Now we can move on and talk about the complexity of the additional cooling and oiling systems needed for the turbochargers?

Should we count each individual ball bearing in the turbo as a moving part that can fail?
And the internal turbo seals?
And the wastegate (BOV) linkage parts
And the CAC ducting (dont forget all the clamps)
And the mechanical vacuum pump
And the DI fuel pumps and high pressure lines and fittings
And the etc etc etc

 

Mawnin'!

Yer as tenacious as a hungry badger, Patrick. I admire yer spirit (If not yer math )

A Q, if I may - do 5.0's have CMCV's or equivalents? Extry butterflies?



MGD

 

Don’t know about that but I blew out a triple bypass perpendicular valve once. It was not pretty.

 

Bypass surgery???

MGD

 

lol. No. Its a made up part we used to joke about selling back in my mechanic days. Kinda like muffler bearings.

 

Not familiar with CMCV acronym
You mean like the IMRC? I don't believe they are using that. The VVT is a better solution

 

My advice: Don't buy either one until you have driven them both at least TWICE, a few days apart. Both are wonderful, both will do the job, and it comes down to which you like the best. Has anyone told you how great the 5.0 sounds? Has anyone told you how hard the ego-boost pulls? Get the picture?

 

True the valve seal doesn't really move but the valve sildes through it up to 7,000 time a minute each direction. They can wear out and make for a nice blue cloud on cold starts so I included them.

The 5.0 uses a lifter/lash adjuster Part Number:BR3Z-6500-A . I've seen in refered to as both.



Sure if I can count the individual part on the roller rocker arms etc and other non-moving parts. Doing that pushes the count to around 80 parts per cylinder in just the head and pistons/rods.

I've seen quite a few turbo cars and the oil lines very rarely leak unless someone messes with them and screws them up. Most of the oil lines are o-ring with a bolted flange or a banjo bolt. Are you worried about your brake lines randomly leaking? They use the same type of connection except the engine oil is under a lot less pressure.

CAC pipes don't move, wear out or break unless you let a monkey with a sawzall loose under your hood.

The DI uses AN fittings which are rated at 3750 PSI. The port injected FI used on the 5.0 has a nearly one for one parts interchange with the DI used on the EB. Except for the HPFP and it uses better hardware from the HPFP to the injectors to deal with the higher fuel pressures. To me that's pretty much a wash. Did you know the 5.0 heads were designed around a DI injector as a future upgrade?

It all seems to come to as you put it, "Haven't been sold on EB " technology ". For me, I've seen this exact same stuff used for a long time on the German cars so it's more like Ford is playing catch up not breaking ground. The K03 turbos on the EB are also on my S4 which started production in 1999. The turbo design has been around a whole lot longer than that. The Bosch DI system has been used on German stuff for a long time too. I have seen these cars with 200,00-300,000 miles on them and still running strong.

If you want to know more about the 5.0, here's a great article on it. While it might seem like I hate the 5.0, I don't. I think it's a great motor and would like to use one in a project car. However, in a truck the EB does the job better. If your truck said EcoBoost on the side you would have that extra grunt in 6th. (hahah I had to do it )

 

Camshaft > rocker arm > retainer on valve spring

Not sure where the lifters lash adjuster is supposed to fit in there?

 

It's laid out differently, the lifter/lash adjusters are at one end of the rocker arm with a bucket to help locate the two parts together. The other end of the rocker arm sits on the valve. The cam rides on the roller in the center of the rocker arm. There's a couple of pics in the article I linked that show the parts and the assembled heads. Once you see the pics it should clear things up.

 

I realize Ford designed the truck to be tough, and issues rarely come up. I was making that argument based on the argument of "three more sensors" "no big deal"

When was the last time you've heard of an engine going south because of a faulty rod cap, or rod bolt? I don't start my truck in the morning and say "damn I sure hope all 16 of my rod bolts are still tight in there"


My point on the "technology" is just that, it's nothing new, but all the EB fan boys a get hard on thinking about it.
There's a reason why 1980s turbo cars were piles of junk and they quit doing turbos for a while, it left a sour taste in everyone's mouth.

I seriously wonder how many trucks ford would sell if they advertised them as V6 turbo instead of the EB name plate. I bet the average EB owner just does a butt dyno or listens to their sales man and buys into it as a huge upgrade on power/economy
I've heard of customers not knowing EB was a V6. And Ford's advertising can be confusing "power of 8 cylinders with economy of V6"



While it may sound like I'm a huge EB basher, I'm not. It's not my cup of tea, everyone is entitled to an opinion. I honestly think overall EB is good, Ford wouldn't put it in their bread and butter F150 if it was a pile of S***
I do like Ford's branding of the EB name, since so far it's been a pretty good span of engines. Good branding helps build customer interest and support, which helps big brand Ford

 

Gotcha makes sense. Then my point is still valid, lash adjuster is a non moving part. I wouldn't call it a lifter for sure.

 

Bottom line for me is how long they last on the street. If they both last 250k miles with minimal repairs, the ecoboost seems to be the way to go. But, if the 5.0 typically lasts 100k miles longer then the 5.0 is the way to go. Time will tell.

 

First off, this web site sucks monkey ***** to use on a phone! Once again it crapped out on me in the middle of a response. Here’s the more abridged version 2.0…



Nope, the lash adjuster is two parts. One is fixed and has an oil feed port that pushes the other part up to keep tension on the rocker arm. I’d bet there’s a strong possibility of a spring being in there too. There’s movement there, just not as much as a piston traveling up and down. Speaking of pistons moving up and down at 7,000RPM, that puts a lot of tension on the rod bolts. I have seen them fail and when they do it’s not pretty at all. It’s not a common problem but high RPMs do increase the chances of this occurring. People on here especially love to go on like the EB has more sensors than an F22 and the Space Shuttle combined when in fact they only have three more than the other trucks do and share quite a few. Two temperature sensors and a pressure sensor really aren’t complicated or pushing the envelope. In fact, I’d much rather have the MAP the EB uses vs the MAF the rest of the trucks have. The MAP is a lot cheaper and less prone to failure. Plus, these sensors will not stop the truck from running. It might run pretty rough and light the dash up like a Christmas tree but it will still run. The prices I’ve seen on them really aren’t bad. The sensor argument is completely based in unfounded hysteria not fact.



I completely agree that EB is much more about branding than new tech. But it really seems to be working quite well. There are a whole lot of customers that are completely satisfied with the engine, completely unphased by the missing spark plugs. If a customer is happy with the product they bought are they getting cheated if they don’t understand everything about it? I’d say if that was the case there wouldn’t be many cars on the road.



It’s working so well GM even stole the concept with the new 4.3 and 5.3 and added Ecosomething to the name. Talk about riding on coat tails! A friend of mine that is a die hard GM guy had to borrow my truck to tow his wife’s car home. He even said that as much as it hurt his feelings the EB was miles better than the 5.3 he owns. If he had to buy a new truck he might even do the unthinkable and get a Ford.

 

I had a good friend go with me to get my 14. He owns a 13 Silverado and now he is trying to trade it in on an F-150. And all he did was ride home with me in my truck. And its not an Ecoboost.