ok, i have used the search button. couldnt find what is the maximum rpm are trucks can run. Im getting a tunner soon, right now my truck shifts at 5000 rpm, that sucks seeing as how im just now hitting that 300 hsp, will a tunner from mike raise that to 6000 or 6500? i know the tunner makes a huge diffrence throughout the band, but i personally think the band needs to be larger, if it could shift at say 6000 rpm, maybe 6500, our trucks would be haulin, flat out . does the excal 2 do this. I know they can tune it for whatever, but i also know there is only so much an engine can handle.

If a tunner doesnt work, what would raise the shift point to say 6000 or 6500 rpm.

Thansk guys
Bo

 

I don't have a tuner, so I don't know how high he raises the RPMs to, I would also like to know, but I would definetly not go pass 7,000. It's good to see somebody other than me, that knows in order to feel and get the full power (300HP)out of our trucks, you need to raise the RPMs. Unless you get a SC. Other people on here think you need gears to get the trucks faster, and I agree you need better gears along the way, but gears has nothing to do with getting better race performance out of your truck, ya with the gears you'll get off the line quicker but you'll still never going to get the 300HP out with just gears. To find out what RPM the Xcal2 go's to, I would just call mike and chat with him about it.

 

You need to get gears to understand the difference. [That is ALL i am going to say, i wont bash you]

The engine produces peak horsepower *around* 5000RPM and going over you wont see a difference; it is best to shift 300+/- RPMs OVER PEAK HP. So if you get your truck tuned and peak HP is say 4800, then the shift point would be 5100.

 

Asinatra- I said gears help and they help a lot, I know that, but you'll feel your gears down low just like TQ, not up high like HP, so just like TQ, your gears only matter (in a race) untill 3rd gear, then it's all about HP, as for the peak being at 5,000 I wouldn't know cause I never saw a dyno of a stock 5.4, do you know where I can find one. But this is my first truck, so i am only comparing this to cars.

 

Also isn't this the only vehicle that it's peak power rating is at it's shift point, I just don't know any other vehicle that has the same thing, does all fords do the same thing. I had two hondas before this truck and my first one shift about 800RPMs over it's peak rating, and my second one shift 1,400 over it's peak rating. I had drove nissans, toyotas, dodges and couple other makes and all shifts over it's peak power rating. So is ford the only car company that does this.

 

Even if that was true, which it's not, my truck is running 87mph when it shifts into 3rd gear. By the time you reach that speed, the race is over.

 

true, the race is over by 80 somodd mph, but i want to get all i can out of that first gear, if i add gears, its just going to make me rev faster and shift at a lower speed, our trucks would be so much faster if they shifted at say 6000 or 6500 rpms like the dodge hemis do, we would actually be able to keep up with them better.

If a tune cant do this, what can? MIKE??

 

Please explain how it would be faster, there is a thing called PEAK HP. If we reach this PEAK HP at 5000 RPMs what is the point of going over another 1000 RPMs. Do you understand that our stock gears max out at 180ish[forgot the real numbers but its around there]. Our trucks cant even go that fast with the power they have, that would mean gears are THE best recommendation.

If your going to make positive statements about a dodge you might as well buy one.

 

I don't think they would be 'quicker' if they shifted at 6500. Once you hit peak horsepower, you want it to shift. Over revving does jack for acceleration.

Asinatra has it right, 300 or so RPM over peak is where it's at. Any quarter mile racer can tell you that.

I think you are caught up in the RPM comparison, which is not important.

Your RPM numbers being high mean nothing. A rotary motor shifts at 7000+, as do some 4 cyls. They make very little torque or actual horsepower.

A big block Chevy will blow your doors off, and never need to shift over 5k.

It's like on a computer, it's not the MHZ that matter, it's how quickly it accomplishes it's tasks. A 3000 is not as fast as a 2300... Different processors, one pushes more data (think torque) at 2300 than the other does at 3000.


Like saying if you hit something with a big slow 458 Winchester Magnum slug, it's gonna go down a lot harder than with a 220 Swift at twice the velocity.

It's the amount of 'work' done, not the speed by itself.
Chris

 

Not personal to this thread, just to math/power curve discussions in general;

Give it up, Asinatra , I spent days being flamed for trying to explain why most OD vehicles can actually attain higher speeds in third than in fourth.

I can not believe how many people can not do simple math, or understand what a power curve is.

It's shocking to me how many people will argue on something that they have no understanding of.

Not the usual discussions between differences in degree, or real world vs. theory, but plain old basics.

Oh well.

Chris

 

I bite. I wanna know more about this. No flames, just the facts & formulas. Got a thread I can start at? Was it recent? Was the topic OD? What can I search on to find this interesting info?

 

i understand what you are saying i guess, im just going on seat of the pants feeling here, it seems my truck will pull real hard at takeoff and slowdown through the band, and then around 4700 rpms pull hard again, its weird. i just thought that if it reved higher, i would see that same "pull" for a bit longer ya know. So does the excalibur 2 fix this slow period from 2500-4700 rpm, that is where my truck is a dog?

as far as gears go, would that just bring my torque curve down so it would pull harder through this range between 2500-4700?

you guys got me confussed now lolol

"Black Panther, its got real bits of black panther in it, works 100% of the time 60% of the time" Ron Burgandy

 

Bite all you want, I'm going to the beach!! Loading the motorhome between posts, and checking e-mail.

Just for you, big D, Your engine makes torque and horsepower at certain RPM's. This will vary based on 44 major criteria, little things like exhaust scavenging, cam lift, duration, length of runners, etc. etc, plus another 40 items.

You can go as fast as you want, till the wind resistance stops you. Or you 'float your valves' or in some other way hit the limit of your motor to increase RPM's.

You have a peak power point, where you make the most horsepower (Just gonna skip torque for brevity’s sake).
Below that peak you make less horsepower. Duh.

Go far enough below that, you make so little horsepower you can't move the truck, say at 550 RPM. Not a lot of power there, Eh?
At say 2000 RPM you make enough power to cruise nicely.

So say the engine can make 300 horsepower at 5000 RPM. Just a number at random, please, not to be applied to anything but the argument.

Say you have 3.55 gears and 35 inch tires. This makes you pretty tall geared. So assume you make 35 mph per 1000 RPM. A common number from Road and Tracks columns.

So you can go 5000 rpm, times 35 mph. that is 175…
So why can’t you go 175?
Wind resistance, of course.
Maybe you can do 105, that’s at 3000 rpm.
Again, this is generic; I don’t care what an individual truck/car whatever does or can do. We are talking math and power curve, not F150’s.

Now just for the sake of argument, assume your next lower gear is, say, direct drive. In direct drive this vehicle goes 25 mph per thousand rpm’s. So at 105 you are turning 4200 rpm. You are well under the maximum rpm for the motor, and you are much further up the power band, thus making far more horsepower.

At 3000 rpm your engine is making say, 180 horsepower about halfway between the bottom (50 say, at 600, and 300 at 5000) so wind resistance stops your 180 horsepower at 105 miles an hour.

At 4200 you are making 250 horsepower on the curve. That overcomes the wind resistance, allowing you to go up to 120, where you are at 4800 RPMs making 295 horsepower.

These are just example numbers.
My favorite example is the 6 speed when it first came out it the Corvette. All the mags tested it, and it was fastest in 4th gear. Second fastest in fifth, and finally sixth had the same top speed as 3rd.

Of course the reason is obvious, the higher gears are there, just like our top gear, for gas mileage at cruise, not top speed.

This is right on the bottom of ‘understanding gearing, powercurves and performance’.

Asinatra can fill in the blanks, if he wants.

Off to the beach!!!

 

What engine and gears do you have factory; how much are you willing to spend ?

 

Well it's like I said my other two cars peak power was way above it's red line, I never saw a dyno on these trucks yet, you guys keep saying it's peak power is at 5,000 RPMs do you guys know a site that has one, so I can see for my one eye's. I love this truck but if you guys are right about the peak being at 5,000 RPMs then that sucks cause all the other competiters peaks are all higher than that, which means if the after market world gets better for them like it is for us now, then we are doomed.