A longer stroke , the design, all that it takes to contribute to such a launch is purely a customer interest market "mock" up of the 4.6 - is that correct? They would have been in deep sh^t if that were the case. It would have been exposed - to much political mamba eL samba. To many loops not enough holes. Impossible to jump thru them all. This would have died before production. If said post was at all accurate.

I for one do not subscribe to this theory.

 

And I for one am not the monkeys uncle.

 

But if you had a 5.4 and a 4.6 completely stock with no money to mod which one would you run every day. A 5.4 can be modded to kill a 4.6, I'm pretty sure Neal's truck would whoop the s^^t out of your 4.6. If you wanna talk mods then you should talk the exact same ones on each truck. If you had the exact same mods on your 5.4 as on your 4.6 would you still run the 4.6 every day?

 

I'm a 4.6 guy but i know the hard truth, I just dont have any money....

 

The point is, it is VERY easy to make a 4.6 make the same power as the 5.4 without any ill affect what-so-ever. Ford does many things to the 4.6 that actually reduce it's power, much in the same way GM de-tuned the LT-1 and LS-1 that's used in the Corvette for use in the Z28 and T/A. The only purpose of doing so was to create a larger disparity in performance between them. Ford did a similar thing with the Mustangs. The GT-40 heads and intake were in production and available for the Mustang, but were they used? NO! Why? Why give the Mustang an engine that has 225hp and 300fp when 350-400hp and 375fp was extremely easy to make with parts they already had? Well, there was no need to. The Mustang sold like hot-cakes regardless. Ford could have taken their Mustang, dropped in a 351 with GT-40 heads and GT-40 intake, and absolutely raped the Camaro and Firebirds (95 Cobra R anybody??). Did they? Hell no! Why not? No need to. Ford doesn't need to compete with the sales #'s they already had. The Mustang was out-selling the GM's 3-1. And just with gears and slicks, the 5oh's were running 12's.

Ford runs the same game with the trucks. There is no need to have 3 engines available for these trucks at all. NONE!

The 4.6 isn't really much smaller than the 5.4. That's what you guys don't get. Think about it. Back in 92 the Camaro came with a 305 and 350. Both motors had the exact same hp. The difference in displacement between the 305 and 350 is almost the exact same as the difference between the 4.6 and 5.4. What advantage did the 350 have over the 305? Absolutely NONE! The only reason the 305 was even available was for a selling point, that's it. It was for people who wanted an RS with a V8, but for whatever reason, didn't want the z28. It was only ONLY in production to justify a larger price difference between the base model and the higher-end z28, by creating a intermediate model. But in 93, there was 2 models, the base with the V6, and the Z28 with the LT-1, no 305.

In reality, the production costs of the 2v 5.4 vs. the 4.6 is extremely small. It's under $100. So why then would you even produce both? Why not go with a single standard V8? You have to know that just the additional costs of offering and assembling the trucks with different engines is FAR more than the actual engine cost itself.

Well, the two engine choices exist solely to create a different price point. It doesn't cost much more to build a truck with a V8 over a V6, and it costs next to nothing more to build one with a 5.4 over a 4.6. However, in doing so, they create different price points with different margins. To put it as simply as possible, when you buy a truck with a 5.4, the profit to Ford is a good deal more than the same truck with a 4.6 and a LARGE amount higher than the same truck with the 4.2.

If Ford was building the trucks for us instead of for profit, the current base V6 model would have the 4.6 V8 and the the current 4.6 or 5.4 would have a 6 liter or more V8 with a minimum of 350hp and 400fp. That's not what happened, however, because the profit made by offering and charging for the 3 models is a great deal more than just offering 2 V8's.

 

If I had sunk the amount of money into my 4.6 that Neal has, the performance would be VERY similar. And I will tell you right now, the 5.4 I am in the middle of building will smoke the living **** out of Neal's truck. But again, there's a lot more money going into it than even Neal spent on his. Mods and HP have nothing to do with anything but $$$. How much power you can make is directly proportional to the amount of $$$ spent.

My 4.6 is a non-pi motor with mildly ported heads and intake, stock cams, and a few more things here and there. The 5.4 is a PI motor, so a lot of the improvements I made on the 4.6 were already done on the 5.4 from the factory. And the 4.6 makes the 5.4 look stupid. Not to mention the 4.6 is a SC and the 5.4 is a RC. The 5.4 has every advantage from the factory. The 4.6 is really only mildly modified. There is NOTHING stopping me from modding the crap out of the 5.4, putting a huffer on it, or whatever. But the plain and simple fact of the matter is, I don't need to because the 4.6 does everything I need it to with gusto!

 

tritonpwr,

I can't argue wit that logic. It makes sense. But the 5.4 is still better than the 4.6. About the piston slap... I have a friend that works at the Windsor plant. Her son and mine played hockey together on the same team. Apparently Ford has 3 piston sizes. Standard, under and over. The bores are measured on the line and the pistons are set in crates, 4 to a crate. There are two banks, left and right for a total of 8 pistons. Follow me so far? Well for a whole series of engines the banks were reversed and the pistons were put in the wrong holes. Can you say piston slap if an over bore cylinder gets an under sized piston. I asked about the inverse jamming up the piston and she said that the diff was not enough to allow the piston to actually stick.

JMC

 

I'll chime in. You take a set of true dual, use a piece of tire crayon, draw a long line on the INSIDE of the Outside of the pipe(lines facing each other) and run the **** out of it. get under truck and look where the crayon is burned off or melted on the pipe. That is where you put the xover, balance tube, whatever you want to call it.

Oh, yeah, one more thing. Just because you can afford to pay someone to do the mods to your mod DOES NOT give you free reign to be a farkin Jerk to other people here who do their own work. You try to make everyone else look dumb and wind up showing who the idiot really is.

 

Good call!

Now.....

What the f**k are you talking about? The _only_ time I am ever short or combative is when someone argues with me and their information is faaaaar off base (like a stock 4.6 pounding out 600+ hp).

Pay other people? I do ALL of my own work. The ONLY stuff I farm out is race engines, and body work, THAT'S IT! At that's only because there's a HUGE f**king difference between a little tiny a$$ V8 cranking 300hp and a race motor that has to survive 1000+ hp, and I don't have a paint booth. I rebuild ALL my of my engines, do ALL of my service, do EVERY single f**king mod on every car/truck I own.

I don't TRY to make ANYONE look dumb. Most people do a FINE JOB of that themselves! Now, you can either learn from someone who has an NHRA license, built and runs an 8 second turbo car (with no breakage to date), has rebuilt more engines than most people take s^^ts , put themselves through college as a mechanic at a speed shop, or you can shove it up your a$$. I couldn't give a f**k either way. It's not like somebody is paying me for this!

It's a shame there's no emoticon on here to flip you off with.

 

Nah, they both suck equally.

 

ROFL


Remote - CS, awesome this time of year ( :

 

Tritonpwr... You can be kinda mean to people though . But I personally love the fact that if someone challenges you, they had darn better know what they are talking about. You cannot imagine how much I have learned about these motors from hearing you tell some people just how it is .

 

LOL Thanks, I think....

Nah, I'm not mean to people, I'm mean to stupid. People around here aren't stupid mind you, just their stupid comments. Actually, I hold myself back if you can imagine that! See, it's not their fault 99% of the time. Somebody tells them something, they read it somewhere, they get something backwards, and they regurgitate it. Or sometimes they just come up with some craziness that makes no sense all on their own. Like if someone says, my buddy's neighbor's brother's friend has a truck that lays down 9's and it's stock with a 100 shot of nitrous, I am going to tell them just how f**king absurdly stupid that is! Or something else equally absurd, like a stock 4.6 with a turbo pushing 600hp! On another board, I had a guy tell me he had double pumper heads on his 350. Swore it up and down! I think he meant double hump, but he said no to that, HIS HEADS WERE DOUBLE PUMPER'S DAMNIT!!!! I cut him to pieces! LOL

I never pull any punches when it comes to these topics. I do that because wrong information here can blow up somebody's vehicle, cost them a few grand, leave them with a broke down truck, or worse. I know what I'm talking about, I've been doing this longer than some of the members here have been breathing. If I see something insane, I call them on it. If that pisses people off, well, sorry. Don't talk like a dumba$$ and not expected to be treated like a dumba$$!

And when someone tries to lay down a load of crap like it's fact, sure, I'll call them on it. I'm not always right, I don't know it all, I do make a mistake here and there, but generally speaking I'm pretty dead on. I got there just like everyone else does. Spend lots of money, ask lots of questions to the right people, and blow up lots and LOTS of s^^t!!!!

 

 

Tritonpwr... Your right about some people speaking out of their *** when they repeat crap they heard from some other idiott doing the same thing . Remember the guy that said his tuner got him 489 horses from his stock 4.6 with a turbo or supercharger? I believe I saw his numbers on another site, and they were at the crank on a dynojet dyno. I believe under a load, his rear wheel horses were about 266. Wasn't he claiming the 489 was at the rear wheels? What a big difference between the two aint it.