qiuckcanuck, sorry to here about engine. I currently have over 250 1/4 mi runs on my 2000 L. The only eng mods I have are 90mm MA. bassani headers, 6lb JL lower, Ele fan & water pump. FordChip reflash. I worked real hard to improve areo and weight and I run low to mid 12's all race season.The best is 12.29@112.34. The only things I've had to change is oil, spark plugs and one fuel filter. I think we nead to know our limitations. We drive and race fullsize trucks for god sake. And if you stop and think, RELIABLE 12's are remarkable. after that your screwing with the laws of physics. Hey 11's 10's and maybe 9's are fantastic. But damn expensive. 4200-4800lbs is the main problem is hard on parts. Well what ever it's just my thoughts. Ed

 

Why blame Diablo? Do you guys think that every motor comes perfect out of the factory? Look at my sig.

 

Sorry to hear about your motor. Thats sucks, but everybody is missing the real point here. IF YOU BLOW UP YOUR STOCK MOTOR IT'S THE BEST EXCUSE TO PUT A BAD *** BUILT ENGINE IN SO YOU CAN REALLY DO WHAT WE ALL WANT TO!!! GO REALLY REALLY FAST IN A SHORT TIME!!! Ford built a near 400hp motor that's smog legal its amazing they make it off the assembly line!! I'm station in England. $5 a gallan gas and $300 per year road tax. I think most Brits would cry if they heard about us bitching about blowing up our basically stock 450hp motors. They think that 2.5 liters are big.....

 

with a built block from JL, I assume that i can go a little crazy with what I put on it. Is it unreasonable to put a 6lb pulley, chip and cold air, ,port my s/c with Apten and top it off with a 100 shot of NOS from N/express?....am i pushing it too far and end up with same blown senario?

 

no, as long as your truck is tuned right......
hell I would do 150........

 

I am sorry to read about your block and I was impressed with the way you are dealing with it. It sure is refreshing to see someone take responsibility for the mods/risks we take on these trucks.


"edit" Sorry guys, I was thinking maybe we would turn this educational. I was out of my mind for a minute there.

Back to the usual F150 online, bitchin and whining. Now everyone give their opinion on who should warranty the darned engine, even though the originator never ask you your opinions of warranty.

Rocks

 

While I am sorry to hear of this happening to anyone, IMO if we wanna play, we gotta pay.

No way should Ford or Diable be responsible for the damage.

Neither manufacturer has control over the mod combination you installed so how can they be held responsible? If Diablo had installed and dyno tested all of you mods along with their chip then they would be in control and could possibly be held responsible.

There isn't a chip maker with this little intelligence.

How many race engine builders do you know of who offer an xxx lap or xxx pass warranty?

BTW, the "L" block is the same as the std F150 block.

 

I agree, and will add -- the stock rods are good for TWICE the boost that comes stock! That's pretty damn good in my book. You can run 16 PSIG of boost all day long -- if the tune is right.

I will repeat something from a previous post:

I would worry much less about a 6 lb pulley than I would with the tune. Even mild detonation causes forces an order of magnitude greater than even huge boost.

"Knock is virtually always the cause of failure in a supercharged engine." "The pressure spike caused by the [detonation] explosion can reach several thousand PSI, and pressure rise is rapid enough to be considered an impact load. These temperatures and pressures are almost ten times higher than those accompanying controlled combustion. . . No metals in existence today, no forged pistons, no special head gaskets can withstand sustained detonation."

Corky Bell, "Supercharged!: The Design, Testing, and Installation of Supercharger Systems," pp. 27, 178.

Further, the load on a rod is a mixture of tensile loads at the top of the compression and exhaust strokes and compressive loads during the power stroke. Yet on the power stroke, the compressive load of combustion helps to mitigate the tensile loads, which are unchecked during the exhaust stroke. Thus, the tensile loads on a con rod are greatest when at TDC on the exhaust stroke, where it is purely a function of piston weight, RPM, and stroke -- not boost.

Bottom line: At 14 PSIG, peak rod pressure is only up about 20%. See Bell, pp. 21-24. With detonation, peak rod pressure is up about 1,000%.

And detonation does not have to be audible to be damaging. Superchargers mask the sounds of detonation. And detonation strong enough to cause forces many times greater than normal combustion may not even be audible -- on an NA engine.

The Ford engineers use Kisler probes to watch cylinder pressures in real time. Detonation has a distinct pressure spike. This spike can be 100% greater than normal and still not be heard. Under these inaudible detonation conditions, if a rod is marginal, it will break. You now have a broken rod and no audible detonation. The stock rods are NOT weak -- they are just the weakest link in the chain. Be conservative with the tune and all should be fine.

 

That's true enough, but that would not necessarily solve the problem. Detonation will destroy any engine short of a top fueler.

If the rods were stronger, then it would be the crank or the pistons or the head gasket that would give under detonation. Then people would complain that the crank/pistons/head gasket is "weak." "Heck, for just a few dollars more, Ford could have given us better crank/pistons/head gasket/etc."

While I do agree that stronger rods might have been a better iidea (the Cobra seems to have them, so maybe Ford thought so), the rods are nowhere near failure mode on a stock L (as opposed to the tranny, which is).

Ford gave us a motor that will take sustained abuse if left stock. That is all we paid for.

 

 

It was cold here in GA yesterday and last night. Low 29 degrees.

My check engine light kept coming on, all day. I would stop once in a while and disconnect my battery to reset it. I decided to go by my local Ford dealer (Open on Sat. 8-5 pm) to let them hook up their scan tool and check the code(s). It showed a lean code on Bank 1 & 2. The tech told me I need to get a Cold weather program. See, I have my local dealer techs trained.

Pretty cold air last night, I should have went to the track.

I put 4 gallons of 100 octane from my local 76 station. I didn't want to change chips, and drove it last night and just didn't get on it that hard. So far, so good... 22,000 miles

 

Awesome post! This one needs to be saved and posted in response to all future "rod" whining.

 

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Tim Skelton
I agree, and will add -- the stock rods are good for TWICE the boost that comes stock! That's pretty damn good in my book. You can run 16 PSIG of boost all day long -- if the tune is right.

I will repeat something from a previous post:

I would worry much less about a 6 lb pulley than I would with the tune. Even mild detonation causes forces an order of magnitude greater than even huge boost.

"Knock is virtually always the cause of failure in a supercharged engine." "The pressure spike caused by the [detonation] explosion can reach several thousand PSI, and pressure rise is rapid enough to be considered an impact load. These temperatures and pressures are almost ten times higher than those accompanying controlled combustion. . . No metals in existence today, no forged pistons, no special head gaskets can withstand sustained detonation."

Corky Bell, "Supercharged!: The Design, Testing, and Installation of Supercharger Systems," pp. 27, 178.

Further, the load on a rod is a mixture of tensile loads at the top of the compression and exhaust strokes and compressive loads during the power stroke. Yet on the power stroke, the compressive load of combustion helps to mitigate the tensile loads, which are unchecked during the exhaust stroke. Thus, the tensile loads on a con rod are greatest when at TDC on the exhaust stroke, where it is purely a function of piston weight, RPM, and stroke -- not boost.

Bottom line: At 14 PSIG, peak rod pressure is only up about 20%. See Bell, pp. 21-24. With detonation, peak rod pressure is up about 1,000%.

And detonation does not have to be audible to be damaging. Superchargers mask the sounds of detonation. And detonation strong enough to cause forces many times greater than normal combustion may not even be audible -- on an NA engine.

The Ford engineers use Kisler probes to watch cylinder pressures in real time. Detonation has a distinct pressure spike. This spike can be 100% greater than normal and still not be heard. Under these inaudible detonation conditions, if a rod is marginal, it will break. You now have a broken rod and no audible detonation. The stock rods are NOT weak -- they are just the weakest link in the chain. Be conservative with the tune and all should be fine.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



I agree. Just when I thought this was becoming another useless thread....excellent post.


Rocks

 

Thanks, but be careful what you wish for. Could become as hated as "If you wanna play, . . ."

 

That Tim Skelton, he always backs his words with fact and never just opinion or here-say. And what he doesn`t know for sure, he just does his own research and testing. Good guy to have in this community.