a hobby, not an investment, you will lose money.
6. when something isn't working right, change one thing at a time, if you change alot at one time, you will never know what the problem was.

I don't know what caused your problem, all I know is all summer I've read you blame one person/company after the next for your problems. I'm simply adding this to your list. I wonder which, if any, company will be blamed next?

Weren't you going to sell that truck about a month or two back? Perhaps you should consider that, and quit using these boards as your personal blog.

/rant

 

Not that I really want to prolong this topic, but I do feel I have the right to reply to Rob's post, just as he had the right to reply to mine...


Actually there were several parts of your build that I didn't agree with. It was the 50lb injectors, the Maf-X, the PlasmaBooster, and the stock cat back.

We changed the cat back because you were not happy with the hp the truck was making. And since nobody else had ever tried to use the stock cat back on a high power truck, we decided to try to eliminate that as a bottleneck. I tried to get you to get a dual muffler setup, but you couldn't afford it, so you got the "free" single muffler Flowmaster setup and we gave that a shot.

Given the history of 50s causing the exact problem you had, I suggested we rule those out since we could not find anything else wrong. I got Alan to give you a set of 60s for COST, and in they went. After that, your truck no longer ate plugs and all the plugs had the same color, unlike when the 50s were in the truck and every plug was different.

Right. When we were down to not much left that we hadn't looked at, we figured we'd try changing out the Maf-X for an actual SCT MAF. I gave that to you for COST.

That was your call. Still using a single muffler cat back, you asked about if it could still be a restriction. I agreed that I have had customers swtich from a single to a dual setup and gain power. I gave you a stainless Bassani catback for COST, and installed it for FREE.

It was NOT the tune. The tune had all the proper corrections in it for the parts used on the truck. The truck had another issue causing your bog. Your bog was caused by a momentary lean spot when you tipped into the throttle off idle. But it wouldn't do it everytime, so I knew it wasn't the tune. I FIXED it with the tune, by forcing the truck into open loop, and then running it richer at that low rpm and load, to counteract the lean spot. That fixed it and the truck ran GREAT after that.

Springs?? You didn't have the money for the labor to do the springs!!

I saw no reason at the time to NOT run it. It was tuned and ready to go. It wasn't killing plugs anymore, and you said the drivability was awesome. BUT, I told you to run it off the spray first to make sure it makes a clean pass, like I have told you EVERY time you went to the track. And like every other time, you did NOT do that and hurt the truck on the first nitrous pass. You have to crawl before you can walk. You have to make sure the truck is healthy off spray before you spray it.

Yep, and you agreed 100% too. But now you've changed your story, because your in the spotlight.

 

Again, this was a result of YOU not being happy with the Mag's performance, since the Eaton made so much more torque than the Mag. I came up with an idea for trying something nobody had tried before. After speaking with Charles in the past about how aggressive the MPs intake side was, I wanted to see if I could improve it. So well pull the MP off, and I reshaped the intake side with metal epoxy, to make is a little closer to the shape of the Eaton case. And what was the result? The truck picked up mega torque. You even said the truck ran the best it's ever run after that at WOT. The only reason YOU removed the epoxy, was because YOU thought it might be the cause of the bog. So I'm not sure my modding the MP has to do with anything negative.

WTF are you talking about? I never pulled your tuck at 18:1! There was one pull where it went a little lean at first, and then I let off. That's tuning! That's why we have dynos. To see what the vehicle is doing, and adjust it. I never made a full dyno pull with your truck that lean.

I don't consider you the bad guy Rob. And I don't consider myself innocent. Like I said in the past, we (yes WE) tried to build your truck in a way that had not been done before. We were both dealing with the unknown on certian areas, so yes, there was a lot of trial and error and there was a lot of pain and sacrifice on both our parts.

You are not the only one who lost out big time Rob. I lost out just as big as you did, between all the negavtive posts that some will feel reflect back on me and my company, as well as all the money I lost helping you with your truck. I am just as unhappy as you are about the situation.

 

And since it's been publically brought up now, I will address what I felt was the cause of Rob's meltdown at JDM day...

When Rob originally mounted his nozzle in his upper intake, he used the black spacer under it, which moves the nozzle farther out. I never really noticed this, as the intake was also black, and just assumed that the nozzle mounted in the intake was about the best way it was going to work with the short RT nozzle. When I switched blowers on his truck, I looked in the intake and saw that the nozzle barely stuck through, and then he had mounted it pointing right at the bend in the intake. So I took it out, removed the spacer, and pointed it right at the blower opening for optimum spray. There was no time to redyno it before the event, so really we had no idea what that would have done.

After Rob's meltdown at JDM day, I was really baffled as to what happened. So I started thinking about every possible angle. When I dynoed it, I found the RT jetting to be really over rich, and jetted the fuel size down to compensate. When I had the intake off and saw how bad the current mounting was, I remounted the nozzle. However, the jetting stayed the same because that's how it was dynoed. With the previous nozzle setup, it was probably losing some of the nitrous to hitting into the plenum, which would explain the extreme richness and the low increase in hp numbers on the spray. With the new nozzle setup, it now may have been getting the full blast of nitrous from the system, AND then it was still jetted down on the fuel side. So I my guess is the truck went mega lean when it was run it and cooked all the plugs. Since Rob had to drive the truck to E-town, it was more important to give him the truck back and let him drive it to make sure the bogging was gone, so he didn't get killed if his truck bogged or stalled in NYC traffic on the way to Etown, so there was no time to redyno it.

That's my best guess at what caused it. I can't see any other issue killing 7 plugs in less than an 1/8 mile.

I did not want to post this because I did not want to start another Racetested bash thread. I do not blame RT for this issue.

 

Sal its so true on what you said... i remember those conversations to the this day i had with Captain Morgan, i mean Dr. Greenthumb, i mean Rob... Sal has always been a straight shooter with me. and my truck makes more then addequate power for now until i get the cash to do my build the RIGHT WAY... and take my time putting in nothing but the best parts on the market to insure my build.... Sal will continue to get my business no matter what Robs problems are.. Sal is a great tuner, regardless of 1 unsatisfied customer out of how many vehicles done by him? Sals tunes are on the money..

 

I could not have said that any better... I fully agree

Ya know, almost every nitrous user I know, and have ever talked with, always started very small, then built the spray up if everything seemed to be working right... then again, these where people who had a clue how to use spray

 

Either way, good luck with your build Rob. Hopefully everything works out for you in the end.