5W/30 & 10W/30
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 1,544
Likes: 0
From: Kalamazoo, MI, USA
First rule in business:
Follow the Money.
I believe that Ford has recommended 5W-30 primarily due to the money it saves from CAFE fuel credits -- and that 5W-30 will permit an acceptable engine life while gaining them some kudos from the EPA.
Period.
Ford also knows that most people will NOT be using synthetic oil -- so I infer that their recommendation is based upon quality non-synthetic oil.
For comparison purposes, let's look at 5 oils from Mobil
a05W) Drive Clean 5W-30
b10W) Drive Clean 10W-30
c05W) Mobil 1 5W-30
d10W) Mobil 1 10W-30
e15W) Mobil 1 15W-50
The major features for them (in order) are:
a05W|b10W|c05W|d10W|e15W Oil Type
600|600|600|600|600 Boiling Point (F)
392|392|392|392|417 Flash Point (F)
60.0|67.0|56.0|63.5|120.0 Viscosity at 40C
10.5|10.0|09.8|10.2|17.3 Viscosity at 100C
-33F|-27F|-65F|-65F|-65F Pour Point
Now, from the above provided by Mobil from its web (MSDS Sheets), note that the Viscosity at 40C for the Mobil 1 10W product (4th column) at 63.5 is within 6% of the 60.0 shown for the non-synthetic 5W (column 1).
Also note that the pour point for the FIFTEEN-W synthetic product (column 5) is -65F whereas the FIVE-W non-synthetic (column 1) is 'only' -33 degrees F (it's too bad there's not a spec for quick-lube-at-32F too).
The 10W Synthetic (col 4) is less viscous at 100C than the 5W Non-Synthetic (col 1) yet any thinking man would rather have the synthetic Mobil 1 in his engine at 212 degrees F than the non-synthetic.
So...
...back to my hypothesis:
You're not going to notice your engine running poorly on 5W-30 -- and Ford is banking on that -- plus
It is very handy for a manufacturer to issue a blanket recommendation of one oil range for every (gasoline) engine in it's fleet -- plus
Mobil 1 10W- product has proven itself worthy of any engine in on-the-street service for many many years.
And...
...while Mobil 1 5W-30 was fine for my last (leased) F-150...
...it makes ME feel better running Mobil 1 10W-30 in Nick (which I plan on driving for 15 years) -- especially when I'm pulling a trailer...
...so that's what I'll continue to use (in the summer
).
Follow the Money -- and you'll find the truth.
(edited to line up colums as best I could)
------------------
Y2K™ Jim
Toreador Red, Keyless XLT SC SB 5.4L E4x4 4wDisc/ABS, 3.73LS, Skid, HD 7700# Towing, LT-245's on Chrome, Tube-Steps, Captain's, 6CD, Tonneau, named: "Nick"
[This message has been edited by Y2K 7700 4x4 (edited 08-16-2000).]
Follow the Money.
I believe that Ford has recommended 5W-30 primarily due to the money it saves from CAFE fuel credits -- and that 5W-30 will permit an acceptable engine life while gaining them some kudos from the EPA.
Period.
Ford also knows that most people will NOT be using synthetic oil -- so I infer that their recommendation is based upon quality non-synthetic oil.
For comparison purposes, let's look at 5 oils from Mobil
a05W) Drive Clean 5W-30
b10W) Drive Clean 10W-30
c05W) Mobil 1 5W-30
d10W) Mobil 1 10W-30
e15W) Mobil 1 15W-50
The major features for them (in order) are:
a05W|b10W|c05W|d10W|e15W Oil Type
600|600|600|600|600 Boiling Point (F)
392|392|392|392|417 Flash Point (F)
60.0|67.0|56.0|63.5|120.0 Viscosity at 40C
10.5|10.0|09.8|10.2|17.3 Viscosity at 100C
-33F|-27F|-65F|-65F|-65F Pour Point
Now, from the above provided by Mobil from its web (MSDS Sheets), note that the Viscosity at 40C for the Mobil 1 10W product (4th column) at 63.5 is within 6% of the 60.0 shown for the non-synthetic 5W (column 1).
Also note that the pour point for the FIFTEEN-W synthetic product (column 5) is -65F whereas the FIVE-W non-synthetic (column 1) is 'only' -33 degrees F (it's too bad there's not a spec for quick-lube-at-32F too).
The 10W Synthetic (col 4) is less viscous at 100C than the 5W Non-Synthetic (col 1) yet any thinking man would rather have the synthetic Mobil 1 in his engine at 212 degrees F than the non-synthetic.
So...
...back to my hypothesis:
You're not going to notice your engine running poorly on 5W-30 -- and Ford is banking on that -- plus
It is very handy for a manufacturer to issue a blanket recommendation of one oil range for every (gasoline) engine in it's fleet -- plus
Mobil 1 10W- product has proven itself worthy of any engine in on-the-street service for many many years.
And...
...while Mobil 1 5W-30 was fine for my last (leased) F-150...
...it makes ME feel better running Mobil 1 10W-30 in Nick (which I plan on driving for 15 years) -- especially when I'm pulling a trailer...
...so that's what I'll continue to use (in the summer
).Follow the Money -- and you'll find the truth.
(edited to line up colums as best I could)
------------------
Y2K™ Jim
Toreador Red, Keyless XLT SC SB 5.4L E4x4 4wDisc/ABS, 3.73LS, Skid, HD 7700# Towing, LT-245's on Chrome, Tube-Steps, Captain's, 6CD, Tonneau, named: "Nick"
[This message has been edited by Y2K 7700 4x4 (edited 08-16-2000).]
Member
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 82
Likes: 0
From: Santa Clarita, CA USA
Y2K 7700 4x4,
I don't think I could have said it better myself. Good posting.
Most guys would go with the Mobil-1 5w30 and some that think it out would go with the 10w30 as you suggest. Although the Mobil one can be purchased at any auto store the LE-SPB 5w-30 has proven 1/2 the wear on an ASTM D-2670 wear test than the Mobil-1 5w-30 did. Most oils either failed the test or scored 14 to 19 on the test (the higher number is higher wear). Mobil-1 5w-30 scored 12 and LE-SPB 5w-30 scored 6. On another test ASTM D-4742 TFOUT or oxidation test the average oxidation number of the 12 oils tested that passed the wear test was 265 (higher number is better or more oxidation resistance). The Mobil-1 5w-30 showed the highest at 509 and the LE-SPB showed the second highest at 481. If I were to go with the 5w-30 oil viscosity then I would find out were to buy the LE-SPB 5w-30 because it has 1/2 the wear of mobil-1 and has by far the closest oxidation than any other oil did. However I'm with Y2K and I would run LE-Ultra 8130 10w-30 It's the same as the LE 5w30 but with more additives and less wear than the 5w-30. In the same type of tests the 10w-30 showed less wear than synthetic and petro 15w-40 oils used for diesels.
Sincerely, Kevin
I don't think I could have said it better myself. Good posting.
Most guys would go with the Mobil-1 5w30 and some that think it out would go with the 10w30 as you suggest. Although the Mobil one can be purchased at any auto store the LE-SPB 5w-30 has proven 1/2 the wear on an ASTM D-2670 wear test than the Mobil-1 5w-30 did. Most oils either failed the test or scored 14 to 19 on the test (the higher number is higher wear). Mobil-1 5w-30 scored 12 and LE-SPB 5w-30 scored 6. On another test ASTM D-4742 TFOUT or oxidation test the average oxidation number of the 12 oils tested that passed the wear test was 265 (higher number is better or more oxidation resistance). The Mobil-1 5w-30 showed the highest at 509 and the LE-SPB showed the second highest at 481. If I were to go with the 5w-30 oil viscosity then I would find out were to buy the LE-SPB 5w-30 because it has 1/2 the wear of mobil-1 and has by far the closest oxidation than any other oil did. However I'm with Y2K and I would run LE-Ultra 8130 10w-30 It's the same as the LE 5w30 but with more additives and less wear than the 5w-30. In the same type of tests the 10w-30 showed less wear than synthetic and petro 15w-40 oils used for diesels.
Sincerely, Kevin
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 368
Likes: 0
From: South of the Red River
OIL MAN
A good friend of mine works at LE in the local Fort Worth area. He got me a case of 5W30 LE that I have changed with one time. Are you saying that I would be better of using 10W30 LE? If so, what are the additional additives, etc. that make this worthwile. Would hate to give up on a case of oil.....
------------------
2000 F-150 XLT Sport, Silver 4-door Supercab StyleSide
Short Bed (Only way to fit in the garage)
17" Sport Wheels with BFG tires, 3.55 R, 4.6l V8, Auto (First one in 20 years)
In-Dash Single CD Player, 60/40 Split bench dark graphite
Mods So Far
Fumoto Drain Valve, K&N Filter, Gatorback Spray-In Bedliner,
Llumar ProShield Window Tint, WMS Velocity Tube
Future Plans
Superchip, Upgraded Speakers/Stereo
FlowMaster Exhaust, Nerf Bars
A good friend of mine works at LE in the local Fort Worth area. He got me a case of 5W30 LE that I have changed with one time. Are you saying that I would be better of using 10W30 LE? If so, what are the additional additives, etc. that make this worthwile. Would hate to give up on a case of oil.....
------------------
2000 F-150 XLT Sport, Silver 4-door Supercab StyleSide
Short Bed (Only way to fit in the garage)
17" Sport Wheels with BFG tires, 3.55 R, 4.6l V8, Auto (First one in 20 years)
In-Dash Single CD Player, 60/40 Split bench dark graphite
Mods So Far
Fumoto Drain Valve, K&N Filter, Gatorback Spray-In Bedliner,
Llumar ProShield Window Tint, WMS Velocity Tube
Future Plans
Superchip, Upgraded Speakers/Stereo
FlowMaster Exhaust, Nerf Bars
Member
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 82
Likes: 0
From: Santa Clarita, CA USA
Y2kXLTSport,
No, that was just my opinion. I can't tell anyone to use a 10w-30 when the factory says to use a 5w-30.
Everyone has different temps around the country, mine in SO Calif are never very cold. The difference in the LE 5w-30 and 10w-30 is that the 5w-30 was made for gas only and the 10w-30 was made for diesel and gas and has a more robust additive package. The 5w-30 is on the light side of a SAE 30 and the 10w-30 is up in the higher side of a SAE 30. This difference would make it better for me in So. Calif. Both oils are great. When have you ever heard of an oil beat the Mobil-1 type in wear? Both LE oils do this. I made a personal choice for the area that I live in. If I lived in Canada or Alaska or Montana etc. then I would use the LE 5w-30.
BTW. who is it that you know at LE? You can e-mail me on this one.
Sincerely, Kevin
[This message has been edited by Oil Man (edited 08-17-2000).]
No, that was just my opinion. I can't tell anyone to use a 10w-30 when the factory says to use a 5w-30.
Everyone has different temps around the country, mine in SO Calif are never very cold. The difference in the LE 5w-30 and 10w-30 is that the 5w-30 was made for gas only and the 10w-30 was made for diesel and gas and has a more robust additive package. The 5w-30 is on the light side of a SAE 30 and the 10w-30 is up in the higher side of a SAE 30. This difference would make it better for me in So. Calif. Both oils are great. When have you ever heard of an oil beat the Mobil-1 type in wear? Both LE oils do this. I made a personal choice for the area that I live in. If I lived in Canada or Alaska or Montana etc. then I would use the LE 5w-30.
BTW. who is it that you know at LE? You can e-mail me on this one.
Sincerely, Kevin
[This message has been edited by Oil Man (edited 08-17-2000).]
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 368
Likes: 0
From: South of the Red River
Oil Man,
I would think that if you determined you needed 10W30 in SoCal, that the same would apply here in North Texas.
Could not find your email so I will hold off on the name....
------------------
2000 F-150 XLT Sport, Silver 4-door Supercab StyleSide
Short Bed (Only way to fit in the garage)
17" Sport Wheels with BFG tires, 3.55 R, 4.6l V8, Auto (First one in 20 years)
In-Dash Single CD Player, 60/40 Split bench dark graphite
Mods So Far
Fumoto Drain Valve, K&N Filter, Gatorback Spray-In Bedliner,
Llumar ProShield Window Tint, WMS Velocity Tube
Future Plans
Superchip, Upgraded Speakers/Stereo
FlowMaster Exhaust, Nerf Bars
I would think that if you determined you needed 10W30 in SoCal, that the same would apply here in North Texas.
Could not find your email so I will hold off on the name....
------------------
2000 F-150 XLT Sport, Silver 4-door Supercab StyleSide
Short Bed (Only way to fit in the garage)
17" Sport Wheels with BFG tires, 3.55 R, 4.6l V8, Auto (First one in 20 years)
In-Dash Single CD Player, 60/40 Split bench dark graphite
Mods So Far
Fumoto Drain Valve, K&N Filter, Gatorback Spray-In Bedliner,
Llumar ProShield Window Tint, WMS Velocity Tube
Future Plans
Superchip, Upgraded Speakers/Stereo
FlowMaster Exhaust, Nerf Bars
Member
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 82
Likes: 0
From: Santa Clarita, CA USA
jmartinb,
The LE corporate number is 10800-537-7683 ask for Clay Calk. Or visit the LE web sight at www.le-inc.com There is some info there but not much, LE likes to keep things close to the vest.
Sincerely, Kevin
The LE corporate number is 10800-537-7683 ask for Clay Calk. Or visit the LE web sight at www.le-inc.com There is some info there but not much, LE likes to keep things close to the vest.
Sincerely, Kevin