Venting helps but it usually gets you nothing but high blood pressure. If we truly do have 3000 + members why couldnt we get a petition up of as many owners of this engine as possible. Not just F150's but all vehicles with this engine. Send to FOMOCO....BBB...NHTSA or anyone else we can think of. This is gonna have to go higher up in order to get any results. As a group I'm sure we would be more recognized than individuals complaining 1 at a time. After so many sign there's bound to be a lawyer or firm maybe take notice and get in on the game for a class action suit. If Ford dont want to take care of business then put them under. Why would anyone give a crap bout how it hurts Ford when its obvious they dont take care of who keeps them in business. If this doesnt get any attention then why go on with this. Just bend over and take your tea.

 

I agree, somebody with savy create a online petition, I will sign it... If one of you have Ford Stock, you can petition to bring it up at the next stockholders meeting, That is a forum Ford doesnt want to have.

 

the people that desreve dignity and respect get it from me.
in general the Ford store service personnelwhere I have bought at least 4 vehicle are idiots!

case in point when I bought my Cobra I also bought the alarm sytem which the dealer had to install. I brought the car home twice and the system wasn't installed. I calmly called my saleman and he took care of the problem including picking up my car at work.

just one example there are several others where they have demonstrated incompetence. large hammer marks on irs aluminum suspension components where the hammer monkey should have used a tie rod seperator (not a pickle fork or hammer) to take the rearend apart.

you may be the exception

 

Joe
With the number of posts you have, you surprise me. You sound just like that Service Manager that tried the usual smoke signals just to get me off the phone.
To me your post said nothing except that FordMoCo is not liable for a faulty, simple piece of equipment like a spark plug that has been around since the Model T in 1925.

 

Thats 2 including me and its a start. Come on they gotta be somebody here that has the know how that can get this started. Put a team together. Get the word out to other forums and get their members to sign up. I know all vehicles have problems but this is costing people thousands of dollars just for a simple spark plug change.Took a look at the members list and there are a lot of smart computer savvy people that belong to this forum. I bet every 1 of them love their trucks and wanna keep it. If its money we need to do this also it wouldnt be much for everybody to pitch in 1 dollar a piece.

 

I purchased my 04 F150 3 months ago with 62,000 miles on it! I sure wish their was someway I could find out if the plugs have already been changed! I will be getting them changed after I move to Utah next month! I will be letting the dealer change them and if one of the plugs get's broken and they try to make me bend over and take a long shaft in the rear for something that's not my fault then you can bet your money ya'll will be seeing me on national tv! I have been a life long FORD inthusiast but something as simple as a spark plug change should not have the possibility in resulting in a $3,000 repair bill! If I had read about this problem before purchasing my truck I might have not bought it, I know that no vehicle is perfect and that other manufacturer's have problem's too! It's just pathetic that Ford has overlooked this design flaw and hasn't tried to do anything about the problem! After reading some of the experiences people on this forum has had with their local dealer's breaking plugs then looking at the owner and going oops you now need to hand us a couple thousand dollars so we can pull your engine to remove a spark plug that's just bull**** and someone needs to finally stand up and give Ford the shaft for the stupid design of these sparkplug's! Get a petition started and i'll gladly sign my name!

 

Legally, Ford is *NOT* liable - unless the NHTSA considers it a SAFETY issue. Then they can force a recall. It's simply a bad design, and Ford is not backing up their dealers adequately and/or there are too many dealers out there that don't care. Some dealers are being good about it and eating the labor time to extract broken plugs, others could care less about their customers. You have to remember that a dealership is an independent business that has a franchise to sell and service Ford vehicles, they are not owned by FoMoCo.

 

Franchise or note, there is still a vital connection b/n the two. They work together as FMC to sell and service particular make cars and trucks. Either way, we consumers will be pointing fingers at someone and if the sh-t runs downhill then it will start with the dealership service departments who take a good working truck in for "Routine Maintanance" and come back to the constomer saying somethings broke now and they will have to pay to fix it. The dealership service departments should have forced the issue with FMC if nothing more than to REFUSE to change the plugs on this engine unless FMC agrees to chip in and help them out should more time and resources be involved with broken plugs. I say "should have" in the past tense b/c most service departments know this is a possible disaster waiting to happen and have known about it for quite some time. The service departments should throw it back in FMC's face and make them get involved or else. Think how it would look for FMC should the dealerships refuse to change out the plugs until FMC comes up with a more suitable solution. Think what the local TV and newspaper would think and have to write about. FMC would have to be a little more proactive. Problem is, many to most dealerships don't give a rats **** about the customer after the sale, many times even within the warranty period. It's not just FMC, they all have a tendancy to be this way. It's just with the plug issue, the obvious is becoming ridiculously seen.

 

 

I cannot stress enough if anybody has a bad experience with bringing in their Ford truck for routine tune up, consisting of a simple plug change, & it goes into a dealership running fine, & then they break it....bad plug design or not, the consumer should in NO WAY be responsible for this poor design! Contact you local consumer advocate reporter of your local news station & have them do a story on it! Around here all of the Big Three News stations, have one, & thrive on this stuff! I would love to see the look on a dealers face when a news van pulls up with a camera & reporter asking questions on your behalf.........

 

Read the whole TSB!

Man I am I miss reading something here, or are you guys missing it???

I took my 04 in for a plug change. I usually do this myself but had read so much on here about the plug issue I decided to let Ford do it. I asked the service advisor if he was aware of problems with the plug breakage. He said that he was aware of it and there was a TSB from Ford on it. I directly asked him who pays if they break them. He smirked and told me that I would be responsible for any breakage. I whipped out my copy of the TSB and pointed out the waranty text on the TSB. His whole demeanor changed and he said it would be taken care of. If I read the TSB corectly Ford is stepping up and covering this. Its just the Stealerships not taking the right stand. I believe the emmision coverage is 100,000 miles(correct me if I am wrong). So most everyone should be covered on this. Information when dealing with these kinds of issues is invaluable.

This is straight out of the TSB on

WARRANTY STATUS: Eligible Under Provisions Of
New Vehicle Limited
Warranty Coverage And
Emissions Warranty
Coverage
IMPORTANT: Warranty
coverage limits/policies are
not altered by a TSB.
Warranty coverage limits NOTE
are determined by identified causal part.


OPERATION DESCRIPTION TIME INSTALLED TIME
MT080109 Claim Labor As Actual Actual
Time Time
DEALER CODING
CONDITION
BASIC PART NO. CODE
12405 01

 

Question is does the plugs fit into the emissions warranty category and if so, is it really 100k. I would think a one piece, easy to change plug, will arrive before many 04's reach 100k that will resolve any further problem if changed more frequently and with the antiseize applied. Problem is for us who are waiting as FMC recommends to have the crappy plugs changed. FMC should, like many have stated, at least cover the first change-out should disaster strike. After that, the new plugs should fix the problem....

 

Emissions warranty is 8/80 and typically covers federally mandated emissions equipment (like catalytic converters). I don't know if plugs count as emissions components.

 

From the online Warranty Manual

Spark Plugs are covered!

http://www.fordvehicles.com/assets/p...1&zoom=100,0,0

EMISSIONS DEFECT WARRANTY COVERAGE
During the warranty coverage period, Ford Motor Company warrants
that:
• your vehicle or engine is designed, built, and equipped to meet - at
the time it is sold - the emissions regulations of the U.S. Environmental
Protection Agency (EPA).
• your vehicle or engine is free from defects in factory-supplied materials
or workmanship that could prevent it from conforming with applicable
EPA regulations.
• you will not be charged for diagnosis, repair, replacement, or adjustment
of defective emissions-related parts listed under What is Covered?
on pages 20-21.


WHAT IS COVERED?
These parts are covered by both the Emissions Defect Warranty and the
Emissions Performance Warranty.
List of Parts Covered by Emissions Warranties For Cars,
Light Duty Trucks and Heavy Duty Vehicles
• Air Flow Sensor
• Air/Fuel Feedback Control
System and Sensors
• Air Induction System
• Attitude Compensation System
• Catalytic Converter
• Cold Start Enrichment System
• Cold Start Fuel Injector
• Controls for Deceleration
• Electronic Ignition System
• Exhaust Pipe (Manifold to
Catalyst)
• Electronic Engine Control
Sensors and Switches
• Electronic Engine Control
Unit (ECU)
• Emissions Labels
• Evaporative Emission Control
System
• Exhaust Gas Recirculation
(EGR) System
• Exhaust Heat Control Valve
• Exhaust Manifold
• Exhaust Pipe (Manifold to
Catalyst)
• Fuel Filler Cap and Neck
Restrictor
• Fuel Injection System
• Fuel Injector Supply Manifold
• Fuel Sensor (1)
• Fuel Tank (non diesel only)
• Fuel Tank Pressure Control
Valve (1)
• High Voltage Battery (HEV)
• Idle Air Bypass Valve
• Ignition Coil and/or Control Module
• Intake Manifold
• Intercooler Assembly -
Engine Charger
• Malfunction Indicator Lamp
(MIL)/On-Board Diagnostic
(OBD) System
• NGV module (Bi-fuel/CNG)
• PCV system and Oil Filler Cap
• Secondary Air Injection System
• Spark Control Components
• Spark Plugs and Ignition Wires
• Supercharger Assembly
• Synchronizer Assembly
• Thermostat
• Throttle Body Assembly (MFI)
• Transmission Control Module
(TCM)
• Turbocharger Assembly
• Vacuum Distribution System
(1) Flex Fuel Vehicle Only
20

 

Who has this document in it's entirety? In PDF? Or a link to the document?

Somebody should post it as a "sticky".