"Windsor" is the generic term that is used to describe all pushrod 302/351 engunes of recent vintage regardless of in which engine plant they were produced. "Romeo" is a similar tagline for the SOHC automobile 4.6 regardless of plant of origin.

The person who gave you this "info" was correct. The mods which produce added HP in one probably won't produce equivalent HP gains in the other. So what? Both engines can be built to pretty unreasonable limits, although that is MUCH cheaper and easier with the "Windsor," it ought to be with 35 years of development behind it.

There are some things about the "Romeo" and its close cousin the "Triton" that are outstanding and some things that were forced on engineering by the bean-counters. It is frankly going to need some work to ever be the equal of the Windsor for competition purposes, but for 99.99% of driving, it produces equivalent power in a smoother running, quieter package that will meet increasingly tighter emission control requirements.

 

Ah, I never even thought about someone using the generic Windsor term for the pushrods when comparing to today's engines. And, not that it doesn't happen, I've never heard the new engines called Romeos in general conversation. If that is the case, then there is most definitely a difference in HP given by the same mods.

Even if this is the intention of Tina's "someone", I'd like to know more about the differences between the Romeo, MI and Windsor Ontario, Canada built engines. Aren't these the only two plants that build the 4.6L Triton engines?

Neal

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1997 4x4 Expedition- 4.6L, true dual exhaust w/glass-packs, K&N air filter, SuperChip, airbox mods, Edelbrock shocks, 285/75R16 BFG ATs, Optima "T-Bone" wheels, and Clarion In-dash CD player: http://members.visualcities.com/NoMo

 

I got this info from another message board:
Starting late 95 Ford used 2 different versions of 4.6 mod motors. First the Romeo, in cars & trucks starting in late 90, first made w/an AOD bellhousing pattern, changed in early to mid 91 w/the AODE style bellhousing pattern. All 91 & 92's had smoking problems due to the valve stem seal design. Redesigned for 93, still not right, at about 100k smoke. Redone again for 94, still not right. Then 95's w/different heads, still a Romeo block. Better but will still consume oil w/high miles.
Late 95 early 96 & starting production of the new 97 F series, still using Romeo motors, mainly in trucks. The passenger cars starting to use Windsor motor in 96.
Differences: where R=Romeo & W=Windsor
R=has jackscrew centering screws for main caps, 1 piece thrust bearing (top & bottom),11 bolts on the right valve cover, slower, tends to have detonation problems, more a cause of the oil use, 2 bridged cam caps w/a head reservoir for oil
W=has dowels for centering the main caps & a 3 piece thrust bearing, 14 bolts on the same valve cover, uses individual caps and no oil reservoir, larger main caps and bearings & larger rods w/full floating pins and different pistons (less friction)

Theres a lot of differences in how the cam sprockets mount to the cams. Water pumps look the same but don't interchange. The windsor should have a W embossed on the cam cover near the sprockets.

It went on to say that if you wanted more info to read the Factory Ford manuals by Helm.

 

I think my 97' Might have been a windsor 4.6 because my 99' Romeo is noticeably louder!

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1999 Ford F150 XLT Supercab, Shortbed, 4x2, 4 wheel disc brakes/4 wheel Anti-Lock Brakes, Cloth Seats, Amazon green, 16" All season tires, Soft Tonneau Cover, CD Player, 4.6 liter Triton V8, 3:55 ls, towing package, 4 speed auto, K&N Airfilter
Future Mods:
1)Superchip
2)Airbox Mod
3)Flowmaster Exhaust

Estimated Quarter Mile Time by the use of a calculator and websites:
ET: 16.7 Trap Speed: 83-84mph

Fast46Triton

The Terminator!

 

I have a hard time believing that Ford would launch a totally redesigned new F-series truck with an engine they know has problems. My.02

 

My '97 F-150 4.6 manufactured in 6/97 has the Windsor power plant in it. It actually has a sticker on the side of the left valve cover that says Windsor on it. Truck was made at the Norfolk plant.

 

I too have a Windsor with a born on date of 5/96. Yet I notice others of you have Romeo's that you bought in 99??? You would think that if the Windsor is the improved engine of the two, that Ford would stop putting the Romeo in it's new trucks??? It really doesn't make sense.

 

There are two plants that build the truck engines, Romeo (W in VIN) and Windsor (6 in VIN). All 5.4L and 6.8L engines are built at Windsor. The truck 4.6Ls are built in both locations. All car 4.6L are built at REP.

Anyway, we have two engine plants in order to build enough engines. When you need over a million engines a year, you can't get that out of one plant! So, some trucks have Romeo engines and some have Windsor.

 

I agree with you Tim, two plants for demand. We somtimes get so wrapped around the axle (excuse the pun) about these mods, that we forget the bottom line.

• Does it start everytime we want it to
• and does it get us dependably and safely from A to B.

I have to throw in with good looks also.

 

Interesting thread topic!

Re: VINS and valve cover stickers, my offering is as follows:

I just poked my head under the hood of my rig...the engine is a Windsor, the truck was assembled in Kansas City. The sticker on the driver's side valve cover is square and has "Windsor, Ontario, Canada" stamped on it plain as day. The eighth digit in my VIN is a "6." The truck was manufactured in 9/97 but is a '98.

Now, if the discussion here is if a SOHC engine will respond differently to mods than a pushrod, my hunch would be to respond, "Sure!"
But if the discussion is if an essentially similar engine made in Romeo, Mo. responds to mods differently than the Windsor, Ontario plant, that would be interesting to know (especially now that I know I have a Windsor, and have an Airaid FIPK on the way from the Online Store). : ) (how do you get the message icon smileys to appear in the text?)

And it's already been asked, but which one responds more favorably?

I do appreciate the vast amount of discussion, information, and knowledge by the members here. I'm beginning to make performance mods to my rig, and what I read on F-150 Online helps me to make more informed decisions than the good ol' trial and error method (which all too often leans toward the "error" side!).

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Cam

'98 F-150 SC XLT, 4.6L, Bright Red, Red Spray-in Liner, Extang Soft Tonneau, Ford Bug Guard, K&N filter, contemplating Airaid/Superchip

"The Red Neck Snapper"

 

Hey Tim, where and what is REP? I have a sticker on each valve cover that has that on them.

[This message has been edited by riclaur (edited 07-22-1999).]

 

Tim- Getting a double dose of this??

I do find it very strange that the Expedition gets 20 more HP than the F150. Either Ford is fudging the HP of the X, one of the engine plants is building more powerful engines than the other, or Ford has two different engine plants turning out two different 4.6L truck engines. Throw in the Mustang engine, and thats 3 different versions of the SOHC 4.6L engine. IF the blocks are different between the two plants, then that's 5 different heads to machine, inventory, and install. Now, consider the vehicles have a different LEV status and you've got even more parts to build & track.

Can anyone tell us what really happens?

Neal

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1997 4x4 Expedition- 4.6L, true dual exhaust w/glass-packs, K&N air filter, SuperChip, airbox mods, Edelbrock shocks, 285/75R16 BFG ATs, Optima "T-Bone" wheels, and Clarion In-dash CD player: http://members.visualcities.com/NoMo

 

riclaur:
As Tim pointed out to me on the Expedition mailing list, REP= Romeo (Michigan) Engine Plant.

Crazy C:
Take the space out from between the : and the ).

Neal

[This message has been edited by nomo (edited 07-22-1999).]

 

nomo, makes sense to me. Thanks.

 

My 99 has a Romeo and my 98 had a Windsor. I think that the Romeo engine is smoother than the Windsor. It is a night and day difference or it may just be an improvement in the 99's.

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'99 XLT S/C 4.6 Auto 3.55 LS Oxford White,Orlando appearance package, trailer tow package, keyless entry, A.R.E. Hard tonneau, ventvisors and bug guard all painted to match, limo tint, 5 spoke aluminum wheels, Kenwood 6 Disc, black Back Country nerfs, Buccaneers front license plate! I Luv it!