IHRA Response to Roll Bar Rules
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,097
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From: DETROIT, (formerly Eaton County, Michigan)
So to DEFINITIVELY answer my QUESTION.
Rear bars are required.
It was not my intention to start a debate that got out of hand, while I know many people have differing opinions and points of view, Generally, we all come to this site to learn. I knew I could count on my fellow Lightning community to come up with an answer to my solution
Rear bars are required.
It was not my intention to start a debate that got out of hand, while I know many people have differing opinions and points of view, Generally, we all come to this site to learn. I knew I could count on my fellow Lightning community to come up with an answer to my solution
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 526
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From: Maine
Re: Rear braces ARE required under IHRA roll bar rules
Originally posted by Tim Skelton
In a previous thread, fomocofan stated that:
"It is pretty clearly printed that the brace bars (two requirred) MUST originate from a point off the main hoop "within 5" from the top of the bar".
As far as going through the back window....There is no requirement for any particular angle or degree or even a direction...only that the main hoop is to be "sufficciently braced to prevent forward movement"....
The brace bars could remain within the cab, simply run them forward from the top of the bar towards the floorboards. One obviously along the pass. side and one from the drivers side that goes along the roofline and then down by the dash to the floor (similar to a rollcage upper brace).. You will also need to have a second drivers side bar same as before (insecting the drivers body at the mid-point...) and a cross brace on the main hoop..
Anyway, bottom line is that there are no rules that say the bars have to go rearward, so an in-cab bar would be allowed."
For about 200 posts, fomocofan continued to argue that he was right and the rest of the world just did not know how to read a rulebook.
Well, we finally have the Word of God on the issue:
For a roll bar under the IHRA rules, a rear brace is required and has always been required.
I have it directly from Mike Baker, IHRA Director of Competition & Technical Services and Don Phillips, Tech Director of Cape Breton Dragway.
1. A roll cage must have rear bars exactly as shown in the image.
2. Rear bars have always been required.
3. The deletion of the word "rear" from the former phrase "rear braces" was meant to indicate that all braces must be the same size as the main hoop, not just the rear braces.
Also, swingouts are apparently no longer allowed, as that sentence was deleted from the 05 IHRA rulebook and Mike plainly stated that "All bars must have braces permanently attached just like the diagram."
Sooooo . . .
For those of you keeping score at home:
fomocofan: 0
everyone else: 1
In a previous thread, fomocofan stated that:
"It is pretty clearly printed that the brace bars (two requirred) MUST originate from a point off the main hoop "within 5" from the top of the bar".
As far as going through the back window....There is no requirement for any particular angle or degree or even a direction...only that the main hoop is to be "sufficciently braced to prevent forward movement"....
The brace bars could remain within the cab, simply run them forward from the top of the bar towards the floorboards. One obviously along the pass. side and one from the drivers side that goes along the roofline and then down by the dash to the floor (similar to a rollcage upper brace).. You will also need to have a second drivers side bar same as before (insecting the drivers body at the mid-point...) and a cross brace on the main hoop..
Anyway, bottom line is that there are no rules that say the bars have to go rearward, so an in-cab bar would be allowed."
For about 200 posts, fomocofan continued to argue that he was right and the rest of the world just did not know how to read a rulebook.
Well, we finally have the Word of God on the issue:
For a roll bar under the IHRA rules, a rear brace is required and has always been required.
I have it directly from Mike Baker, IHRA Director of Competition & Technical Services and Don Phillips, Tech Director of Cape Breton Dragway.
1. A roll cage must have rear bars exactly as shown in the image.
2. Rear bars have always been required.
3. The deletion of the word "rear" from the former phrase "rear braces" was meant to indicate that all braces must be the same size as the main hoop, not just the rear braces.
Also, swingouts are apparently no longer allowed, as that sentence was deleted from the 05 IHRA rulebook and Mike plainly stated that "All bars must have braces permanently attached just like the diagram."
Sooooo . . .
For those of you keeping score at home:
fomocofan: 0
everyone else: 1
Tim
#1 I was talking about Roll bars not cages, the rules are very different!
#2 "Swing-outs" have never been addressed under the roll bar section...and it would be a false assumption of yours or the tech guy you spoke with that they are no longer permitted...
As in the roll CAGE section and I qoute:
"Swing out bars are permitted on OEM full bodied entries running 8.50 and slower."
Qoute is from the 2005 IHRA rulebook page 121 under ROLL CAGE.
So, I guess everyone can be wrong....don't let it worry you...it doesn't me!
You have to be careful calling other people wrong all the time...sometimes it can bite you when YOU are wrong!!
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,202
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From: Miami, FL
Originally posted by fullboogie
The reason the average person thinks that is because of people like you who perpetuate this crap about lawyers all being ambulance-chasing personal injury lawyers. I, like Tim, am a lawyer, and don't like to hear this kind of nonsense. No more than the hard-working auto mechanic who hears that all repair shops are rip-offs who swindle people in a broken down car. Think a little before you say stuff like this, ok?
The reason the average person thinks that is because of people like you who perpetuate this crap about lawyers all being ambulance-chasing personal injury lawyers. I, like Tim, am a lawyer, and don't like to hear this kind of nonsense. No more than the hard-working auto mechanic who hears that all repair shops are rip-offs who swindle people in a broken down car. Think a little before you say stuff like this, ok?
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 526
Likes: 0
From: Maine
Re: Re: Re: IHRA Response to Roll Bar Rules
Originally posted by Silver_2000_
!
Jamie
You have been picking pointless - unwinnable fights on the internet since the end of FFW last year - An embarrasing thread on FFW forums full of acusations and childishness etc and now going on and on about interpretations of roll bar rules.
I understand you are upset about the truck thing from FFW - I dont blame you, Ford pulled a fast one and FFW let it happen with no decent explanation. BUT its over - Let it go - The stress will kill you - Move on ....
Doug
! Jamie
You have been picking pointless - unwinnable fights on the internet since the end of FFW last year - An embarrasing thread on FFW forums full of acusations and childishness etc and now going on and on about interpretations of roll bar rules.
I understand you are upset about the truck thing from FFW - I dont blame you, Ford pulled a fast one and FFW let it happen with no decent explanation. BUT its over - Let it go - The stress will kill you - Move on ....
Doug
I highly value your opinion and I am truly sorry for sticking to my convictions (right or wrong) that is one of my faults I suppose!
However, I harbor no ill will or resentment towards FFW, as a matter of fact a lot of positive things came out of that FFW forum...anyway, I hope people can see beyond FFW and realize that this has nothing to do with that...and actually I am not upset here at all!!
I think Sal clear everything up and now some other people are going on about it, for why I don't know!
But, I an done with this subject!
And BTW, Thanks Tallimeca and Whip for the kind words!
Senior Member
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 171
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From: Cape Coral, FL
Originally posted by Blown347Hatch
I have the pleasure of dealing with ambulance chasers on a daily basis. They're not all bad, but some of the s h i t they try to pass off as a legitimately injured party is beyond ridiculous.
I have the pleasure of dealing with ambulance chasers on a daily basis. They're not all bad, but some of the s h i t they try to pass off as a legitimately injured party is beyond ridiculous.
WHAT????????
How do you think I'm paying for my built engine?
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,833
Likes: 0
From: Botswana
Re: Re: Re: Re: IHRA Response to Roll Bar Rules
[i]
And BTW, Thanks Tallimeca and Whip for the kind words! [/B]
And BTW, Thanks Tallimeca and Whip for the kind words! [/B]
Hey........what about me??? I had kind words too....
.Good to see ya made it home alright...I guess your missed turn off was only a slight delay.
Rocks
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 526
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From: Maine
Re: Re: Re: IHRA Response to Roll Bar Rules
Originally posted by Tim Skelton
That is an outright lie.
By the time that I pointed out that the word "rear" was missing from the 2005 rulebook passage that you quoted, the thread was about 20 pages long. In fact, that was one of the last posts before it got closed.
That is an outright lie.
By the time that I pointed out that the word "rear" was missing from the 2005 rulebook passage that you quoted, the thread was about 20 pages long. In fact, that was one of the last posts before it got closed.
LOL...you are a fool!
You need to go read that thread again,..I clearly said right from the beginning that REAR bars weren't required because IHRA simply calls them BRACES...not rear bars!
That was the whole concept behind my original post!
Here is like my third response to SaL:
Qoute
fomocofan
Senior Member
Vehicle: 2000 Ford Lightning
Registered: Jan 2002
Location: Maine
Posts: 376
Well, you are sounding like a jerk, Sal...Because I said I have a IHRA rulebook right here...It does not say anything about 30 degrees!!
Like I said you could still have a 30 degree forward brace bar to adequately support the main hoop from forward and lateral collapse!
IHRA doesn't even call them "rear bars" only support bars.
I think you had better go get an IHRA rulebook and read it before you go telling anyone about something you have no knowledge of!!
I am not giving anyone advice bad or otherwise,I am just saying what is IHRA legal...
As we all know IHRA and NHRA have different ideas on what is right!
Besides that...why don't you read what you just posted...that little blurb doesn't say rearward collapse does it??
It only says forward and lateral support!!!
Last edited by fomocofan on 02-06-2005 at 11:02 PM
UnQoute
That was my mistake and or assumption that omitting the word rear had to mean that they weren't required as they are in NHRA were it is clearly printed "rear bars".
You're too funny....I was laughing at you when you finally got it in that post that that was what i had been talking about the whole time!! You were alittle slow on the uptake, buddy!!
Here was my response to your Startling observation:
Qoute
No Tim, there is no typo there, but I think you might just be on to something here!!
You seemed to pick up on THE difference in the rules that I have been talking about for 75 pages!!!
How much "common sense" does it take to see that IHRA does not use the words REAR BAR for a reason!!
They obviously intended to mean that a brace bar is required and that it does not have to be directed in any particular direction or angle...otherwise they would have specified that just as NHRA did!
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fomocofan is online now Old Post 02-11-2005 01:29 AM
Unqoute
Last edited by fomocofan; Feb 15, 2005 at 11:51 PM.
