HELP!!! Emissions Problems!!!
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From: KC, MO
HELP!!! Emissions Problems!!!
I've posted this several times in the Exhaust forum, and no one has really answered yet, so here I am. Here we go:
From day one, my truck (see sig.) has had an on / off check engine light problem. After doing all my mods. I reset the computer of course, which dumped the error code. I finally, at 2,800 miles, had the light come on, so I took it to the local dealership, and they said I had a bad O2 sensor. They replaced it, and the CEL hasn't come on since. Now, since about the 1,000 mile mark, the exhaust has been REAL fumey, and stinks like rotten eggs. Now that the O2 has been replaced, it's almost worse. I've taken it in two more times for Ford to check out, and they say, it's fine, or they don't smell a thing. I finally called another Ford dealer today, and he tells me that under Ford's policy, my K&N, and my Flowmaster voided my emissions related warrenty. The muffler shop guys say that it's BS, and even the first Ford dealer I took it to says that their unrelated. Anyway, this guys tells me that the K&N is allowing too much air to enter the system, and the computers are sooo highly calibrated, that the slightest chage messes them all up. He said that the O2 sensors are opening all the way up, and allowing the hot air to set in them, and heat up the platnium. He said he's seen this occur several times. Is their any merit to this story? They tell me that theirs no test for the CATS. I thought their was a pressure test they could do by plugging in a pressure guage where the O2 sensors go? What can I do guys??? HELP!!! My CATS stink, and my exhaust is really, really, quiet, even though I put on a FM 40, and have a turn down. Is my warrenty void? Am I SOL?
-AR
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2001 F-150 XLT 4X4 Off-Road, S/C, FS, Black[*] 4.6L Triton V8 HPI[*] 5 Speed / 3:55 Reg. Axle[*] Keyless[*] Premium Audio CD
Mods:[*] K&N Cold Airbox / Throttle Body Mod.[*] Flowmaster 40 (3" x 20" "Turn-Down") [*] Cranked Torsion Bars[*] APC XENON PLASMA Super Whites[*] Bugshield[*] Bedliner[*] Ventshades[*] "Light Argent" 4X4 Off-Road Decals[*] K&N & Flowmaster Stickers (Under the Hood)
Audio:[*] Rockford Fosgate G360A2 Punch Amp[*] JL 12W3-D2 (JL ProWedge Box)
Build Date: 8/23/00 (Kansas City Plant)
arobbins@mail.liberty.k12.mo.us
From day one, my truck (see sig.) has had an on / off check engine light problem. After doing all my mods. I reset the computer of course, which dumped the error code. I finally, at 2,800 miles, had the light come on, so I took it to the local dealership, and they said I had a bad O2 sensor. They replaced it, and the CEL hasn't come on since. Now, since about the 1,000 mile mark, the exhaust has been REAL fumey, and stinks like rotten eggs. Now that the O2 has been replaced, it's almost worse. I've taken it in two more times for Ford to check out, and they say, it's fine, or they don't smell a thing. I finally called another Ford dealer today, and he tells me that under Ford's policy, my K&N, and my Flowmaster voided my emissions related warrenty. The muffler shop guys say that it's BS, and even the first Ford dealer I took it to says that their unrelated. Anyway, this guys tells me that the K&N is allowing too much air to enter the system, and the computers are sooo highly calibrated, that the slightest chage messes them all up. He said that the O2 sensors are opening all the way up, and allowing the hot air to set in them, and heat up the platnium. He said he's seen this occur several times. Is their any merit to this story? They tell me that theirs no test for the CATS. I thought their was a pressure test they could do by plugging in a pressure guage where the O2 sensors go? What can I do guys??? HELP!!! My CATS stink, and my exhaust is really, really, quiet, even though I put on a FM 40, and have a turn down. Is my warrenty void? Am I SOL?
-AR
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2001 F-150 XLT 4X4 Off-Road, S/C, FS, Black[*] 4.6L Triton V8 HPI[*] 5 Speed / 3:55 Reg. Axle[*] Keyless[*] Premium Audio CD
Mods:[*] K&N Cold Airbox / Throttle Body Mod.[*] Flowmaster 40 (3" x 20" "Turn-Down") [*] Cranked Torsion Bars[*] APC XENON PLASMA Super Whites[*] Bugshield[*] Bedliner[*] Ventshades[*] "Light Argent" 4X4 Off-Road Decals[*] K&N & Flowmaster Stickers (Under the Hood)
Audio:[*] Rockford Fosgate G360A2 Punch Amp[*] JL 12W3-D2 (JL ProWedge Box)
Build Date: 8/23/00 (Kansas City Plant)
arobbins@mail.liberty.k12.mo.us
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From: KC, MO
The guys at my local muffler shop tell me that sometimes it's the grade of fuel. They told me to try a higher grade of gas. I currently run Quick Trip's 87 octane. What should I do? Run QT's 89? Try a different gas station?
-AR
-AR
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Joined: Dec 1999
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From: DOT BOMB CITY!
First off, anything that comes out of a dealers mouth has a 50/50 chance of being truth. Secondly, they can not void your warranty due to an aftermarket "BOLT-ON!"
Go to the computer chips thread and ask Mike T. about this federal law.
Just ANOTHER lesson in dealership honesty and integrity!
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Rand
98 Ford Expedition 4X4 XLT
5.4, 3.73s, 17" wheels,
Homemade 3" "COLD" Air-Box
mod, SuperChip, Amsoil
everywhere but tranny, Perma-
Cool combo 6 pass trans/oil
cooler (FQR 5.4 @ 50K)
Go to the computer chips thread and ask Mike T. about this federal law.
Just ANOTHER lesson in dealership honesty and integrity!
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Rand
98 Ford Expedition 4X4 XLT
5.4, 3.73s, 17" wheels,
Homemade 3" "COLD" Air-Box
mod, SuperChip, Amsoil
everywhere but tranny, Perma-
Cool combo 6 pass trans/oil
cooler (FQR 5.4 @ 50K)
Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 95
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From: Columbia, SC
Jackal, If I were you, I would go to the muffler shop and pull off the FMs to see how it sounds. If it is not that load w/o the muffler, then you will know that the problem is farther up the line. If that is the case, then get new cats. If your O2 sensor was jacked up then your cats might be full of deposits, which might explain the rotten eggs smell and the poor sound b/c it is all restricted and clogged up. I am by no means a mechanic. I'm just tryin to offer up any possible suggestions. I hope it works out.
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1997 F150 4x2 6cyl x-cab flareside black clearcoat
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1997 F150 4x2 6cyl x-cab flareside black clearcoat
Technical Article Contributor
Joined: Dec 1997
Posts: 9,417
Likes: 11
From: Windsor,Ontario,Canada
I had a 1997 and now a 2000 with a cat back muffler, Borla to be more precise, and a K&N.
The exhaust coming out of my tail pipe doesn't stink. The Dealer is full of Sh*t.
E-Mail me and I will give you my phone# and have your dealer call me and I will personally tell him he is full of Sh*t! All the O2 sensor does is measure the oxygen content of the exhaust system and the PCM uses this measurement to calculate the fuel mix, timing etc.. There is a second sensor after the Cat that checks the integrity of the cat. If the cat fails it will set a code to tell you that the cat has failed. Adding a K&N will alow slightly more air to flow into the engine. The PCM is well capable of adjusting for this extra air. Have him show and give you the written Policy he speaks of. I would be curious to see it.
Regards
Jean Marc Chartier
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00 F-150 XLT SC Flairside 4x4 4.6 w/5spd 3.55LSD
Warn XD9000i, skid plates, Draw tite class III,
Rancho RSX Reflex shocks,
BFG 285/75 R16 MTs,
Borla Cat Back, Headman Headers,
Modified Air Cleaner Outlet Tube
and air box, Ported Throttle body,
Shortened MAF sensor tower,
K&N air filter,
Superchips
The exhaust coming out of my tail pipe doesn't stink. The Dealer is full of Sh*t.
E-Mail me and I will give you my phone# and have your dealer call me and I will personally tell him he is full of Sh*t! All the O2 sensor does is measure the oxygen content of the exhaust system and the PCM uses this measurement to calculate the fuel mix, timing etc.. There is a second sensor after the Cat that checks the integrity of the cat. If the cat fails it will set a code to tell you that the cat has failed. Adding a K&N will alow slightly more air to flow into the engine. The PCM is well capable of adjusting for this extra air. Have him show and give you the written Policy he speaks of. I would be curious to see it.
Regards
Jean Marc Chartier
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00 F-150 XLT SC Flairside 4x4 4.6 w/5spd 3.55LSD
Warn XD9000i, skid plates, Draw tite class III,
Rancho RSX Reflex shocks,
BFG 285/75 R16 MTs,
Borla Cat Back, Headman Headers,
Modified Air Cleaner Outlet Tube
and air box, Ported Throttle body,
Shortened MAF sensor tower,
K&N air filter,
Superchips
Thread Starter
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Senior Member
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From: KC, MO
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Senior Member
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From: KC, MO
Bill Woods...they are terrible, also Blue Springs Ford, I've usually had fairly good service with them, until the phone call yesterday. Then their was the time they serviced my clutch, and broke the boot and it's plastic floor piece. Then, couldn't fix it, so they ordered the parts, for the wrong parts, then couldn't get the right parts. I spent more time at these two shops, than I have spent in the truck. 
-AR
-AR
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 52
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From: SW OK
It sounds to me like one or more of your cats are at least partially plugged up! I had the same thing happen on my old Ford Ranger. It may still fall under the emissions warranty:
Clean Air Act Warranty Provisions (42 U.S.C. S 7541 (C) (3) (B))
The federal Clean Air Act requires vehicle makers to provide two emissions-related warranties -- a production warranty and a performance warranty. The production warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle is designed, built and equipped so that it conforms with emissions requirements at the time of sale. The performance warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle will comply with applicable emissions requirements as tested under state vehicle emissions inspection programs for the warranty periods specified in the law (for model year 1995 and later vehicles, the warranty is 2 years/24,000 miles for all emissions-related parts and 8 years/80,000 miles for the catalytic converter, electronic emissions control unit and on-board diagnostic device). The performance warranty is conditioned on the vehicle being properly maintained and operated.
The Magnuson-Moss Act states that vehicle manufacturers may not refuse warranty repairs under the Clean Air Acts performance and defect warranties merely because aftermarket parts have been installed on the vehicle. The only circumstance under which the vehicle manufacturer can void the emissions warranties is if an aftermarket part is responsible for (causes) the warranty claim.
Good luck and keep us posted!
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2000 F-150 Lariat SC Flareside ORP, Chestnut w/Arizona Beige two-tone; 5.4L, 3.55LS; 4wDisc-ABS; Remote Keyless Entry; Factory 6-Pack CD changer; Signal Mirrors; Ford Duraliner; Retrax Roll-top Cover; Flowmaster 70 Series Dual Exhaust; Cold AirBox Mod; Tinted windows; VentVisors
Clean Air Act Warranty Provisions (42 U.S.C. S 7541 (C) (3) (B))
The federal Clean Air Act requires vehicle makers to provide two emissions-related warranties -- a production warranty and a performance warranty. The production warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle is designed, built and equipped so that it conforms with emissions requirements at the time of sale. The performance warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle will comply with applicable emissions requirements as tested under state vehicle emissions inspection programs for the warranty periods specified in the law (for model year 1995 and later vehicles, the warranty is 2 years/24,000 miles for all emissions-related parts and 8 years/80,000 miles for the catalytic converter, electronic emissions control unit and on-board diagnostic device). The performance warranty is conditioned on the vehicle being properly maintained and operated.
The Magnuson-Moss Act states that vehicle manufacturers may not refuse warranty repairs under the Clean Air Acts performance and defect warranties merely because aftermarket parts have been installed on the vehicle. The only circumstance under which the vehicle manufacturer can void the emissions warranties is if an aftermarket part is responsible for (causes) the warranty claim.
Good luck and keep us posted!
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2000 F-150 Lariat SC Flareside ORP, Chestnut w/Arizona Beige two-tone; 5.4L, 3.55LS; 4wDisc-ABS; Remote Keyless Entry; Factory 6-Pack CD changer; Signal Mirrors; Ford Duraliner; Retrax Roll-top Cover; Flowmaster 70 Series Dual Exhaust; Cold AirBox Mod; Tinted windows; VentVisors
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Posts: 626
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From: New Jersey
Jackal,
Your dealer is blowing smoke ..... he obviously doesn't know if his rectum was bored out or punched out.
Ford sells "accessories" in a booklet most dealers have for the asking. In this booklet Ford sells a K & N air filter, only colored blue instead of the K & N Orange.
Obtain one of these accessory books and take it to your service manager, then tell him to bend WAY over......
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Dunbarton "The Middle Aged Kid" '99 XLT SC SB 4x2 4.6 auto 3.55 ls The occasional Z-71 Eater! Wedgewood & Denim, SuperChipped, Airaid FIPK, HD electrical and cooling, power seat, Rhino Liner, Extang Classic tonneau cover, Mobil 1. Man, I got it all! (New Jersey)
Your dealer is blowing smoke ..... he obviously doesn't know if his rectum was bored out or punched out.
Ford sells "accessories" in a booklet most dealers have for the asking. In this booklet Ford sells a K & N air filter, only colored blue instead of the K & N Orange.
Obtain one of these accessory books and take it to your service manager, then tell him to bend WAY over......
------------------
Dunbarton "The Middle Aged Kid" '99 XLT SC SB 4x2 4.6 auto 3.55 ls The occasional Z-71 Eater! Wedgewood & Denim, SuperChipped, Airaid FIPK, HD electrical and cooling, power seat, Rhino Liner, Extang Classic tonneau cover, Mobil 1. Man, I got it all! (New Jersey)
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I would try Bob Allen Ford in Overland Park, or Metro Ford in Independence. If neither of them are any help (been great for me. They are under the same ownership), try Bob Sight Ford in Lees Summit. Bob Sight has been helpful in the past, but I had a bad experience with them on a truck I did not buy from them. They try to maneuver around helping much if you didn't buy from them.