Bottom line is this......I have been a user of Mobil 1 since I was 19Yrs old, it has been in all of my vehicles & motorcycles, & Tractors since, I am in my early 40's now & just purchased a New 2007 SCREW,5.43v, at the 1st oil change I will be putting in Synthetic, as I plan on working this truck hard for at least 10 yrs, towing, a trailer to Florida, for job relocation, & my Harley back up to NE in the Summer months. If you want "Ultimate Protection", for your engine, it's worth the extra expense, which is minnor if you shop at Wally World, No mineral oil, or Blend will protect as good period! Does everyone need a Synthetic, No....it depends on your needs, & how long you plan on keeping a particular vehicle.....simple as that! One of my tractors is a 1984 & still runs quite well, & I have worked the *&^%$ out of it since.......

 

Amsoil;

Switch over everything as you find the need to do so, critically with motor oil first. I believe you get what you pay for, so no need to explain why I chose Amsoil.

I do like Mobil 1 though, but my vote goes towards Amsoil as far as being #1 choice on all the fluids, except coolant and trans IMO.

 

While we are on the subject...

page from: http://www.popularmechanics.com/auto...o/4213451.html

Q: After a recent trip to two major auto parts dealers for oil (5W 30), I realized synthetic oil is slowly replacing nonsynthetic on the display shelves. The problem is, I'm getting conflicting information about synthetic oil. One store attendant told me I shouldn't go back to regular oil after changing to synthetic. Then he said it would be okay to add a quart of regular oil to synthetic, if I needed to top up. Another clerk said I should never mix the two. At a different store, the employee said it didn't matter if I used synthetic and then later replaced it with regular oil.

A: Early synthetics got a bad reputation for leaking. This was because, despite the claims of the oil manufacturers, the seal-swell characteristics of the new synthetics were different from those of the mineral oils they replaced. If the seal-swell rate was lower, the seals shrank and oil leaked from crankshaft seals and rocker cover seals. If the rate was higher, the seals swelled a little extra and the engine was tight. Then if the owner changed back to mineral oil, or added a quart when no synthetic was to be had, things got really bad. The crank seals had become worn, in their turgid state, and then relaxed. The valve cover seals were compressed when swelled, and when the different oil was added, everything leaked like, well, an old English sports car.

Fortunately, the situation has improved; you should have no problem switching back and forth. Adding a quart of mineral oil to a crankcase full of synthetic will be fine. Read the fine print — a lot of the "synthetics" on the market are blends containing a substantial proportion of mineral oil.

 

read and learn about what is found in Conventional oils...that might influence you a little. Bottom line is keep up on your fluid changes and you should be fine. However, IN MY OPINION...a GOOD or HIGH-end CONVENTIONAL is the very minimum that you should use. If you are using the WAL-MART 4qts for a $1 you are literally getting the bottom of the barrell.


Synthetics are designed to flow at lower temps and resist boiling off and do not break down as easily as conventional.

I use synthectic oil and all i know is my oil isnt black when I change it but no huge performance increases but the extra few buck isnt putting a hole in my pocket.

Bottom line...keep up on your fluid changes.

 

I make a living in the lubricants business, so I can try to help anyone here understand the differences between PAO synthetics, Group III synthetics, and normal mineral oils, although NONE of them are the same! Granted, in the bottle any API certified oil is similar to another - however they are not tested in real operating conditions, they are all tested using the same ASTM test methods under LABORATORY conditions.

The major difference in synthetics vs. mineral oils is the synthetics ability to be serviceable for a longer period of time. In other words a good synthetic, PAO or Group III, will last 2 to 3 times longer than a mineral based product in the same operating conditions because the base oil is stronger and will not begin to break down nearly as quickly. The major difference between PAO synthetics and Group III synthetics is the base oil's ability to hold on to additive. Generally speaking, a Group III synthetic can hold more additive (detergent, dispersant, etc.) but the base oil isn't as strong as a PAO if it has to stand alone.

It really all comes down to this - how often do you plan on changing fluids and filters? If you are one that is religious at changing every 5000 miles, then you are WASTING MONEY on synthetics! If you want to extend the drain interval up to the 10000 to 15000+ mile range, then look into a QUALITY synthetic product. I would suggest looking into it before you choose one off of the shelf, because they are NOT created equal!

 

WHAT!? THERE'S NO ULTIMATE PROTECTION WITH SYNTHETIC!!!! It is NOT any better for your engine!!!! If it meets specs, then it meets specs! This is retarded. You can put a grade 8 bolt in a machine that requires a grade 5 bolt, and it DOESN'T make the machine ANY better! Nor does it get better fuel mileage!

Have you EVER kept a truck until the engine blows up? (say 500,000+?) MOST people wealthy enough to afford internet and a computer HAVE NOT! Unless they were ******* the **** out of their trucks! But those of us that have, know that the rest of the truck quits FIRST! And when engines DO quit, it's NEVER because the oil was too cheap. So EVEN IF the synthetic was better, it's a MOOT POINT because your engine will outlast the truck ANYWAY!!! If you do that, you VOID YOUR WARRANTY! And if it was "better", then it WOULDN'T VOID THE WARRANTY!

 

 

That statement makes a lot of sense to me!

I would like to ask...Since you work in this....It has been about 6 years since I lived in Alaska and lived there through the 90's I am sure oil technology has come along way...But back then conventional oils would gel or solidify in extreme cold temps...But the synthetics didn't...

In my research I look at the pour points at cold temps of the PAO synthetics are still better than conventional oils...Maybe not as much today as back then but still somewhat better in the PAO's....I would assume that this would make for better cold starts...I know that it made a huge difference back then...

I thought this might be an important point for this young man in Buffalo...Maybe you can correct me if I am off base...

Because when it got to extreme cold temps it would almost be like a dry start with conventional oil if it would even turn over...

 

This is NOT necessarily an indication of a quality oil........as a matter of fact, it could be just the opposite.

 

This is a silly statement. The reason why it COULD potentially void the warranty is:

A) Ford does not want every Tom, ****, and Harry blindly running Walmart special oil for 15K miles under severe service, and then holding Ford responsible for engine damage.

B) Getting AS many consumers as possible to believe what you do is a real good way for Ford to sell more of their motor oil.

An EDUCATED consumer who does some research into synthetics and understands their driving patterns can CERTAINLY run a synthetic oil for extended drains and more than adequately protect their engine. Note that I said ADEQUATELY protect, not "better" protect. Synthetics don't necessarily offer better protection, but as jschaus very clearly points out, their advantage is in extended life.

Depending on your situation, a synthetic may or may not offer you an advantage. With that said, Fords Motorcraft oil IS a quality oil and I would recommend it in almost all cases.

 

I've lived in ND and CO and all I've ever used is Havoline every 2k now some of you might say thats excessive, but my '97 ran like new till the day I wrapped it around a pole. My new '02 has had no oil problems, synths are for people in extreme conditions, if you live anywhere in the US except the desert chances are a standard oil will serve you fine as long as you change at 3-4k. thats just my opinion, but I don't care how new my vehicle is or if people think its throwing away money I'll always change oil 2-2.5k and trans at 70k. so good luck with your 10k changes

 

jschaus or Labnerd,
give us a rundown on what is happening to the anti wear additive package ZDDP and related chemicals.
I see that it is changing very fast and in my opinion is a prime item for long term protection. So much so that now you can't run modern consumer oils in an expensive race motor with flat tappet cams.
Oils just a year ago are not the same today for the same brand and grade.
The fellow who has been using M1 since 19 years old seems not to have caught up with these things yet.
I have quite a bit of info on this but would like to hear your positions.
Some of the better oils to use now, would suprise a lot of people, for wear additives as well a suprise a lot of people on those oils that are become poor for this.
It's now a matter of satisfying the EPA and extending emissions devices than it is motor wear. After warrenty, everybody is on their own anyways.
Something like doing a live Lobster on the stove beginning with cold water. It never realizes what is happening until the process is to far along.
Not trying to disagree or argue for or against any oil but to get more truth out about what is really happening.
Hint, low sulfar diesel fuel is already mandated and the new big trucks designed for it cost a bunch more. That's why there has been a rush to buy new leftover diesel trucks before being forced into buying an 07s or later by trucking companies and private owner.

 

I understand this is a FORD site...but there are a lot of non-FORD cars on the market that have extended drain intervals, upwards of 10K - 15K miles, which is what jschaus is referring to.

These cars mandate synthetics to maintain warranty coverage.
But for the truly @nal-retentive (admittedly I'm one of them), a UOA will often show that the synthetic's additive package has been depleted at far fewer miles. So more-frequent changes are a good idea..

And some MFR certifications (like VW, BMW, Mercedes-Benz and others) are only available in synthetics.

Also, many cars require a 0W40 (or other weight) oil that is only available in a synthetic. So you're sorta stuck.

 

fordzguy - you are 100% accurate in your thinking regarding PAO's in colder climates. The chemistry behind this is a little too detailed to explain, but suffice it to say that any PAO or Group III synthetic oil will flow better at start up than a conventional. The oil film at startup is around 2 to 4 microns in size (a human hair is about 80 microns), so you want to make sure that you have something that is able to flow at a faster rate when the temperatures drop. Very good thing to keep in mind if you live in a colder climate!!

 

Bluegrass - ZDDP (or Zinc Dialkyl Dithiophosphate) is still the main anti-wear additive produced by Lubrizol for all oil companies. It is used in motor oils, machine oils, and greases. It is an EXCELLENT anti-wear additive, however oils today are not formulated as they were a year or even 6 months ago for that matter. A lot of changes have come about, mostly with the EPA, that have forced all oil manufacturers to create oils that may not last as long as they once did, or provide the same amounts of additive. Even my company has had to reformulate engine oils 3 times in the last 12 months! Currently you will see 1% or less ZDDP in motor oils because in motor oil applications the amount of ZDDP has to be minimized, as the zinc and phosphorus emissions damage catalytic converters. So my position is that the oils are being created to help with emissions, not to prevent wear in an engine.

We are really seeing this in 2007 diesel engines designed to use ULSD. CJ-4 oils are more expensive and don't last as long, and a lot of the majors aren't making CI-4+ oils anymore, so the consumer is using a product they don't really need.

Very good observation by the way! I thought only us lube guys had any idea what the hell ZDDP was!