Newbie chip question
Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 46
Likes: 0
From: Las Vegas NV
Tech articales wrinten by many mags are almost always driven by money.
I'm not saying this is the case here, But two people with nothing to gain and a dyno with printed dyno sheets is the real world!
I've seen way too many write up's that I know are not true as I know some of the people that were involved in the write up's.
I'm not saying this is the case here, But two people with nothing to gain and a dyno with printed dyno sheets is the real world!
I've seen way too many write up's that I know are not true as I know some of the people that were involved in the write up's.
Member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: Orlando ~ FL
In the past , there has never been enough controlled data - the dyno , the truck , the operation and and temps .
I am going to approach several manufacturers , and offer them the chance
to participate against ther competition in controlled environment and will give them the first look at the data .
I do not want any money like the mags , just unbiased and unpurchased
reporting not connected to monthly advertising .
Has anyone ever seen a TV show or a monthly mag that said some unkind about a sponsors product .
My plan is to have this data available at the SEMA Show in November .
.
I am going to approach several manufacturers , and offer them the chance
to participate against ther competition in controlled environment and will give them the first look at the data .
I do not want any money like the mags , just unbiased and unpurchased
reporting not connected to monthly advertising .
Has anyone ever seen a TV show or a monthly mag that said some unkind about a sponsors product .
My plan is to have this data available at the SEMA Show in November .
.
Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 46
Likes: 0
From: Las Vegas NV
I talked to troyer performance yestarday.
Wow 1 hr on the phone going over what I want to do with my truck and what I want to add.
Now with that said, I know you can't say the same for any other chip makers...
And now I will be ordering mine next week..
Thanks again....
Eddie
Still want to see the heads up tunes!!
Wow 1 hr on the phone going over what I want to do with my truck and what I want to add.
Now with that said, I know you can't say the same for any other chip makers...
And now I will be ordering mine next week..
Thanks again....
Eddie
Still want to see the heads up tunes!!
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,061
Likes: 0
From: Detroit Rock City
Originally Posted by exx
...These products produce I would bet the exact same horsepower as an xcal with a custom tune for less cost...
Originally Posted by Superchips_Distributor
Now, in terms of how we fared - the first truck up was Marc Carpenter's 2004 truck - and I will be VERY candid and tell you we had ENORMOUS problems getting the A/F ratios dialed in on that vehicle - in stock trim, in Open Loop it never got any richer than 14.2:1!!!! I do believe that this is a problem with Marc's truck, but in all fairness, with the vast amount of datalogging I did, and the many, many dyno pulls, etc., I really have not had time to sit down and analyze exactly what his truck was doing from back to front (meaning including the entire returnless fuel system). It was achieving a basic 39 PSI pressure drop across the injectors at idle & thru the lower range, but that did drop a bit as we got near the top - so we may need to take a look at some things there as time goes on, that we simply didn't have time for there on-site.
His LOWEST stock reading was actually below 200 Hp at the wheels, but we threw that out, and his average was about 210 HP, just as he said - he left with it at 250 HP & 300 lb/ft or torque at the wheels on his TOWING tune. Pretty sizable gains for a TOWING tune, I'd say - especially given the fact that I am STILL not 100% happy with his A/F's - after whacking the heck out of his TF, we finally got it down to a 12.5:1 on a commanded 12.0 - now this was after a total of 6 hours over 2 days on the dyno, his truck didn't "behave" well. So before we did any more work on it, I wanted some time to really analyze all his data, to see if we felt there was actually any issue with his truck, or was this a tuning software issue - and then if I feel the need, email him some further changes.
Next up was SKI - Shawn S., whose 2005 F-150 5.4 3V was up next - stock, it made about the same power as Marc's, though we did get one "fluke" run with a spike up to 222, we threw that out as it was not consistent, but a one-time deal - his truck was also running a HORRIBLE 15.0:1 A/F in stock trim - and according to the datalogs, that WAS with it transitioning over into Open Loop!!! His time was a bit tight, so there are some further changes I want to make and email to him, he left out of there at about 240 HP at the rear wheels but with an A/F of 13.0:1 until we approach the upper end of the rpm range, when it finally hit into the 12's - a very lazy transition over into Open Loop by the way the A/F's looked. Safe, to be sure, but not exactly what was being commanded.
By this time, I was beginning to suspect the new MAKO (Advantage 3,.0) tuning software had some issues, as it had received 4 major upgrades/updates just in the past week that we had not had a chance to test before dyno day - there just wasn't any time, especially given that the last update came the night before the dyno tests!! Now I have spoken in detail about this and sent all the data to one of the owners of SCT (David P.), and he is working with us right now to check to see what changes were actually made in the binary files, along with analyzing the reams of data we sent them - now this is going to take a while, obviously - probably a couple of weeks. So for the time being, we are going back to using Advantage 2.9 instead of Mako (Advantage 3.0), so we KNOW that we're getting what we command.
But even with the good power number gains, I suspect that we will most likely be emailing both Marc & Shawn some more new files, to get them even higher power gains. Getting 30 HP at the rear wheels on average was nice on the premium gas towing tunes, and it's about average for what we normally get on towing tunes - but I know a bit better was to be had.
Oh,. and what did the Superchips off-the-shelf Micro Tuners do? Well, fist, keep in mind that this was with NO adaptive time, and you MUST allow for adaptive to go to work to get maximum gains - just driving it 70 -100 miles usually results in 10-15 more RWHP, for example. For Marc's 2004 it added a grand total of about 5 RWHP on it's Towing tune - which does tend to add to my suspicion that there is something going on with Marc's truck, as they normally do significant better than that. And on Shawn S.'s 2005 F-150 it fared better, adding about 15 Hp at the rear wheels on it's towing tune without any adaptive time, which is about normal - we also did pulls on the performance tunes in those tuners, but as soon as I saw how Marc's truck just was not behaving correctly A/F-wise and not giving us as much fuel as I was commanding, I wanted to try to make it more fair and start comparing their "Towing" tunes to our "towing" tunes, since towing tunes command more fuel and all eyes are upon us (so to speak) here on the Internet.
So overall, I was happy with what the 1745 did for the 2005 truck, but of course we blew them away with roughly double their gains.
His LOWEST stock reading was actually below 200 Hp at the wheels, but we threw that out, and his average was about 210 HP, just as he said - he left with it at 250 HP & 300 lb/ft or torque at the wheels on his TOWING tune. Pretty sizable gains for a TOWING tune, I'd say - especially given the fact that I am STILL not 100% happy with his A/F's - after whacking the heck out of his TF, we finally got it down to a 12.5:1 on a commanded 12.0 - now this was after a total of 6 hours over 2 days on the dyno, his truck didn't "behave" well. So before we did any more work on it, I wanted some time to really analyze all his data, to see if we felt there was actually any issue with his truck, or was this a tuning software issue - and then if I feel the need, email him some further changes.
Next up was SKI - Shawn S., whose 2005 F-150 5.4 3V was up next - stock, it made about the same power as Marc's, though we did get one "fluke" run with a spike up to 222, we threw that out as it was not consistent, but a one-time deal - his truck was also running a HORRIBLE 15.0:1 A/F in stock trim - and according to the datalogs, that WAS with it transitioning over into Open Loop!!! His time was a bit tight, so there are some further changes I want to make and email to him, he left out of there at about 240 HP at the rear wheels but with an A/F of 13.0:1 until we approach the upper end of the rpm range, when it finally hit into the 12's - a very lazy transition over into Open Loop by the way the A/F's looked. Safe, to be sure, but not exactly what was being commanded.
By this time, I was beginning to suspect the new MAKO (Advantage 3,.0) tuning software had some issues, as it had received 4 major upgrades/updates just in the past week that we had not had a chance to test before dyno day - there just wasn't any time, especially given that the last update came the night before the dyno tests!! Now I have spoken in detail about this and sent all the data to one of the owners of SCT (David P.), and he is working with us right now to check to see what changes were actually made in the binary files, along with analyzing the reams of data we sent them - now this is going to take a while, obviously - probably a couple of weeks. So for the time being, we are going back to using Advantage 2.9 instead of Mako (Advantage 3.0), so we KNOW that we're getting what we command.
But even with the good power number gains, I suspect that we will most likely be emailing both Marc & Shawn some more new files, to get them even higher power gains. Getting 30 HP at the rear wheels on average was nice on the premium gas towing tunes, and it's about average for what we normally get on towing tunes - but I know a bit better was to be had.
Oh,. and what did the Superchips off-the-shelf Micro Tuners do? Well, fist, keep in mind that this was with NO adaptive time, and you MUST allow for adaptive to go to work to get maximum gains - just driving it 70 -100 miles usually results in 10-15 more RWHP, for example. For Marc's 2004 it added a grand total of about 5 RWHP on it's Towing tune - which does tend to add to my suspicion that there is something going on with Marc's truck, as they normally do significant better than that. And on Shawn S.'s 2005 F-150 it fared better, adding about 15 Hp at the rear wheels on it's towing tune without any adaptive time, which is about normal - we also did pulls on the performance tunes in those tuners, but as soon as I saw how Marc's truck just was not behaving correctly A/F-wise and not giving us as much fuel as I was commanding, I wanted to try to make it more fair and start comparing their "Towing" tunes to our "towing" tunes, since towing tunes command more fuel and all eyes are upon us (so to speak) here on the Internet.
So overall, I was happy with what the 1745 did for the 2005 truck, but of course we blew them away with roughly double their gains.
Senior Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 576
Likes: 0
From: Alabama
Am I understanding this correctly, the Superchips requires multiple drive cycles(how many is just a guess) to achieve max performance, but the Xcal doesn't?
Does the Xcal somehow override adaptive strat or change it in someway?
Educate me, please.
Joey
Does the Xcal somehow override adaptive strat or change it in someway?
Educate me, please.
Joey
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 2
From: NEVADA
jward - The xc2 also requires " adaptive time " for optimum performance.
My instructions from Troyer said 4 -6 runs at the strip, and a few( cant remeber # ) drive cycles, but it is mostly there when you first flash.
By the way - My azz dyno says about a week for max perf
My instructions from Troyer said 4 -6 runs at the strip, and a few( cant remeber # ) drive cycles, but it is mostly there when you first flash.
By the way - My azz dyno says about a week for max perf
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,061
Likes: 0
From: Detroit Rock City
Originally Posted by raider
Mike and myself are best buds 
Originally Posted by Superchips_Distributor
Hey Raider,
I've told you before, and this is your last warning - keep it up and you will face legal action.
I've told you before, and this is your last warning - keep it up and you will face legal action.
Suspended
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 638
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by Superchips_Distributor
Hey Raider,
I've told you before, and this is your last warning - keep it up and you will face legal action.
Bring it...I have already had a attorney look over everything(its nice to be married to a attorney)
Hey Raider,
I've told you before, and this is your last warning - keep it up and you will face legal action.
Bring it...I have already had a attorney look over everything(its nice to be married to a attorney)