Is Whipple's Tune Garbage?
#16
05-14-2014, 11:19 PM
Senior Member
Thanks Twin, I will do that if it is determined that I should replace those after all. I remember you saying they start to go around 70K miles. Is that life span shortened at all with the blower, or anything else? Also, I asked about the gap on the plugs. The plugs that are in there now are what Whipple gave with the kit. I'll try to explain this as best I can, but not seeing what he (the tech) is talking about, it makes little sense to me. He said that the plugs have a piece of metal (or something like that) and I'm not quite sure how you can adjust that or not. I told him what you had said about gap of .30 to .32 and he said that is correct for those who are running higher boost. I know you run something like 20lbs or something, aren't you? I'm just at the 6.5 psi. He did say the plugs looked darker than he expected to see, but not enough (in his opinion) to cause a miss. But I'd be okay with replacing plugs if it would remove one variable. Lastly, he did notice that the A/F ratio does read between 11-12:1 under normal driving conditions. But he's yet to determine is the wideband O2 is faulty, the gauge is faulty, or the mix is really that rich. That might explain why my gas mileage has been really poor ever since I installed the blower, and the carbon build up as you mentioned makes more sense too. Would it running too rich cause something like this to happen?
Plug gap. I'll keep it simple. Spark plug gap is crucial in any application. In boosted applications it becomes even more important. Electricity is sent to the plug from the coil. The spark plug has a firing tip and a ground strap. The space between the two is the "gap". The spark has to be able to jump from the firing tip to the ground strap. If it can't it will not ignite the fuel correctly. So the gap has to be set correctly. On a stock 5.4 3v the gap should be .045. However with increased cylinder pressures the gap has to be closed up some. The additional pressure and turbulence in the cylinder can extinguish the spark. Thus creating what is called "spark blowout". Or what to you would feel like a misfire. This misfire or spark blowout will not occur under light loads or idle. Rather it will show up under higher loads when boost and/or rpm's are increased. It is important your plugs be gapped to .030-.032 as recommended by Whipple, JDM, Troyer, and really anyone in the forced induction world. I run 11psi of boost and gap my plugs at .035. No I'm not a hypocrite lol. I have found through experience I can run a gap that large without blowout. You want to run the largest gap possible without spark blowout to achieve max power.
I would strongly suggest replacing your plugs and having the new ones gapped to .032. Have your a/f gauge calibrated or replaced. Then you can reevaluate your a/f ratios. If you really are running an 11-12 a/f during normal driving then a tune adjustment will be needed. Thats far to rich for daily driving. That will foul plugs, ruin O2 sensors and clog cats.
If the plugs were not black then I doubt you are that rich. You probably just have a faulty wide band. Did your mechanic say what color the plugs are? Should be tan-brown.
#17
05-15-2014, 12:15 AM
No the O2 sensors don't have a shortened life span because of the blower. They are designed to last for 100,000 miles. However as they age in any vehicle they react slower. The ECM tests the oxygen sensors, it momentarily drives the air/fuel mixture rich, then lean. The program in the computer has a logic for how long the swing from rich-to-lean the sensor should take. The check engine light only comes on when the vehicle is exceeding the federal emissions standard by 1 1/2 times-which usually means a drop in fuel economy. In high performance applications this slowness while not causing a light can have an effect on performance as well as mpg's. It's not a huge deal but if you're tuning or racing or just wanting the best from your ride it's a good idea to replace the upstream sensors between 50,000-70,000 miles.
Plug gap. I'll keep it simple. Spark plug gap is crucial in any application. In boosted applications it becomes even more important. Electricity is sent to the plug from the coil. The spark plug has a firing tip and a ground strap. The space between the two is the "gap". The spark has to be able to jump from the firing tip to the ground strap. If it can't it will not ignite the fuel correctly. So the gap has to be set correctly. On a stock 5.4 3v the gap should be .045. However with increased cylinder pressures the gap has to be closed up some. The additional pressure and turbulence in the cylinder can extinguish the spark. Thus creating what is called "spark blowout". Or what to you would feel like a misfire. This misfire or spark blowout will not occur under light loads or idle. Rather it will show up under higher loads when boost and/or rpm's are increased. It is important your plugs be gapped to .030-.032 as recommended by Whipple, JDM, Troyer, and really anyone in the forced induction world. I run 11psi of boost and gap my plugs at .035. No I'm not a hypocrite lol. I have found through experience I can run a gap that large without blowout. You want to run the largest gap possible without spark blowout to achieve max power.
I would strongly suggest replacing your plugs and having the new ones gapped to .032. Have your a/f gauge calibrated or replaced. Then you can reevaluate your a/f ratios. If you really are running an 11-12 a/f during normal driving then a tune adjustment will be needed. Thats far to rich for daily driving. That will foul plugs, ruin O2 sensors and clog cats.
If the plugs were not black then I doubt you are that rich. You probably just have a faulty wide band. Did your mechanic say what color the plugs are? Should be tan-brown.
Plug gap. I'll keep it simple. Spark plug gap is crucial in any application. In boosted applications it becomes even more important. Electricity is sent to the plug from the coil. The spark plug has a firing tip and a ground strap. The space between the two is the "gap". The spark has to be able to jump from the firing tip to the ground strap. If it can't it will not ignite the fuel correctly. So the gap has to be set correctly. On a stock 5.4 3v the gap should be .045. However with increased cylinder pressures the gap has to be closed up some. The additional pressure and turbulence in the cylinder can extinguish the spark. Thus creating what is called "spark blowout". Or what to you would feel like a misfire. This misfire or spark blowout will not occur under light loads or idle. Rather it will show up under higher loads when boost and/or rpm's are increased. It is important your plugs be gapped to .030-.032 as recommended by Whipple, JDM, Troyer, and really anyone in the forced induction world. I run 11psi of boost and gap my plugs at .035. No I'm not a hypocrite lol. I have found through experience I can run a gap that large without blowout. You want to run the largest gap possible without spark blowout to achieve max power.
I would strongly suggest replacing your plugs and having the new ones gapped to .032. Have your a/f gauge calibrated or replaced. Then you can reevaluate your a/f ratios. If you really are running an 11-12 a/f during normal driving then a tune adjustment will be needed. Thats far to rich for daily driving. That will foul plugs, ruin O2 sensors and clog cats.
If the plugs were not black then I doubt you are that rich. You probably just have a faulty wide band. Did your mechanic say what color the plugs are? Should be tan-brown.
He told me the color of the plugs was a little "darker" than he expected them to be for how long they've been in my truck. So I'm not sure what exactly that means, but he didn't think it was enough to cause a problem. Maybe tomorrow I will just call and tell him to do the plugs anyways and make sure they're gapped at .32
As far as adjusting the tune, can that be done with Whipple's canned tune? Or would I need a new tuner and have a tune built?
#18
05-15-2014, 09:10 AM
Senior Member
Ah. I assumed you were talking about the o2 sensors as I had previously mentioned replacing those around 70,000 miles for peak performance. The coils should be fine at 51,000 miles. They should easily last 100k. However nothing's perfect. I would replace the fuel filter first, plugs second, verify A/F's, then if the problem persist start chasing coils. Unless of course a code is set for a misfire between now and then. Definitely talk to the mechanic further about the plugs. When you do buy the best deal believe it or not is at Advance Auto.com. In the search frame punch in HT0 yes thats a zero. The Autolite HT0 plugs will come up. Select 8. Go the cart. Upon check out use code p20 and get 20% off. Free shipping is usually available and you will have plugs in a few days.
As for the tune. You will need a custom tune. You can't modify the Whipple tune. If you want to custom tune it will run you about $300 for the tune plus the cost of an SCT X3 or SCT X4 device. Your best bet on the tuning will be JDM http://www.teamjdm.com or call them at (732) 780-0770. You will likely speak to Julie. She will walk you through the process and send you a tune request sheet where you will list details on your truck as well as mods.
If you decide to go this route I highly recommend upgrading your fuel injectors and relocate your IAT sensor to get the most benefit. More then happy to supply you with the instructions needed on this as well as where to get the injectors and sensor at the best price. Just let me know.
As for the tune. You will need a custom tune. You can't modify the Whipple tune. If you want to custom tune it will run you about $300 for the tune plus the cost of an SCT X3 or SCT X4 device. Your best bet on the tuning will be JDM http://www.teamjdm.com or call them at (732) 780-0770. You will likely speak to Julie. She will walk you through the process and send you a tune request sheet where you will list details on your truck as well as mods.
If you decide to go this route I highly recommend upgrading your fuel injectors and relocate your IAT sensor to get the most benefit. More then happy to supply you with the instructions needed on this as well as where to get the injectors and sensor at the best price. Just let me know.
Last edited by twinskrewd; 05-15-2014 at 09:20 AM.
#19
05-17-2014, 05:43 PM
I got my truck back a few days ago. All I ended up having done was a fuel filter change, along with a complete tranny flush (as well as had the filter(s) changed), and a regular oil change.
My tech could not get it to miss once for him at all. I've been driving it a lot these past couple days, putting various loads on it, and I can't get it to do it either. It's actually running pretty bad *** right now to be honest. LOL.
My tech is convinced that I could have a coil getting ready to go, but we cannot determine which one at this time. He did tell me though, that when he poured the fuel out of the old fuel filter that it was pretty black. I'm not sure if that could really be the culprit, but it's been great these past few days.
I'll keep everyone posted.
Thanks again.
My tech could not get it to miss once for him at all. I've been driving it a lot these past couple days, putting various loads on it, and I can't get it to do it either. It's actually running pretty bad *** right now to be honest. LOL.
My tech is convinced that I could have a coil getting ready to go, but we cannot determine which one at this time. He did tell me though, that when he poured the fuel out of the old fuel filter that it was pretty black. I'm not sure if that could really be the culprit, but it's been great these past few days.
I'll keep everyone posted.
Thanks again.