My neighbour, who happens to be a area service rep. for GM came over last night as I was doing an oil change. When he saw that I was pouring in Mobil 1 he told me that I was pouring my money down the tubes.
At a meeting between dealer service managers and factory engineers and service reps back in March, they discussed synthetic oils.
GM labs and a university undertook a 22 month long study involving hundreds of vehicles. Some were run with synthetic and others with conventional oil. Two taxi companies, one police force and a fleet of school buses were among the cars/trucks tested. At the end of the study, the results of engine oil analysis and interim testing conducted on the vehicles, showed that there was no evidence to suggest that synthetic oils promote longer engine life!
Oil analysis' showed negligable differences in the amount of wear particulate, No difference in the amount of sludge formation by the end of the study period, and no difference in emmisions between the two groups.
GM basicallly told its dealers to stock more synthetic oil because more customers were asking for it.
I don't know if he's a victim of corporate brainwashing or something , but he firmly believes the test results. He challenged me to find an INDEPENDANT study or anything that proves that synthetic engine oils are better. I have search alll over the web, but can't find anyhting other than ad material from the oil makers.
Does anyone have a source of reliable information ( not the oil manufacturers!)
that proves the claims made about synthetic oils?

 

Don't the corvettes come with synthetic oil in them? Why would they use it if what he says is true?

 

I agree with tech1. Just yesterday I saw a Mobil 1 commercial saying which "high line" cars come from the factory with Mobil 1 and the Corvette was one of them. It even went so far as to say they "recommend using it". Obviously GM trusts it enough to put it in one of their flagship cars and let it be used in commercials.

 

If you will post your e-mail address, I'll send you some links on synthetic oils. Your neighbor is wrong!!

 

Simon,

Corvette will void your warranty now if you don't use it.

Besides Corvette, Mercedes, Porsche, Viper and some VW models come with it from the factory. How does your neighbor explain this? Since your neighbor was only qualified to sit and listen he believed everything that was told him.

I personally observed at a GM training school the results of two V-6 engines run for 100,000 miles with Mobil 1 and other high quality petroleum based oil using factory recommended change intervals. The cleanliness of the torn down engine using Mobil was quite sobering.

This was NOT an endorsement by GM for Mobil 1, it was strictly a comparison to show the trainees the benefits of a top quality synthetic.

As a non-professional of reasonable intelligence there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that a good synthetic oil is advantagoeus to any automobile engine from a personal "hands on" observation.

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Dunbarton "The Middle Aged Kid" '99 XLT SC SB 4x2 4.6 auto 3.55 ls The occasional Z-71 Eater! Wedgewood & Denim, SuperChipped, Airaid FIPK, HD electrical and cooling, power seat, Rhino Liner, Extang Classic tonneau cover, Mobil 1. Man, I got it all! (New Jersey)

 

Simon G,

One of surely many andvantages of using synthetic is the temperature tolerance. Conventional oils run at hotter temperatures and eventually burns off. While premium synthetics run cooler. Which in turn helps slow down the wear on moving parts of the engine.

Anyway, no expert here. Just what I read somewhere. Which make a lot of sense.

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"Silver Steed"
'00 XL flareside sprcab, 5 spd, 4.2 V6, 3.55 grs, cab step-up bars ("nerf bars"), graphite cloth 60/40 split bench seats, 255/70/16s, K&N air filter.
More upgrades soon (pay-check permitting)
Email: ferdi_n@f150driver.com

 

Right on! Man! I've read this in a 4x4 mag. they replaced all oils with synth. and the truck ran smoother and saved a little on fuel. Don't forget that our F150s have synthetic oil in the diffs.

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Check out my site: cooltrucks.net

My email: webmaster@cooltrucks.net

Also:
nerdzfx.com
1997 F150 4x4 XLT with ORP 4.2L V6 and 5-speed manual.

 

The new Ford F-150 come with synthetic oil in the differental and Ford even has a tag on it saying to replace the oil with synthetic. My dad truck 97 F-150 4.6L with 50000 miles in cold weather would knock slightly during startup with Motorcraft 5W-30. We replaced the oil with Valvoline Synpower 5W-30 and the sound hasn't occured agian. I also run Synpower 5W-30 in my truck and firmly believe in synthetics.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I have heard that GM is working on using 20,000 mile drain intervals. Which would be totally opposite of what your neighbor.

Over 75% of European cars are run on synthetics. with drain intervals of between 10,000-15,000 miles.

My Y2K VW Jetta TDI comes from the factory with synthetic and is required by the warranty. Also VW does the oil changes for free for the first 2 years and the dealer must put a special version of Castol Syntec 5w40 in.

Synthetics are the way of the future, back in the 1960 bias ply tires were 90% of the market, it took until the 1970's for Radials to take over.

I would be willing to bet within the next 5 years synthetics will be leading over dino oil as far as heat protection, oxidation, drain intervals, fuel economy, cold temp performance etc...

I think that your neighbor need to really take a look at the data that is out and all of the tests that prove him wrong.


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Hey Guys I'm with you. I know for a fact that my own truck sounds/runs better with synthetic. I broke it in with reg. oil and in the winter there was a big difference in the way the engine sounds at start up.
I was just passing on the info I was given.

He is however convinced by this study and says that no engine that is well maintained and in good running condition could ever push a conventional oil to its limit, therefore synthetic is a waste.
But I still can't find any concrete proof to show him.

 

Go visit the amsoil website. There is a lot of information about extended drain intervals and other advantages of synthetics. With the amsoil you can leave it in for 1 year or 25K miles. I run it in all my vehicles. It is nice not having to change oil every 4th weekend or so. Plus you can feel the car/truck drives smoother and is quicker.

 

Simon,
Trust these guys. It makes a big difference. I owned a '91 Chevy Silverado 5.4L V8. After break in I started using MOBIL 1 and from the first use I could tell the difference. The engine ran more quiet and smoother and you can really tell on startup. I put 120,000 miles on it and to me the engine was just as strong then as when it was new. It's more expensive, 3-5 thousand miles between oil changes, but if you plan on keeping the truck for a while it is definitely worth it.

 

Does anyone know what synthetics oils are made from? Are they super-refined petroleum? What is the base substance used to make syns? Just curious.

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'99 F150 SC, 4x2, Oxford white, flareside, 5.4, 3.55 rearend,
bodyside mouldings, Snuglid hard tonneau, K&N dropin, airbox and frsh air mods.
Duraliner drop-in (gave up on the Penda Nascar). Gibson Supertruck. Ford 2-piece bra. Catch-All floor mats. Image tail light covers. B-Quiet sound dampener in rear of cab. **** pile rug protecing spare tire (Raoul made me enter this)
No door cracks yet at 13K!!!

 

There is absolutely no way your warranty can be voided for using a conventional oil as long as it meets or exceeds the API specification the manufacturer calls for. Unless the vehicle manufacturer provides the oil free of charge.

Having said that, I personally use Mobil 1 in my vehicles. I've got a '92 E-250 service van with 156K on it. It burned a half quart between oil changes when it was new and burns a half quart between changes now. And I have thrashed it pretty hard.

Everyone here is welcome to save all the money they can buying conventional oil. I'll run Mobil 1 until there's something better that is as easily available.

For me, if I have a van down for repairs it's costing me much more than the repair. It's relatively cheap insurance. Id rather pay a little at a time than alot at once.

Marv1,

I believe most if not all are paraffin based.

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98 F-150 XLT 4X4 ORP Super Cab Short Bed, 4.6, Auto. Magnacharger supercharger. Superchip, Gibson sing. cat-back, 80/100w German head lamps. Warn HS9500i winch with semi hidden mount. Wrangler dual battery kit with red & yellow top Optima batteries. Torsion bars cranked up 2 turns. Needs one more door.




[This message has been edited by 98fword (edited 07-21-2000).]

 

Marv 1,


Castol syntec is the only so called synthethic that is made from petro oil that is hydroprocessed to remove many of the bad contaminants. They "synthesize" the wax molecules to remove them and make the oil purer and have a better viscosity index, but in the end it is still petroleum oil.

Other synthetics are engineered from the molecule on up.

Polyalphaolefins (PAO)- made from ethylene (gas) reacted with metal catalyst(nickel, palladium).

Diesters - made from grain alcohol reacted with a fatty acid catalyst.

Polyol Esters - made by fatty acids reacted with polyhydric acids

Phosphate Esters - these are synthesized phosphorus oxychlorine and alcohol or phenols

Silicones - Organo Silozane polymers

So this shows you that true synthetics like Mobil 1 and Amsoil and Redline are not refined from regular petroleum oil and made super clean.
Mobil 1 "trisynthetic" is actually a blend of 3 of the above mentioned synthetics. Amsoil's oils are also a blend of synthetics to get the desired characterists.

Now the Castrol debate has gone on and on. And if they want to call themselves synthetic and that makes them feel better so be it. It is a superior oil to conventional group I and II basestocks but it is not synthetic in the way I described for the others

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