Thanks Dave. I will make note of your caster settings. I have had 3 or 4 alignments so far. One of the alignments was based of the specific settings of a race car tuner. It helped some but was based on having the max. caster or camber. I can not remember which one is which. But, the inside tread on my tires started wearing unevenly(the top of my tires were heading inward and the bottom of my tires were heading outward.

The last time I had it aligned, the techs said that alignment was wrong. They said I needed the tires flat on the surrface, but that I needed the max caster or camber....it is the setting that is also very high on Mercedes Benz autos. There alignment has been the best so far. However, it still wanders some and there is no "on-center feel" such as in my father's 99 f150 with only 25,000 miles

 

Here are some brief explanations of caster.

http://www.stockcarproducts.com/align11a.htm

http://www.hitmanalignment.com/explanation/caster.html

As you can see, it is much different than camber (tops of the tires closer to each other than the bottom of the tires) and toe in (front of the tires closer together than the rear of the tires). All have thier imacts, but if you want more straight line stability then you want more positive caster.

Good luck getting your truck working how you want it to!

 

Well this conversation got me motivated to do some more wrenching. Last night I rotated my tires and while I had them off I played around with my camber adjuster, knowing that dirt bike dave is pointing us in the right direction.

Truck feels great today...no wandering on the freeway this morning. I took Dave's advice and the truck feels completely different. So my vote is to take some time with it, look at it and if you are confident that your are up for it, mess with it a little bit.

But like adjustments with my motorcycle, one thing at a time. Too many things changed at once and you don't know what to do next. Sounds goofy, but you get a lot of idea what these adjustments are about when you build and/or race R/C cars!

JT

 

WHEEL ALIGNMENT INFO. go to www.familycar.com/alignment.htm , will explain your problem and corrective action, good luck

 

Last weekend, I replaced both outer tierods and center link with new greaseable Moog parts . I also replaced the pitman arm, steering gear box, coupler, and lower halfshaft assembly with an 03' f150 version with less than 5,000 miles from a salvage yard. It took me about 5 hours to do it myself (yeah I goofed off). I had recently had the idler arm and inner tie rods replaced by a shop.

I used a generic two arm puller for the outer tierod to spindle connection. But, you have to use a tie rod puller or fork to remove the tie rods from the center link. I got a tie rod puller from a local auto parts chain and it worked perfectly. I did not use the fork puller since I did not want to damage the boots on the new inner tierods.

My original outer tierods seemed too tight when I moved tto do it myself (yeah I goofed off). I had recently had the idler arm and inner tie rods replaced by a shop.

I no longer have a popping sound when I turn sharply in parking lots. My steering is more sensitive. Now, I can turn the steering wheel while looking at my front driver tire and see that, the tire moves even with the smallest movement of the steering wheel. However, my steering wheel had low tension, so I marked the original steering gear adjuster bolt setting and then turned it clockwise 1/8th of a turn, then another for a full 1/4 turn.

Although, my steering is very sensitive, it feels like I have lost the postive caster that was put in by the last alignment. My steering wheel does not want to return to center as well as it did after my last alignment and it still does not feel centered. After my last alignment, my steering wheel would also not lock. I would have to turn my steering wheel a full half a turn before it would lock. I was going to have that fixed with my next alignment after I finish installing parts. ..............although, I HAVE NOT HAD IT RE-ALIGNED YET, SINCE INSTALLING THE PARTS.


Ole Man's link was very helpful. Thank you.

Now, I can say with certainty that, .........Two alignments ago, I had an alignment with negitive camber. It helped until the inside of my tiince I did not want to damage the boots on the new inner tierods.

I had the wandering problem since the time I bought the truck with 40,000 miles. Some things have helped and some have not.
Now, what eles do I change before having the alignment performed Here are some choices, which one will help with straight line drivablity and reduce wandering?

1. Shocks - I installed toxic shocks after lowering it a year ago. During a compress test, they were much harder to compress than new oem f150 shocks and used Bilstien shocks, so I left them on. However, I hit even small bumps very hard and I bottom out on larger bumps with only a 3 inch lowering in the rear. Should I get some edlebrock IAS or QA1 or KYB lowering shocks?

2. Coil Springs - I tried lowering front coil springs but they had a spring rate like stock, so I cut some stock coil springs to increase spring rate and lowering. It worked great. However, I now notice that my front end bounces too much in cross winds or any bumps. Should I go back to a Bell tech or Eibach type lowering spring?

3. Stock upper and lower control arms - can get Moog stock uppers and lowers with ball joints and rubber bushings. Cheaper than lowering control arms, but will have bump steer and no urethane bushings.

4. DJM upper and lower control arms witings but they had a spring rate like stock, so I cut some stock coil springs to increase spring rate and lowering. It worked great. However, I now notice that my front end bounces too much in cross winds or any bumps. Should I go back to a Bell tech or Eibach type lowering spring?

5. wheel bearings - wheels do not seem to have any play when you pull on them but who knows.

6. Tires - My tires have severe inner tread wear and cupping from my past "custom alignments". However, I can get another 20,000 miles out of them.

7. Steering Pump - I noticed that I appear to have a small leak coming from my pump somewhere.

8. Rear leaf springs - I think they are worn. I had to change from a 4 inch rear lowering to a 3 inch lowering to keep the rear from bottoming out too much.

Which thing would you change before getting the alignment? Thanks for any input.

 

Bought some 03' stock upper and lower control arms, with 5,000 or less miles..... very cheap. Looks brand new. Ball joints and control arm bushings look new. I am going to install them before my alignment.

The energy suspension, hyperflex, polyurethane control arm bushings are $95 bucks AND I will have to pay someone to install the bushings. YOu have to re-use the oem metal portions of the bushings ....... since I am going to install them and intend to keep the truck, I think I am going to order the urethane bushings.

I think I am also going to change the wheel bearings as well, before my alignment.

Was going to change my very stiff cut coil springs for some eibach or belltech type 3 inch lowering springs. HOwever, I read that, as well as the urethane bushings, stiffer springs should help my need for caster.

Still need to decide on which shocks.

 

Update:

Bought the Energy Suspension poly-urethane control arm bushings (you want to make sure you get the BLACK bushings-they have graphite in them for less squeaking), Doetsch Tech Nitro Slammer lowering shocks and a set of Spring Tech 3" lowering front coils. Waiting for coils to arrive this week.

I have removed the rubber bushings from the 03' salvage yard upper control arms. After removing the washers (twisted off with large plyers and small pipe wrench), I used a cheap little $15 torch to burn/melt the rubber some and break the seal (need to do this outside or your garage will fill up with toxic black smoke!). Then, I used a two arm puller to press the inner sleeve out (hooked arms on control arm rim, NOT the outter shell!!!), then I put a sparkplug gap tool (metal disk) over the rubber bushing and used the puller to press the rubber bushing out. I left the outter shell alone (important to not heat up the outter shell too much). Still need to remove the rubber bushing out of the lower control arms. Then I will install the urethane bushings.

Although, I am going to finish the urethane bushing install and wait on the arrival of the coils, before I install the newer control arms, new shocks and new coil springs in the front end, I did install the rear Doetsch Tech shocks. Great shocks!!!!!!!!!!!!
In a comparison, the cheapo toxic shocks had a higher compression rate and had a larger piston rod than the Doetsch techs. However, with the rear Doetsch techs, I NO LONGER BOTTOM OUT AT ALL!!!!!!!!!!! The shock is smooth yet firm. I have a smoother ride, yet I do not slam hard into bumps. Can't wait to install the front shocks!

 

Update:

A. INSTALLED Engergy Suspension control arm bushings in a set of 03' salvage yard, upper and lower control arms with ball joints, with 5,000 or less miles of use.

Tip:

Leave the bushing outter shell ALONE. Only remove/replace the inner sleeves and then the rubber bushings.

If your local auto store has a "Loan-a-Tool" program, get the balljoint/bushing removal tool. It looks like a huge C clamp. You WILL need it on the lower control arm bushings. I used a combo of a $15 torch, the removal tool, screw driver, and plyers, to get the bushings out. DO NOT BREATH THE BURNT RUBBER FUMES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you have the $150 to $250 to have someone eles replace the bushings, pay it. Or continue to save for aftermarket control arms that already have poly-urethane bushings.

B. INSTALLED upper and lower control arms.

Tip:

Mark existing position of both upper "cam" bolt washers and the lower driver's side rear cam bolt washer.

Use a floor jack to press the lower control arms into position.

C. INSTALLED new Spring Tech 3" lowering springs.

D. INSTALLED new Doestch Nitro Slammer 3" lowering front shocks.


Comments:

I am going to take "Dirt Bike Dave's" alignment specs with me tomorrow and have an alignment. However, I have driven about 70 miles with the new parts.

I think I found the root or primary problem for my steering woes for the last two years! ........it appears to be at least the....... STOCK LOWER CONTROL ARM BUSHINGS. I had a HUGE GAP between the bushing and the inner walls of the connecting bracket. The gaps were so wide that, I think the factory used the wrong rubber bushings on my truck. The salvage yard control arms with new urethane bushings, actually had to be pressed in to place with a floor jack. The Energy Suspension urethane lower control arm bushings are much longer and thicker than the stock rubber versions. Truck steers "faster", turns corners sharper, and NO WANDERING!!!!!!!!!!!!

My truck suspension, now feels more stable and solid on the road with no bouncing. The shocks are firm yet smooth. Cornering is not as good as with the cutt coils (but close), but the straight line driving is FAR better. I will buy these shocks again. The springs gave me the same lowering or maybe a 1/16 MORE of a drop (springs came in red, but my truck is blue, so I soaked them in gas and removed the fresh red paint to expose a nice blue finish).

This is how a truck should steer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The new bushings ELIMINATED ALL steering wandering!!!!!!!!!!!! The truck steers exactly where I point it. Can't wait to see the results after the alignment!

 

Good job Iron-horse. My ES upper/lower poly bushings are in my garage awaiting installation. I installed the rear bushings about 1 month ago. Didn't help.

 

Thanks. I was suppose to get an alignment last weekend, but I will not have one performed until next weekend.

You installed REAR bushings? Do you mean the leaf spring hanger and shackle bolt holes???????????

 

Energy Suspension bushing set part # 4.2150. Includes front and rear spring eye bushings as well as the shackle bushing.
This set also includes new inner sleeves so you don't need to reuse the factory ones. Pretty easy install overall.
I do think they helped firm up the rear suspension a little. But they did not solve the wandering problem.
So after a few more miles do you still think the front bushings were the problem?

Thanks

 

Of the multitude of mods I have done to make this truck steer and handle better over the past two years, I now can state the following list of mods., starting with what improved the steering the most, to less improvement:

1. Replacing front lower control arm oem bushings with poly-urethane bushings.........best thing I have done yet!

2. Replacing front upper control arm oem bushings with poly-urethane bushings.

3. Maximum allowable caster and toe-in alignment.

4. New idler arm, inner and outter tie rod ends, center link, salvaged 03' steering gear box/pitman arm/coupler/ steering half shaft combo and salvaged 03' upper and lower control arms with ball joints with 5,000 miles or less of use.

A. front inner and outter wheel bearings.

5. Rear swaybar.

6. Matched front coil springs with front and rear shocks.

A. Cutt stock coils was the best for cornering and was the best for cross winds, until shock rebound stopped working well.

7. Larger diameter front sway bar.

A. short Helper leaf springs.

8. Lowering truck.

A. Inflated 44 psi cold max. tires from 35 psi cold to 40 psi cold

9. Lower profile tires (and or higher load rated)

A. Replaced Power steering pump and hydraulic hose.

10. Hard bed cover.

I am going to wait until my new Toyo Proxes S/T, V speed rated, 111 load rated, 275/60/17s arrive (I got them CHEAPER than my current, unevenly worn and cupped 265/60/17 Kumhos). Then, I am going to have a final alignment performed.

Would like to do the leaf spring bushing mod and eventually get a 03' or newer Lightning steering gear box, as well

 

Thanks Iron horse. I need to hear that considering the PITA factor ahead of me.

 

Update:

Last Saturday, I took my truck to the best alignment/frame shop in my state. They specialize in highperformance and exotic vehicles. Many of the vehicles they have worked on have been in the major truck/auto magazines.

I had my uneven worn, cupped, feathered 265/60/17 tires removed, and had new Toyo Proxes S/T 275/60/17s mounted and balanced. I also had an alignment.

Although they did an alignment based on measurements from all four tires and other measurement, I will comment on the front only.

Left Front:

Camber Spec. Range -1 to 3/8
Actual Camber -7/16

Caster Spec. Range 5 3/16 to 7 3/16
Actual Caster 8 3/4

Toe Spec. Range -1/16 to 1/16
Actual Toe 1/16

Right Front:

Camber Spec. Range -1 to 3/8
Actual Camber -1/2

Caster Spec. Range 5 11/16 to 7 11/16
Actual Caster 9 1/16

Toe Spec. Range -1/16 to 1/16
Actual Toe 1/16

They told me that for reduced wandering and better straight line tracking, you want a high caster and max. toe in alignment. They said they can put higher than spec. caster with lowered vehicles, since the lowering facilitates caster. They also said they could have put a little more caster, but I would end up with some negative camber. The negative camber would also help, but you get into problems of uneven tire wear. I wanted the Max high caster and toe in alignment without any uneven tire wear.

Drives great! The wind, bumps and road crown still affect steering, but I can "feel" it in the steering wheel now and easily "hold" the steering wheel firmer to keep it tracking straight as opposed to, constantly correcting and moving the steering wheel to keep it straight. However, the truck now drives wear you point it. The wandering is gone. Infact, I am having to re-train myself to drive it. I no longer have to concentrate when steering. I actually enjoy steering the truck now.....even in high winds.

I can also say this, the Toyo Proxes are quieter than the Kumhos and provide a much smoother ride. Only down side I see is, the Toyo sidewalls are "mushy" (guess thats how I am getting a smoother ride) .

The shop also commented that, the poly urathene bushings will be good for about a year, then they will begin to squeak loudly and or crack and split. I told them I got the black poly urathene bushings with graphite. They said that was a very good thing to do. They thought I meant the red urathane bushings. They said the bushings are good for straight line drag racing but deteriorate faster with daily driving. All I know is, the control arm bushings made the biggest improvement in my steering wandering.

Also found out that my frame was "off" by 1/4 of an inch! However, they said, this is within specs! They told me that, even brand new, a truck frame rarely comes from the factory 100% straight.

.......might get a little more toe in. Not sure yet.

 

Thanks Iron horse. I replaced my control arm bushings a week ago and I agree with you. Best overall improvement in steering yet. I think I'll have my alignment shop toe it in a little since they had set it at 0.