The definitive Magnum Powers / Eaton comparison
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From: jersey
.
I went out and bought an MP. We tested it on a full bolt on truck, stock block that was running a ported Eaton at about 19psi. Results? The MP made 14RWHP/torque more than the ported Eaton, with the MP making a bit more boost due to it having a 2.7" upper and the ported blower having a 2.8" upper. I promptly sold the MP and bought a ported blower. Why? Because the MP was not worth the $$$ for a stock block truck (this one was over 450 RWHP BTW) vs getting a port job. On a built block with the MP spinning hard and making lots of boost, it's a great value over the KB if you are looking to save some $$$. [/B][/QUOTE]
Im certainly not trying to start any more of a pissing contest here than whats already taking place but if you only picked up 14rwhp/tq even if it was a stock block there must have been some serious negative forces at work here, ie. a really bad tune, extremely hot outside (like 150*) or a weak as hell motor (by weak i mean the internals were going away). I have/had the exact same set up as you did except for crower cams. 2.8 upper on my Eaton and 2.7 on the Magnum and as previously stated i picked up a whole lot more hp/tq than that.
To each his own I guess but something is definately wrong with your numbers on the Magnum.
I went out and bought an MP. We tested it on a full bolt on truck, stock block that was running a ported Eaton at about 19psi. Results? The MP made 14RWHP/torque more than the ported Eaton, with the MP making a bit more boost due to it having a 2.7" upper and the ported blower having a 2.8" upper. I promptly sold the MP and bought a ported blower. Why? Because the MP was not worth the $$$ for a stock block truck (this one was over 450 RWHP BTW) vs getting a port job. On a built block with the MP spinning hard and making lots of boost, it's a great value over the KB if you are looking to save some $$$. [/B][/QUOTE]
Im certainly not trying to start any more of a pissing contest here than whats already taking place but if you only picked up 14rwhp/tq even if it was a stock block there must have been some serious negative forces at work here, ie. a really bad tune, extremely hot outside (like 150*) or a weak as hell motor (by weak i mean the internals were going away). I have/had the exact same set up as you did except for crower cams. 2.8 upper on my Eaton and 2.7 on the Magnum and as previously stated i picked up a whole lot more hp/tq than that.
To each his own I guess but something is definately wrong with your numbers on the Magnum.
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From: jersey
Originally posted by brahmus
Well isn't boost just a measure of resistance more than power??? Can't you make equal power with less boost by say...........installing LT headers or reducing the "resistance" of the motor to flow????
Well isn't boost just a measure of resistance more than power??? Can't you make equal power with less boost by say...........installing LT headers or reducing the "resistance" of the motor to flow????
adding cams to the motor causes less boost and more power!
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From: Arkansas
Originally posted by mike00L
...but if you only picked up 14rwhp/tq even if it was a stock block there must have been some serious negative forces at work here, ie. a really bad tune, extremely hot outside (like 150*) or a weak as hell motor (by weak i mean the internals were going away). I have/had the exact same set up as you did except for crower cams. 2.8 upper on my Eaton and 2.7 on the Magnum and as previously stated i picked up a whole lot more hp/tq than that.
To each his own I guess but something is definately wrong with your numbers on the Magnum.
...but if you only picked up 14rwhp/tq even if it was a stock block there must have been some serious negative forces at work here, ie. a really bad tune, extremely hot outside (like 150*) or a weak as hell motor (by weak i mean the internals were going away). I have/had the exact same set up as you did except for crower cams. 2.8 upper on my Eaton and 2.7 on the Magnum and as previously stated i picked up a whole lot more hp/tq than that.
To each his own I guess but something is definately wrong with your numbers on the Magnum.
Having cams makes a WORLD of difference...you might actually be able to take advantage of all the air it's moving. Just one more reason to support my theory on stock longblocks and MP's vs ported Eatons.
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From: jersey
[QUOTE]Originally posted by ShockTherapy
[B]Nothing weak about a ported Eaton truck making over 450RWHP, and doing so with hundreds of passes, as good as an 11.7 run on it and still running strong. It was rolling 471RWHP stock longblock with the Apten before the blower was pulled off to put on a turbo over the winter.
I dont disagree with you on that. my eaton made 488 to the wheels and I also made the same e.t.'s. I just wanted to point out the obvious to everyone who is putting the Magnum down or atleast saying that a ported eaton is just as good that i picked up a lot of hp/tq by switching to the Magnum.
Like I said before, to each his own - just adding my .02
[B]Nothing weak about a ported Eaton truck making over 450RWHP, and doing so with hundreds of passes, as good as an 11.7 run on it and still running strong. It was rolling 471RWHP stock longblock with the Apten before the blower was pulled off to put on a turbo over the winter.
I dont disagree with you on that. my eaton made 488 to the wheels and I also made the same e.t.'s. I just wanted to point out the obvious to everyone who is putting the Magnum down or atleast saying that a ported eaton is just as good that i picked up a lot of hp/tq by switching to the Magnum.
Like I said before, to each his own - just adding my .02
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From: Selden NY
Originally posted by Tim Skelton
Comfort is irrelevant.
The MP is too new to make any accurate reliability predictions.
Performance, then, is the sole criterion.
Comfort is irrelevant.
The MP is too new to make any accurate reliability predictions.
Performance, then, is the sole criterion.
Out of 6 I personally know, all are on #2, at least 3 are on #3.
3308 people read this so far, NOT ONE has disputed the massive failures. THEY CAN'T, ""IT'S A FACT"" And if anyone remembers the post that got totally out of hand before deleted, KB has NOT ever said they have corrected the problem, nor that they even have one, THATS WHAT TURNED MOST PEOPLE OFF TO THEM.
Even when Gator asked Mr Bell OVER AND OVER in his first post about the Failures, HE WAS NEVER GIVING AN ANSWER
Originally posted by Fast Gator
I guess the chances of Mr Jim Bell coming back and answering my question are slim and none
I guess the chances of Mr Jim Bell coming back and answering my question are slim and none
I think people need to understand NO ONE has ever said the Magnum was better than, or even equal to the instant bolt on Performance the KB offers. And your right, a Ported Eaton can run some dam impressive #'s too, (I had over 500 HP flowing through mine, ran many 11's with it). WOO HOO.............. I LOVED my Ported Eaton
But taking an ice cold truck and making it work well in 1320 ft is totally differant than driving a Heat Soaked Eaton around in the Summer Heat running 8-10 lbs of extra Pulley and 20lbs of Boost through it. Now I will have the power I use to have on Spray,
OFF SPRAY, and the reliability I demand.
There is clearly a spot in out market place for the Magnum,
1/2 the air inlet temps,
designed to spin DOUBLE what a Eaton can (and more than a KB)
1/2 the price of a KB
and IMO the reliabilty of a stock Eaton.
Instant Bolt on "11 sec Lightning"
No immediate need for fuel upgrades (another thousand saved)
AND A WHINE 2nd TO NONE, that in itself is worth my $, hehehe
I feel it fits my needs PERFECT. For a guy like me that only wants 500 HP off spray, there was no reason to spend double the money, and for those that want more, throw a lot of Boost at it (thats what it's designed for) do the full fuel system upgrade, and keep your eye on Gator, he has over 600 Magnum HP ""ALL MOTOR"".
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From: O'Fallon, MO
Rob02, you're speaking of the KB failures. What about the leaking snouts on the MP. I've heard your "Perfect" MP has a very bad leaking snout problem. Of the three local MP users and yours, three of them have leaking snouts. That makes 75% of the MP's defective.
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From: Selden NY
I know of that problem, the HUGE diff is Charles acknowledged it, and then went out and found a differant Seal to correct it.
Big diff between a seal passing a few drops of oil, and the S/C
seizing up and or knocking, and not acknowledging there's a problem, 3 years later.
And then telling people a spacer ON TOP OF IT, or a Pulley not bought from them, or spinning it more than 18,000 RPM
(in which prob 90% ARE) will void the Wrrnty
Big diff between a seal passing a few drops of oil, and the S/C
seizing up and or knocking, and not acknowledging there's a problem, 3 years later.
And then telling people a spacer ON TOP OF IT, or a Pulley not bought from them, or spinning it more than 18,000 RPM
(in which prob 90% ARE) will void the Wrrnty
Originally posted by Jim@JDM
Jim,
I told Jim Bell that from now on I wasen't going to install the Phenolic Spacer on the Kenne Bell's. I am going to stick to my word for a couple different reasons. I don't want to give him any excuse to void warranties on the KB's. Jim had told me on the phone that he wanted nothing hanging off his supercharger. He even mentioned tensioner's and supercharger pullies other than his. He also added that he did not want the supercharger spun past 18,000 RPM's.
The Kenne Bell owners should make sure Jim Bell clearifies what they can and cannot do.
Jim@JDM
Jim,
I told Jim Bell that from now on I wasen't going to install the Phenolic Spacer on the Kenne Bell's. I am going to stick to my word for a couple different reasons. I don't want to give him any excuse to void warranties on the KB's. Jim had told me on the phone that he wanted nothing hanging off his supercharger. He even mentioned tensioner's and supercharger pullies other than his. He also added that he did not want the supercharger spun past 18,000 RPM's.
The Kenne Bell owners should make sure Jim Bell clearifies what they can and cannot do.
Jim@JDM
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From: O'Fallon, MO
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Rob_02Lightning
[B]I know of that problem, the HUGE diff is Charles acknowledged it, and then went out and found a differant Seal to correct it.
When is the new seal going to be used? Because the 2 local leakers have been bought and installed within the last couple of months.
[B]I know of that problem, the HUGE diff is Charles acknowledged it, and then went out and found a differant Seal to correct it.
When is the new seal going to be used? Because the 2 local leakers have been bought and installed within the last couple of months.
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Originally posted by Rob_02Lightning
The MP may not be around long enough to convince ALL of it's reliability, but the KB has. And since I can only speak on the KB L users I personally know, that makes their failure rate actually well over 200%.
Out of 6 I personally know, all are on #2, at least 3 are on #3.
3308 people read this so far, NOT ONE has disputed the massive failures. THEY CAN'T, ""IT'S A FACT"" And if anyone remembers the post that got totally out of hand before deleted, KB has NOT ever said they have corrected the problem, nor that they even have one, THATS WHAT TURNED MOST PEOPLE OFF TO THEM.
Even when Gator asked Mr Bell OVER AND OVER in his first post about the Failures, HE WAS NEVER GIVING AN ANSWER
That was 2003, we're still waiting for the answer.....
I think people need to understand NO ONE has ever said the Magnum was better than, or even equal to the instant bolt on Performance the KB offers. And your right, a Ported Eaton can run some dam impressive #'s too, (I had over 500 HP flowing through mine, ran many 11's with it). WOO HOO.............. I LOVED my Ported Eaton
But taking an ice cold truck and making it work well in 1320 ft is totally differant than driving a Heat Soaked Eaton around in the Summer Heat running 8-10 lbs of extra Pulley and 20lbs of Boost through it. Now I will have the power I use to have on Spray,
OFF SPRAY, and the reliability I demand.
There is clearly a spot in out market place for the Magnum,
1/2 the air inlet temps,
designed to spin DOUBLE what a Eaton can (and more than a KB)
1/2 the price of a KB
and IMO the reliabilty of a stock Eaton.
Instant Bolt on "11 sec Lightning"
No immediate need for fuel upgrades (another thousand saved)
AND A WHINE 2nd TO NONE, that in itself is worth my $, hehehe
I feel it fits my needs PERFECT. For a guy like me that only wants 500 HP off spray, there was no reason to spend double the money, and for those that want more, throw a lot of Boost at it (thats what it's designed for) do the full fuel system upgrade, and keep your eye on Gator, he has over 600 Magnum HP ""ALL MOTOR"".
The MP may not be around long enough to convince ALL of it's reliability, but the KB has. And since I can only speak on the KB L users I personally know, that makes their failure rate actually well over 200%.
Out of 6 I personally know, all are on #2, at least 3 are on #3.
3308 people read this so far, NOT ONE has disputed the massive failures. THEY CAN'T, ""IT'S A FACT"" And if anyone remembers the post that got totally out of hand before deleted, KB has NOT ever said they have corrected the problem, nor that they even have one, THATS WHAT TURNED MOST PEOPLE OFF TO THEM.
Even when Gator asked Mr Bell OVER AND OVER in his first post about the Failures, HE WAS NEVER GIVING AN ANSWER
That was 2003, we're still waiting for the answer.....
I think people need to understand NO ONE has ever said the Magnum was better than, or even equal to the instant bolt on Performance the KB offers. And your right, a Ported Eaton can run some dam impressive #'s too, (I had over 500 HP flowing through mine, ran many 11's with it). WOO HOO.............. I LOVED my Ported Eaton
But taking an ice cold truck and making it work well in 1320 ft is totally differant than driving a Heat Soaked Eaton around in the Summer Heat running 8-10 lbs of extra Pulley and 20lbs of Boost through it. Now I will have the power I use to have on Spray,
OFF SPRAY, and the reliability I demand.
There is clearly a spot in out market place for the Magnum,
1/2 the air inlet temps,
designed to spin DOUBLE what a Eaton can (and more than a KB)
1/2 the price of a KB
and IMO the reliabilty of a stock Eaton.
Instant Bolt on "11 sec Lightning"
No immediate need for fuel upgrades (another thousand saved)
AND A WHINE 2nd TO NONE, that in itself is worth my $, hehehe
I feel it fits my needs PERFECT. For a guy like me that only wants 500 HP off spray, there was no reason to spend double the money, and for those that want more, throw a lot of Boost at it (thats what it's designed for) do the full fuel system upgrade, and keep your eye on Gator, he has over 600 Magnum HP ""ALL MOTOR"".
3308 people read this so far
NOT ONE has disputed the massive failures. THEY CAN'T, ""IT'S A FACT
you have no idea the circumstances behind every failure do you? Some could have been run low on oil, some could have been installed wrong or the bypass adjusted wrong causing excessive heat. Bottom line is that KB has taken care of most all the warranty blowers and stands behind the product, even if they arent here on a daily basis to soothe your internet needs. its called a phone, try it sometime. (little david spade there for ya)
There is clearly a spot in out market place for the Magnum,
1/2 the air inlet temps,
designed to spin DOUBLE what a Eaton can (and more than a KB)
1/2 the price of a KB
and IMO the reliabilty of a stock Eaton.
Instant Bolt on "11 sec Lightning"
No immediate need for fuel upgrades (another thousand saved)
AND A WHINE 2nd TO NONE, that in itself is worth my $, hehehe
1/2 the air inlet temps,
designed to spin DOUBLE what a Eaton can (and more than a KB)
1/2 the price of a KB
and IMO the reliabilty of a stock Eaton.
Instant Bolt on "11 sec Lightning"
No immediate need for fuel upgrades (another thousand saved)
AND A WHINE 2nd TO NONE, that in itself is worth my $, hehehe
You will need pumps and injectors if you run more than 15lbs of boost with the MP, the distributors of the MP will insist.
This might help you and others to make an educated decision.
4700lb Lightning, 15lbs of Boost on a ported Eaton and no Nitrous. Fully warmed up, not chilled and hotlapped each time in 60 degree weather.
11.443 @ 118.40 10:17 A.M.
11.339 @ 118.75 10:22 A.M. (hotlap)
11.359 @ 119.54 11:41 A.M.
11.264 @ 119.37 11:52 A.M. (hotlap)
11.198 @ 119.93 1:03 P.M.
11.264 @ 118.95 1:13 P.M. (hotlap)
It got faster during the day from changes to the tune and from what I was told there is alot more left in the tune. This L will be at SSOTN along with my GenI (thank god it will be done), so if you want to see what the latest Steig port job can do, just go check it out for yourself.
AND A WHINE 2nd TO NONE, that in itself is worth my $, hehehe
Steve A.
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From: SouthJerseyUSA
Steve, we love you man but there are so many flaws in what you just stated.
I am one of those two that you are referring to.
I use a four pound lower.
I have seen over 20 pounds of boost with the stock pumps.
Fuel pressure=52psi.
I have nothing negative to say about anyone's experience.
Just setting the record straight so others can make an educated decision.
See ya on the 16th
FF
_____________________________________
Originally posted by nineseclightnin
You Have to spin the MP harder to make power 20lbs of boost for the two stock block mid 11 L's out there...
You Have to spin the MP harder to make power 20lbs of boost for the two stock block mid 11 L's out there...
I use a four pound lower.
Originally posted by nineseclightnin
You will need pumps and injectors if you run more than 15lbs of boost with the MP.
You will need pumps and injectors if you run more than 15lbs of boost with the MP.
Fuel pressure=52psi.
I have nothing negative to say about anyone's experience.
Just setting the record straight so others can make an educated decision.
See ya on the 16th
FF
_____________________________________
BTW: I am going to change the pumps before I switch to the six pounder.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 11,153
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From: Selden NY
Ya this has go way out of hand hasn't it, I'm sorry for whatever part I played. CAN WE HAVE A DO OVER 
It started as a nice informative post on the Mag, and turned into
a Ported Eaton Vs Mag Vs KB, I guess that pissed me off, because I happen to be very happy with my Mag.
As I've always said, I loved my Ported Eaton, got plenty of 11's with it, hundreds have awesome running KB's, MANY 10 sec L's,
and now there are some nice Mag's coming into the picture too.
I should have just NOT responded to this, but people were attacking something I believe in.
SORRY ALL
Now about those Whipples : o ) hehehehehehe
BTW
I'm installing the missing piece to my puzzle outside right now,
"IF" all goes well, they'll be a very interesting post tonight
It started as a nice informative post on the Mag, and turned into
a Ported Eaton Vs Mag Vs KB, I guess that pissed me off, because I happen to be very happy with my Mag.
As I've always said, I loved my Ported Eaton, got plenty of 11's with it, hundreds have awesome running KB's, MANY 10 sec L's,
and now there are some nice Mag's coming into the picture too.
I should have just NOT responded to this, but people were attacking something I believe in.
SORRY ALL
Now about those Whipples : o ) hehehehehehe
BTW
I'm installing the missing piece to my puzzle outside right now,
"IF" all goes well, they'll be a very interesting post tonight