The cam will have to come out to get the lash adjusters out, they will not clear....

 

Great. Thanks for the info. I would have surely found out the hard way after fighting with it for an hour.

Quick Rant: I hate these damn engines. All of the special tools and tight places. I have a renewed respect for the guys and gals that work on cars for a living. Being a gearhead, it has always seemed like a fun job; however, I am sure it can be frustrating at times.

 

Can I read the oil pressure with a scan tool? What should I expect hot/cold? No indication of a oil fault with the idiot gauges.

 

No you can't.

Behind the oil filter is the sending unit for the gauge, we take those out to read base engine pressure with a gauge.

75psi @2000 rpm normal operating temp..minimum 30 psi hot idle.

Good base engine pressure doesn't mean there is not a restriction to the head either. The idiot gauges aren't always the best indication for the same reason, you can have good oil pressure down at the switch but not have any oil going to the heads and it would not register. No way to get a reading off the head either unless someone else knows the trick???

It's just something to keep in mind, not trying to freak you out, I'd hate to see you guys go through all the hard work of putting it back together just to have it happen again. There is usually a reason cam lobes wipe out.

Do you know the history of the vehicle, anybody else have it apart for other work?

 

On 2V engines I "think" there's a plug on the back of the head that lets you at least check for the presense of oil if not pressure to the heads. Not sure if its the same on 3V or if you could even get to it if it's there. When I worked at a dealer the engine guys saw quite a few mod motors with oil supply restricted to the heads. If they got torn down there was usually material from cheap oil filters blocking the oil passages, pretty small passages in there from what i understand.

 

honestly i never use the spring compressor... just loosen and tighten the cam evenly it only lifts a few mms. also if the cam is scored how does your head and caps look? usaully the whole head is replaced...

 

The vehicle is my fathers. He bought it new and its never been to the shop. Third brake light and drivers side window regulator are the only issues the truck has ever had. He does all his own maintenance. The oil has at least 1300 miles on it now and its still honey colored. He uses a 5w20 as well mostly motorcraft, but other times different oil.

You have not freaked me out. All good points to note. They will let me be aware of what I need to look for. Its on hold until saturday. I'm going to source a lifter and rocker locally and put it back together. It will either hold or blow until a new camshaft comes in. If the oil is restricted, I have no idea what he will do with the truck or the engine.

 

hllon4whls I did not recieve the PM. Send another. Usually the reason a cam lobe gets damaged is from a defective follower. Sometimes a bearing in the follower just goes south. The follower starts moving around instead of staying in a controlled alinement with the cam lobe and the lash adjuster. This causes excessive and rapid cam lobe deterioration. If the cyl head cam bearing surfaces are starting to show wiping and or discoloration from loss of lube then you have a lubrication/ pressure or contamination issue. As I understand it is one cam lobe that is severely worn. This means you will have to replace at least the one follower and possibly the lash adjuster that caused the damage. I don't think from what I am reading that you have a oil pressure issue with this condition. I personally would not run the engine until you replace the cam. The cam lobe damage can allow the follower to start bouncing and very well may bend your valve stem. Then you are talking about removing the cyl head and possibly the piston if contact is made with the valve.

 

Dynotech, being as that head is fed from the back on that side (passenger) would it not be possible for the lash adjuster to lose its "pump" from poor oiling and cause the rocker to do just as you described? We replaced a 5.4 for this very reason, came in with a tick, last rocker at the rear had tore into the cam, head got replaced ( warranty)...tick still there...come to find out their was a rod bearing going south that got missed during the initial diag causing poor oiling to the head...the cam bearings were not that bad off suprisingly, just some minor scoring...the tech working on it jumped the gun and didn't check the oil pressure when it first came in.......

I'm not trying to disagree with your analysis, that's a pretty solid explanation..... I'm asking for my own knowledge

 

I recieved the valve spring tool today, so I have options on chaning the cam if it ever gets ordered.

I'm stoked about the great feedback and suggestions that have been flowing in. It seems that not that many people dig into these newer motors to repair stuff. None of the local parts depots have said anything intelligent about the tools or the parts. I dont know any Ford Mechanics in real life and all of the racing guys I deal with typically deal with carb'ed pushrod motors.

When we have the cam off to get the lifter out, I'll make certain to inspect all of the journals for signs of oil starvation.

I understand that its not ideal to run the truck with a bad camshaft. My dad is already borrowing a truck for the last week (mine) and he doesnt want to go 4 weeks or even another week in a borrowed vehcile. If its quiet, he is going to drive it. If it doesnt sound right, he wont. Money is what is driving this whole path that we are taking, so he cant afford to ruin a truck with 1 year left to pay on it.

 

FORDTECH1, Always good to listen to someone that is trying to diagnois these issues. By the way it is refreshing to read your posts, good to know there are guys like you with a lot of knowledge and dedication to solving customers engine problems. To answer your question. It is possible that low oil pressure can collapse the lash adjusters but I have seen many rod beaing failures that ran for thousands of miles and never caused a upper end/valve train problem. I have seen contamination such as a aluminum chip from the machining process get stuck in a lash adjuster feed hole and starve that particular lash adjuster. I would have to say that most times I have found a single damaged cam lobe has been from a defective lash adjuster. Sometimes a bearing is left out during assembly of the lash adjuster roller creating a flat spot in the follower roller during rotation where it momentarily hangs up on rotation. It is surprisingly hard to detect this even when examining the lash adjuster. I have witnessed some pretty severe oil starvation problems from abuse and you are correct. The cam bearing surfaces can survive amazingly well. The aluminum bearing surface actually looks like a sponge when viewed with a microscope so the small imperfections tend to hold more oil than one would think. Once they start wiping aluminum though it will cause a cam bearing failure. On these heads the cams are actually being forced upward from the valve spring pressure the only cam bearing surface with downward pressure is the front one and the timing chain tends to generate a downward force on that bearing. Usually with poor lubrication that front bearing will show more damage because of this condition. In severe cases of lack of lube the cams will actually start welding themselves to the cyl head cam bearing towers. The wiped aluminum will actually fill in the oil supply hole and completely starve the cam bearing area.This condition will usually result with a broken timing chain as the friction being generated will slow the cam down and the crank will continue to overpower the cam breaking the chain. I don't disagree with you at all as I have learned not to discount anything when it comes to engine failures. There is alot going on while an engine is operating and there are many many variables that can generate a failure. Keep up the good work with your insight of this engine. You have the right idea in terms of this engines operation and failure modes. Take care.

 

@Dynotech...Thanks dude for taking the time to go into detail......thats some really usefull info there....I do most of the engine repairs in the shop, so getting to the root cause of a failure is extremely important as you know...

@hllon4whls.... Good luck on your repair, you sound like you have a good handle on what to do.....what about a mild aftermarket set of cams

 

Thanks and too pricey for dad. $750 for the set. The truck is apart and back together with the exception of the covers, gaskets and wiring.

I cant tell if the lifter is bad or not. The journals are fine. The rocker arm beat to death. The roller bearing is seized and the the roller is full of flat spots, heat marks and other damage. The roller wheel was pushed into the rocker arm and the cam actually began to cut into the rocker arm. Looks like the rocker took the majority of the damage. I cant tell if the lash adjuster is bad or not. It has been replaced.

I'll post some pictures of the rocker asap. I need to get back out there and get the covers on.

 

It runs. Its quiet and it runs smooth. He is going to decide to change the cam or not. I'm sure he will eventually, but this will buy him some time.

Dad's still complaining about the work involved, but I think its not too bad especially if two people are doing it together.

One last thing, that truck ate my 8mm deep socket and a 2.5 inch extension. I heard it hit plastic and we cant find the stupid thing. Looked on top, looked on bottom. Used a flashlight, magnet and a rain dance. Cant find it.

 

One quick note regarding the lost socket and extension. If these parts are under the intake manifold laying in the engine block valley. They can rattle around under there and send a false signal to the spark knock sensor. It can cause a drivability issue if the processor is getting a signal that the engine is detonating. So if the truck starts running bad..... Just a heads up on this as it may or may not be an issue for you. Also I would bet money that the follower was the primary failure mode causing excessive damage and wear to your cam. Take care.