4 Valve Motors will be for sale shortly
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From: Northern, California
Originally posted by MISTERgadget
poor GT.
poor GT.
Last edited by Calightnin; Mar 4, 2005 at 04:03 AM.
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From: RogersAr
I think the big reason why there are no 4 valve blower manifold for the lightning is the fact of $$ to get them cast and machined.Lets face it i am for a good deal to,but if JDM or PSP or even JLP came out with one and had to sell it for 1500.00 for just the manifold everyone on the boards would say to dang much.And then what could happen is one of the vendors would buy one and cast it just a little different and sell it cheaper.and everyone would say that is competition and who ever cast them first would have to lower their price so they could recoup the initial cost of it.Were as the 'competition' only had to copy the design.SO how is that competition.I know I would not want to spend thousands in design make a mold and only sell maybe 10 at that cost then have to lower my price because some a-hole copied it and only had to spend maybe a third of my investment to get one to market.
I CAN have them designed,cast up and machined ready to run for about a third of what it would cost here.But I am still not going to because of what I said!!There is no loyality [or very little] towards the produt when there is 2 that do the same thing!Just the lower price wins out!! STan
People who do things like I said are the ones who really lose,SINCE I can make about anypart I want and race with it.And if all else was equal I would have the advatage and you would always be 2nd.
'We make our own beds that we sleep in'
I CAN have them designed,cast up and machined ready to run for about a third of what it would cost here.But I am still not going to because of what I said!!There is no loyality [or very little] towards the produt when there is 2 that do the same thing!Just the lower price wins out!! STan
People who do things like I said are the ones who really lose,SINCE I can make about anypart I want and race with it.And if all else was equal I would have the advatage and you would always be 2nd.
'We make our own beds that we sleep in'
Last edited by Ruslow; Mar 4, 2005 at 09:08 AM.
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From: Plymouth, MI
Originally posted by Ruslow
I think the big reason why there are no 4 valve blower manifold for the lightning is the fact of $$ to get them cast and machined.Lets face it i am for a good deal to,but if JDM or PSP or even JLP came out with one and had to sell it for 1500.00 for just the manifold everyone on the boards would say to dang much.And then what could happen is one of the vendors would buy one and cast it just a little different and sell it cheaper.and everyone would say that is competition and who ever cast them first would have to lower their price so they could recoup the initial cost of it.Were as the 'competition' only had to copy the design.SO how is that competition.I know I would not want to spend thousands in design make a mold and only sell maybe 10 at that cost then have to lower my price because some a-hole copied it and only had to spend maybe a third of my investment to get one to market.
I CAN have them designed,cast up and machined ready to run for about a third of what it would cost here.But I am still not going to because of what I said!!There is no loyality [or very little] towards the produt when there is 2 that do the same thing!Just the lower price wins out!! STan
People who do things like I said are the ones who really lose,SINCE I can make about anypart I want and race with it.And if all else was equal I would have the advatage and you would always be 2nd.
'We make our own beds that we sleep in'
I think the big reason why there are no 4 valve blower manifold for the lightning is the fact of $$ to get them cast and machined.Lets face it i am for a good deal to,but if JDM or PSP or even JLP came out with one and had to sell it for 1500.00 for just the manifold everyone on the boards would say to dang much.And then what could happen is one of the vendors would buy one and cast it just a little different and sell it cheaper.and everyone would say that is competition and who ever cast them first would have to lower their price so they could recoup the initial cost of it.Were as the 'competition' only had to copy the design.SO how is that competition.I know I would not want to spend thousands in design make a mold and only sell maybe 10 at that cost then have to lower my price because some a-hole copied it and only had to spend maybe a third of my investment to get one to market.
I CAN have them designed,cast up and machined ready to run for about a third of what it would cost here.But I am still not going to because of what I said!!There is no loyality [or very little] towards the produt when there is 2 that do the same thing!Just the lower price wins out!! STan
People who do things like I said are the ones who really lose,SINCE I can make about anypart I want and race with it.And if all else was equal I would have the advatage and you would always be 2nd.
'We make our own beds that we sleep in'
That would also make it tough for competitors to copy at a lower cost.
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From: RogersAr
well I bet i could have one cast and to market for less thanwhat hogan would charge to make one.I figure if I did a volume of over 100 I could get them for around 500 each. and could be less as the volume goes up.Stan
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From: illinois
Originally posted by madferraristi
I would think, in the final analysis, that volume is rather optimistic, when you consider that in addition to the heads, etc, it also takes a fresh shortblock (higher C/R pistons) to make it work.
I would think, in the final analysis, that volume is rather optimistic, when you consider that in addition to the heads, etc, it also takes a fresh shortblock (higher C/R pistons) to make it work.
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From: Miami / NYC
Originally posted by monkeysL
not trying to start an arguement, BUT you do NOT need different pistons, the chamber on the 4v heads is larger and keeps the c/r approx the same. i have talked to JDM and they are using stronger pistons b/c they are looking at making larger amounts of hp but still same dish (i called to see if they were selling a build up kit for a 4v and was told it was the same piston)....same for REM's 4v they are building.
not trying to start an arguement, BUT you do NOT need different pistons, the chamber on the 4v heads is larger and keeps the c/r approx the same. i have talked to JDM and they are using stronger pistons b/c they are looking at making larger amounts of hp but still same dish (i called to see if they were selling a build up kit for a 4v and was told it was the same piston)....same for REM's 4v they are building.
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From: illinois
Originally posted by MISTERgadget
uhhhh yeah, you would have a CR somewhere in the 7's if you kept the same dish. I have done the calculations but don't know the number off hand. The larger chamber on 4V heads does the exact opposite of what you said, and LOWERS the CR.
uhhhh yeah, you would have a CR somewhere in the 7's if you kept the same dish. I have done the calculations but don't know the number off hand. The larger chamber on 4V heads does the exact opposite of what you said, and LOWERS the CR.
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From: Auburn Wa
How can you increase chamber volume by 8 to 10 cc and keep the same compression ratio with the same piston ??
A stock Navigator engine has a flat top piston....no dish.
It sounds like the JDM engine will be using Navi heads.
If you run the current 17 cc dish piston with the Navi heads the compression ratio will drop.
Dropping the compression ratio on the 4V heads is not ...... well.... never mind
Dale
A stock Navigator engine has a flat top piston....no dish.
It sounds like the JDM engine will be using Navi heads.
If you run the current 17 cc dish piston with the Navi heads the compression ratio will drop.
Dropping the compression ratio on the 4V heads is not ...... well.... never mind
Dale
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From: Newark,CA
The stock "L" heads have a nominal 46cc chamber. The 4V are nominally 54cc.
Using the same piston that has an 8.4:1 C/R, when you increase the chamber by 8cc, the C/R drops to 7.8:1.
That is why they make a 10cc dish piston since the 4.6 Cobra motor uses the same pistons as ours and due to the "Modular" design they yield the same C/R in either motor.
Using the same piston that has an 8.4:1 C/R, when you increase the chamber by 8cc, the C/R drops to 7.8:1.
That is why they make a 10cc dish piston since the 4.6 Cobra motor uses the same pistons as ours and due to the "Modular" design they yield the same C/R in either motor.
Last edited by madferraristi; Mar 4, 2005 at 09:28 PM.
