I heard/read from about every source so far, but you, to ground the radiator. If there's a ground problem somewhere (instead of the water problem) grounding the radiator is a big fat band-aid. BUT, with that said, I will ground it just to recheck the voltage and see what happens. Does it mean anything if the voltage does or doesn't change??

Thanks jbrew...guess I've got my project for today. I guess with the battery, alternator, and e-fans removed, I did completely eliminate everything other than KAM items, hu???

 

OK...this changed nothing. As did pulling every single fuse in the truck...voltage never changed. Battery disconnected, PCM fuses pulled, radio fuses pulled, no change. Checked all the ground connections you mentioned..SOLID.

OK...getting back to some basics here because this has me stumped!! Short of a ph (or coolant) problem, there has to be something, some item, component, or something, to generate that voltage that's being picked up on the volt meter. If it were some electrical device supplying the charge, I would think you'd loose that voltage the moment you ran across the right fuse...especially with the battery completely (pos & neg) disconnected.

Also on a side note...I have very very little anti-freeze in the truck. As mentioned, 99% distilled water and Water Wetter. Would this be a contributor?? Would anti-freeze add something to this puzzle??

Also...during cranking, and only while the starter is running, the voltage jumps up to .6. Once you release the key (starter disengages) the voltage immediately returns to .29. Does this mean anything??

 

I'd give the system a good flushing and get the water wetter out of it. It has been known to cause corrosion/electrolysis issues with aluminum cores. I'd also check with a different meter as you keep getting the same results-.29vdc. The radiator is grounded already via the coolant and on thru the engine strap. Make sure to check the engine strap if you haven't already.

 

Do you have the Troyer fans that run rods through the radiator?

 

Wow, I dunno - Yea , make sure your meters ok . That's pretty easy to check. A digital meter never seems to last me long lol. I end up falling back on one of three Analog meters I've had forever. Strange as it sounds , I trust those more than any digital meter I've had in the past. That may be because I haven't had a real good digital meter yet.

You are reading +.29 /not -.29 correct ?

Good luck, I don't know. Double check that meter - Flip it to OHMS and see what you get looping the probes together. That's one way.

Mann, if you have that much current - enough to fry a radiator that quick. Keep a good eye on your intake gaskets - right in front. This problem will eat the block - not kidding!! By both front water jackets . Block pitting is common and more pronounce with your problem. Watch for leaks there.

You have to get that current down somehow - theres other BAD issues that occure from this , over time.

Good Luck Galaxy

 

Never heard that one before?? I know tons of people that have been using it for years and that's a first. Especially since Water Wetter is supposed to combat this very problem. At this point, I wont discard any advice though.

Repetitive results seems to be a good indicator to me. I've tested the meter out on other electrical sources and the readouts seem to be sound!

Checked all grounds on the whole truck...everything's good!!! Could not find any evidence of any faults or bad grounds.

Yes...but they are 100% plastic rods. I bought them after the fact and they are not the ones that came with his fans.


Yes... +.29 vdc I know because when I compared to my dads '07, he had a -.15. It was readily noticeable.

Anyone have an opinion on why the voltage jumps up to .6 during cranking??

 

That's alright, it will increase to whip the beast over; , in other words.. -When the ignition key is turned to the start position, current flows and energizes the starter's solenoid coil. The energized coil becomes an electromagnet which pulls the plunger into the coil, the plunger closes a set of contacts which allow high current to reach the starter motor. Your meter is picking that up, it's normal.
__________________________________________________ ___________________________

I think I might try flushing it again, while everything is disconnected - Pull the block plug tho (Drivers side, 6" above the oil pan, toward the rear)- so you have two airways into it while flushing. I really wouldn't worry about tap water yet - although it's better, I don't feel you need to use until after the problems been resolved. Anyway , flush while everything is disconnected / then refill / get a new reading. Any change? If so, bring it back on-line/ one circuit/accessory at a time, until your reading changes in order to isolate the bad circuit.

As far as grounding, I would think your fine; Labnerd mentioned the strap, you also have your coolers keeping you grounded. The power steering and if your running a trans cooler , which I'm almost positive that you are, you should have a good channel grounds via trans support and front axle.

I guess my question in all of this is what happens to the fluid once it's energized, after taking the source away ? That's the reason I suggest the above; I'm not sure. I know low SR Caps (capacitors)are made of the same metals as your radiator and use an electrolyte formula inside the shell. Once you have this presence, you may be storing it's energy. In essence, your radiator has a very similar makeup or ingredients as a capacitor.

Maybe Labnerd or someone who knows more about Elec -Engineering can expand on that theory. If not , yea, I would start from 0/ w/fresh fluid and work you way up.

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BTW - You know the bleeding (Burping) Procedure? If not -

BLEEDING COOLING SYSTEM


Filling

1. Add the proper engine coolant mixture to the degas bottle.
2. Move the temperature blend selector to the full warm position.
3. Run the engine until it reaches operating temperature.
4. Add the proper engine coolant mixture to the degas bottle until the coolant level is between the "COOLANT FILL LEVEL" marks.
5. Turn off the engine and allow the cooling system to cool.
6. Repeat Steps 1 through 5 until the degas bottle level is OK.

Bleeding

1. Select maximum heater temperature and blower motor speed settings. Position control to discharge air at A/C vents in the instrument panel.
2. Start engine and allow to idle. While engine is idling, feel for hot air at A/C vents.

CAUTION: If the air discharge remains cool and the engine coolant temperature gauge does not move, the engine coolant level is low in the engine and must be filled. Stop the engine, allow to cool and fill the cooling system as described.

3. Start the engine and allow to idle until normal operating temperature is reached. Hot air should discharge from the A/C vents. The engine coolant temperature gauge should maintain a stabilized reading in the middle of the NORMAL range and the upper radiator hose should feel hot to the touch.
4. Shut the engine off and allow it to cool.
5. Check the engine for coolant leaks.
6. Check the engine coolant level in the degas bottle and fill as necessary.

BUT - When you fill/leave the top hose disconnected until you see the coolant start to make it's way out. That bleeds the block good. Then connect and fill to the the mark. and follow the procedure.

 

The voltage is created in the radiator. Your fluid is the electrolyte and you have dissimilar metals in the system. It is a simple battery. It has nothing to do with your fans or anything in your electrical system and as you showed you still have some voltage when the battery is disconnected. KAM has nothing to do with it either.

 

Would it be possible to put a grounding clip on the aluminum top frame of the radiator to chassis ground? With that much volume a braided ground strap might be more appropriate.

 

A Capacitors electrolyte can be stored in an aluminum can. Are you saying there's no aluminum in a radiator?


Soooo, do you have any ideas what it could be ?


That's cheating lenore - This has got my interest , from all I've read - They say it's a bad idea to go that route unfortunately.


Galaxy : I found something that explains a little better what Norm is talking about, he's got it right. Read This -

http://voltagedrop.biz/

 

Did the coolant system get flushed when the rad was replaced? If not do it. It has been charged and is now useless. BTW less than .3 volts is acceptable. Your .29 is at the very limit. Mine is .22 off and with all accessories running. It spikes to .32 when the engine is started. That is above the threshold. It needs to be corrected. I am in no great rush as it is only .02 over the limit.

FWIW
I have an extra ground from the engine front cover to the battery. I have a winch which runs a ground from the battery to the winch motor. I have also rewired the AC/Heater fan motor to run the speed control before the motor in the circuit. This allows any static electricity caused by the fan blades to go directly to ground and not through the heater core. Running a ground wire to the rad will only shorten the path that any stray electrical current has to run to go to ground. Expect to see a hole where the ground connects to the rad. Clean the alternator mount bolts to insure proper ground. Clean both the ground terminals at the starter. The one at the starter mount bolt and the one at the frame. I

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier

 

Read my post again.
A capacitor my well have an aluminum can but it works differently than a battery. Capacitors store a charge by two plates separated by a dielectric compound that varies by type of capacitor.
Batteries produce a charge using an electrolyte and 2 or more dissimilar metals.


Read my post again.

Edit: I see you figured it out.

 

FWIW, here's a link that shows what water wetter can do to aluminum. The pics at the bottom show corrosion on the aluminum strip with WW in the coolant. I had the same issue you are having in a 2000 Dakota with a highly modded 3.9 V6 that I built for a guy. The aluminum core only lasted two weeks and had lots of pin holes. We eliminated the WW and the problem was over. We used the two part DuPont radaitor flush but I'm not sure its available on the market anymore but it requires an aggresive cleaner to get rid of it. It will never see anything of mine or anything I'm working on again.
Sorry I couldn't find any better of a link for you. While its not totally representative, it mirrors the issues I had with this guys Dodge.
http://www.jjoseph.org/water_cooling...ctrolysis.html

 

this is facinating, I have never heard of measuring the voltage. If you take a coolant tester and read specific gravity, and make sure it is in the proper range is that all that is necessary???

 

Hey Galaxy, here's the MSDS for Water Wetter:
http://www.redlineoil.com.au/Uploads...uro%207_01.pdf

I was trying to remember all the issues I had with it and here's the scoop. WW will bring more salts to the coolant. Anything over a PH7 and you have battery salts. You probably need to check the PH. Also note the last component on the materials list. The Tolyltriazol Polysiloxane Polymer will bond with any and all rubber and plastic parts in the system. Removal is either with an acid based cleaner or parts replacement. This stuff is worse than cancer to try to get rid of. Now I remember why I don't like this stuff.