You don't know me from the man in the moon, but I figure if we share an idea about trucks or car audio, maybe we can give each other a little education. I realize the average car audio nut is under the age of 20, and while I'm waaaaay above that, I'd like to raise the level of gentlemanly discourse in these forums.

Maybe I'm just a grumpy old fart, but I get really tired of seeing somebody say "this brand sucks" or "that brand isn't worth the money". In fact, many of these brands have a number of accomplishments, including:

• They are, in fact, decent sounding speakers or subwoofers
• Many, many people have purchased them and gotten a great deal of enjoyment out of their use
• They are very popular, especially because at a certain price point, they sound better than other available products
• Perhaps the company that builds them is part of what brought the industry to the point where it is today

While you may have a valid point that XYZ brand sounds a lot better (to you), not everyone will hear that difference. Maybe you had a pair of those speakers and they DID suck, but maybe it was just that pair; when they roll 10,000 speakers out in a production run, there are going to be a few turds among the flowers. Maybe you do know more than anyone else in the world about oscillation, fibrillation, and sound reproduction~~that doesn't mean you know it all.

My point here, and it may be a waste of breath, is that it really does no good to come on a public forum and talk trash about a brand or specific model. It's a sign of immaturity or insecurity, in my eyes: "What I have is soooo much better than you, it elevates me to God-like status".

In reality, I think Grandpa said it best when he said "You can't stand tall by stepping on somebody else's toes". You make yourself look bad when you only talk about how good yours is and how bad everybody else's is.

Okay-flame suit on. Tell me how wrong I am.

 

Stock Rocks !

Aftermarket Sucks !

 

I must say, I agree with you on this. As a business owner myself, I hate when a salesman comes in to try and sell me his product and can not do it without bashing someone else's. Sell me your product based on how good your product is, not how bad the other guys product is. In audio, it is all about what sounds good to YOU. YOU are the one who is spending the money and will have to live with the sound. We can offer suggestions on products we have used but brand bashing does get a little old. I am not even close to an expert but, I have been installing my own equipment for over 20 years so, I have seen a thing or two. But, in the big picture, I really know next to nothing and there are always things to learn.

 

Hey you Grumpy old Fart,

this thread sucks mine was better.

I agree with you to a point, I do think that some of us get slightly obnoxious at times when relating an experience with a product. If I have used something or have had contact with someone else and a product I don't think it is wrong to point out if it was a great, decent, or just plain sucky product. Of course it all depends on the way it is expressed.

We all listen to different types of music, so while my hammering and banging music may sound like sh*t on a particular brand, your Boxcar Willie and Englebert Humperdink may sound perfectly fine on them to your ear.

Sorry about the Boxcar and Englebert thing but I figured since you are an old fart you aren't listening to Danzig.

A few good points in your post, but I doubt we will listen.

dave

 

I'll hold him, you kick him, then we'll both run like hell.

GO FU
(Grumpy Old Farts United)

 

Why aren't you exporting us some cigars or something?

How is Cuba today anyhow, it is hotter than everystuff here.

 

I agree with you to a certain extent. But, being 40 years old myself and installing and messing with car audio since I was 15 (when I got my first car)...I've seen ALOT of car audio. I'm secure and confident enough to say if (in my opinion) something sucks. For example:

I will tell you a Ford Pinto sucks compared to a Ford F150. (not car audio, but you get the point.)

If I say a particular product sucks…I don't say it to belittle the person or his/her equipment used…it’s just my experience with that product.

Granted, if someone is just saying that to jump on the bandwagon...then yes...that person has no room to talk. You should experience the product before you comment.

On the other hand...I think it’s ridiculous when someone gives valid advice or feels strongly about a proven product (in the car audio scene) and then has someone make comments about that product when in reality that person probably has no clue as well. There are ALOT of guys on here with a wealth of knowledge and have had certain products that have had proven results regardless of the product price. Some companies still believe in R&D and not just flash or mass producing to flood the market then have to blow out the product at cheap prices just to make back some of their money lost. These types of products are known to cause failure and are known by the people in the car audio scene to suck. They use cheap inexpensive parts for their products.

I don’t claim to be any type of expert, I don’t compete…never had and never will, but I think I can say when a product sucks if I have used it and can collaborate that experience with other peoples bad experiences.

All in All, I believe if you have had no experience with a product...then your Grandpa is right. But, if you have had experience (and not just once) with certain product(s)...then I see nothing wrong with voicing your opinion. But on that note…my Grandpa once said…”Opinions are like a$$holes, everyone has one”.

 

The following is directed to no one in particular, but is a continuance of the rant I started when I started this tthread:

Of course, I left out the possibility that someone is a snob and thinks their opinion is the gospel and no one else's opinion matters. The problem with just saying flat out that a certain piece sucks is that it does nothing positive to advance the conversation. You have given the person asking a question no guidance or assistance, just let them know who and what you are.

So WTF, go ahead and make yourself look like an immature jerk and put down everyhting that isn't perfect and golden in your less than humble opinion. Everyone on the board will see it for what it is, and you can have your fame and fortune (in your world, at least).

BTW, Raul, I ain't running from nobody. Old age and treachery will overcome youth and enthusiasm every time. (But I do like the GO FU idea!)

 

wow, I see anger in this post lol.

I do definitely agree though that people will scream praise or hate for products for which they have little to NO experience with. I am only 22 years old, but I have personally done over 8 complete custom installs (I'm talking installs ranging from a full day job to 3 weeks) in my own vehicles and friends, not to mention many various fixes and desk installs/sub installs etc.

The first 2 installs I was basically an apprentice to a guy that is in his 40s, used to work at La Jolla Audio (Basically, the most renowned shop in San Diego), and literally has patents and articles to his name. He also used to teach college level courses on the subject, and also has MANY certifications and has taken various college courses on applicable subjects.

He knows the science behind it all, and applies that to his installations. I Learned a LOT of the information that people often are minsinformed through word of mouth and advertisement. I learned a LOT from him about car audio...

That said, I have experienced many brands and setups with such said brands, and yet I still rarely share my thoughts on whether or not a brand is good or not.

Why? Because one of the things he taught me was that A.) People have very different hearing ranges and capabilities, and B.) Preference is a huge factor...audio/fidelity is subjective.

So I will share my thoughts on the products I have a lot experience with from time to time (mainly Polk and JL, but also Infinity, HiFonics, MB Quart, Sony, and Kenwood to name a few) but only if I feel confident that there is a strong misconception or bad information regarding those products in the post.

Otherwise, I don't even bother...

 

Regardless if it's not directed towards any one person or not...I think that's going a bit far calling someone a snob, immature and basically trying to make an *** out them (and their opinion) in a public forum for merely stating what they feel strongly about. But, it is your rant and opinion.

I wouldn't go that far myself...I would just agree to disagree. I don't get offended when someone says that a product "sucks". In my line of work, I hear worse and had worse directed towards me...in this country and other countries. Maybe I just have thicker skin than most...I don't know.

But in my opinion (and we all know what my Grandpa said about those), it kinda seems like you are doing exactly what you are ranting about...just on the other side of the spectrum.

I'm glad you are able to rant about your feelings though. It's good to get things off your chest.

 

Don't ya just love open discussion, between a bunch of people with such open minds.

 

Actually, I had Danzig on just last Saturday-from an old mix cd that I found when cleaning out the back of the shop!

And there's no hate, just an opinion...and Brypink already quoted Grandpa on that!

 

This same thing goes on on some of the other forums i go to.

I just read most of it and laugh, that is one of the great things about this type of setup.

Read what is in front of you, take it to heart or laugh like hell, sometimes you gotta stir the pot.

There is a lot of great opinions here and other places, and it is fantastic to be able to be a part of it all, considering I live out in the sticks, right down the road from the middle of nowhere.

If everyone had the same opinion, well that would just plain suck, worse than any speaker or tuner or exhaust. Opposing views are what keeps the froums going at times and helps to keep things interesting.

As for opinions, I'll listen to yours, but in the end mine is the only one that counts, at least to me.

OnBelay what else was on the CD?

 

The above post was maid cause i don't Raoul and the G O F U dudes kicking my a**


Just a thought maybe turn it into the

Grumpy Old Farts Offensive

would be GO FO

for Go F Off

Great now hopefully I can quit looking over my shoulder.

 

What you offer is mature advice, but remember maturity is gained from experience, not likely a internet forum chat. Also, if your audience is 16-22year olds, do you expect them to change overnight?

I bought a CD deck at a discount sale when I was 16, -I think they were still making black and white TV's. This deck was a common ground, and the eject button released a big spring that SHOT the cd into your lap! that was CRAP CRAP CRAP CRAP ah ah ha ha ha CRAP CRAP CRAP.. oooh it feels so good.. I'm so naughty, CRAP CRAP CRAP!