Who will conservatives choose?
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 691
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From: Gulf Coast
The only way that Iran could possibly attack the US with a nuclear weapon would be getting it across the border and detonating it, but if Ron Paul is elected, that would be very unlikely to happen, because the troops that are no longer in occupation over seas could be utilized by the border patrol to protect us from illegal aliens coming into the country.
2nd) Border Patrol and CBP OFO(those working the ports of entry) would be disbanded under Paul because they are part of Homeland Security, or is Paul not really going to disband Homeland Security just mix them up again?
I think the concern with Iran getting a nuke, isn't that they will attack us using conventional methods, it is more that they will attack our friends or get a small device into our country. Iran might have a ramshackle Navy, but the borders over there are very porous at best. Who's to say Iran doesn't move a small nuclear device overland to Europe (they have a border with eastern Europe) and set it off there? It also wouldn't be much of a strech to smuggle a smaller device into Isreal and hit one of the areas not associated with Islam. Iran is also a terrorist state, who's to say they don't take the small nuclear device to a friendly country in south America, say Venezuela, where it is then shipped up central America through the southwest border. It can then be smuggled over the border into the US. Tons of dope come in that way why couldn't a nuke weighing less than 100lbs be done the same way? Many in the underworld don't really care what is smuggled if the price is right.
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 1,506
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From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
We have NO REASON to be afraid of Iran. What are we scared of? Death? Are we afraid of Iran because we believe they will kill us? Invade the US? Launch tons of nukes and blow up our Wal-Marts?
First of all, since when did we become a nation of fearful lambs? We are Americans and should never act out foolishly and shout provocations from on our heels as we cower in fear at the thought of a nuclear Iran.
Secondly, Iran has a misfit navy of very few vessels that are all second hand and outdated. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic...c_of_Iran_Navy... )
Also, Iran has no long range intercontinental ballistic missiles. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_For...Missile_forces... ) They couldn't deliver a missile to the US if they wanted to. Unless their navy were sitting right in the Gulf of Mexico. Do you think the Iranian misfit navy would be allowed to get to the gulf without being smothered by our HUMONGOUS and overpowering navy? No chance. They would be obliterated.
And then there's this. Iran is surrounded by hundreds of nukes. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_...uclear_weapons... ) Israel, who has around 200 nukes, would drop the hammer on them in a second if they EVER launched a missle. Iran may be led by a kooky government, but they are not a suicidal country. Another reason why Israel can take care of themselves from now on.
Also, They can't even refine enough gasoline for themselves. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationa...y#Fuel_imports... ) They couldn't fuel a naval assault.
Plus, WE MADE THIS MESS! We assisted in overthrowing a democratically elected Prime Minister (Mohammad Mosaddegh) to install the authoritarian Shah (Mohammad-Reza Shah Pahlavi) in the 1953 coup d'etat. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Ir..._d%27%C3%A9tat... ) He was overthrown in the Iranian Revolution which opened the doors for Islamic insurgents all over the middle east. Particularly in its early years, it triggered enormous enthusiasm and redoubled opposition to western intervention and influence. Islamist insurgents rose in Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Syria and Lebanon. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Revolution#Impact... )
Bottom line is, DON'T BE SCARED! Iran is not the "imminent threat" that it is being made out to be by the MSM. THEY DON'T HAVE A NUKE! It is war propaganda to get the people to blindly follow into ANOTHER occupation so that big money military contracts can continue to be doled out to the corporations that have entangled themselves in the money making war machine. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_pro..._United_States... ) They don't want it to stop, so it is in their best interest to ensure you don't want it to stop either!
The only way that Iran could possibly attack the US with a nuclear weapon would be getting it across the border and detonating it, but if Ron Paul is elected, that would be very unlikely to happen, because the troops that are no longer in occupation over seas could be utilized by the border patrol to protect us from illegal aliens coming into the country.
First of all, since when did we become a nation of fearful lambs? We are Americans and should never act out foolishly and shout provocations from on our heels as we cower in fear at the thought of a nuclear Iran.
Secondly, Iran has a misfit navy of very few vessels that are all second hand and outdated. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic...c_of_Iran_Navy... )
Also, Iran has no long range intercontinental ballistic missiles. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_For...Missile_forces... ) They couldn't deliver a missile to the US if they wanted to. Unless their navy were sitting right in the Gulf of Mexico. Do you think the Iranian misfit navy would be allowed to get to the gulf without being smothered by our HUMONGOUS and overpowering navy? No chance. They would be obliterated.
And then there's this. Iran is surrounded by hundreds of nukes. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_...uclear_weapons... ) Israel, who has around 200 nukes, would drop the hammer on them in a second if they EVER launched a missle. Iran may be led by a kooky government, but they are not a suicidal country. Another reason why Israel can take care of themselves from now on.
Also, They can't even refine enough gasoline for themselves. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationa...y#Fuel_imports... ) They couldn't fuel a naval assault.
Plus, WE MADE THIS MESS! We assisted in overthrowing a democratically elected Prime Minister (Mohammad Mosaddegh) to install the authoritarian Shah (Mohammad-Reza Shah Pahlavi) in the 1953 coup d'etat. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Ir..._d%27%C3%A9tat... ) He was overthrown in the Iranian Revolution which opened the doors for Islamic insurgents all over the middle east. Particularly in its early years, it triggered enormous enthusiasm and redoubled opposition to western intervention and influence. Islamist insurgents rose in Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Syria and Lebanon. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Revolution#Impact... )
Bottom line is, DON'T BE SCARED! Iran is not the "imminent threat" that it is being made out to be by the MSM. THEY DON'T HAVE A NUKE! It is war propaganda to get the people to blindly follow into ANOTHER occupation so that big money military contracts can continue to be doled out to the corporations that have entangled themselves in the money making war machine. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_pro..._United_States... ) They don't want it to stop, so it is in their best interest to ensure you don't want it to stop either!
The only way that Iran could possibly attack the US with a nuclear weapon would be getting it across the border and detonating it, but if Ron Paul is elected, that would be very unlikely to happen, because the troops that are no longer in occupation over seas could be utilized by the border patrol to protect us from illegal aliens coming into the country.
Nor did I reference a fear that Iran would somehow occupy the U.S.A.
Yes, our Navy is lots better than theirs, and they don't have ICBM's to hit us with.
Israeal may have nukes, but IMO the world will not be a better place if they have to use them to respond to an Iranian first strike. In fact, the Iranians attacking Israel with nukes could well kick off WWIII. Personally, I think we should make some efforts to avoid that scenario. Guess you and I will have to agree to disagree on that.
As to whether Iran is a 'suicidal nation', you seem quite confident they are not. Glad you and Ron Paul are so sure, but IMO you have your head in the sand, and there are a few flaws with your theory. First, the Iranians may well feel they could survive an Israeli nuclear response (if there was one). Secondly, suicide bombing is not exactly unkown among radical Islamicists.
And the fact that the Iranians have a problem refining gas has no bearing on the issue. If they are as bright as you say, they'll figure it out.
As to 'we made this mess', well, I don't claim to be an expert on Iran. But I don't feel our President should accetp having WWIII get kicked off just because we did somethign not nice in 1953.
BTW, no one with any credibility wants the US to occupy Iran. Not sure where you got that little gem from.
In summary, you and Ron Paul seem to think the threat from radical Islam is a myth, perpetrated by war mongering Americans. Well, you and Ron Paul are wrong. It's more serious than that, and I expect our next president to understand that fact.
Ron Paul would be a disaster on foreign policy, IMO, and will strongly oppose him for that reason.
Technical Article Contributor
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,511
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From: Under the flightpath of old ORD 22R
I know the topic was generic, but now that the conversation has drifted to Iran...
This is a pretty accurate description of what could happen.
China and Russia are on the side of Iran.
I still cannot tell where Israel falls with us, some days they seem to be an ally of the US, others they thumb their nose at the US...
Think if it hit the fan, this could be a problem.
Putin appears ( in my opinion ) to be from the old school KGB days.
He is looking for a reason to bring Russia back to where it was in the 70s, and this could give him that reason.
Israel seems to have been itching for a reason to attack Iran.
They are a bit pissed off from the Palestine statehood via what they describe as a back door ( security council ).
Iran is backing Palestine's bid for statehood, the US is trying to buy off Palestine with money to stop pushing for statehood, and all the while China and Russia are on the side of Palestine in the UN.
If Israel starts the mess, Iran is going to answer pretty hard, and China and Russia might get involved ( either directly and overtly or as Russia and China did to the US in Vietnam ). The US will feel the need to lead the charge for the answer, and this will not turn out well. EU news sources paint a better picture of what is going on with this, while the US MSM leads with stories like America's next top looser type infotainment.
Any thing but. Iran does not have an issue going down with the ship.
While the POTUS not wanting to WW-III starting out on his watch, being POTUS carries with it the mess from the last POTUS, and the one before that, etc.
The US got involved in Iran's democracy a long time ago, and the current state of the country is still in turmoil over what the US did, just for the sake of commerce.
The last elections where the UN tried to make sure the election was not a typical sham election, the rebuttal from Iran 'The US already messed with our elections before, this is just them trying the same thing again'. The mess that is there with current leaders ( and their actions ) is a direct result of the US messing around with a democratic country, and wanting someone in control that is sympathetic to the US's desires.
'Not nice' is a kind way of putting what the US did to Iran.
It would be akin to an action that is 20x the size of OWS ( and violent ) being funded by China or Russia to create issues inside the US to the point of having a coup and the POTUS that was elected by the people ( as close as the electoral process allows that, these days ) be replaced by one that is picked by China or Russia so they can have the US economic structure revolve around what is beneficial to them.
While I do not agree with Ron Paul's foreign policy thoughts on how Iran is not a threat to anyone, I do agree with his thought of exit all external actions and use the troops at home. We cannot afford to keep things running here, the money we borrow from China to run these actions needs to stop. I would go as far as to say cut off all countries that get economic help from the US, and the US scales the UN involvement back to the level of the UK and France ( the US is contributes almost the same amount as the 2nd and 3rd largest UN members combined ).
I don't know if it is accurate, and if I read it here or somewhere else, but the US military is the size of the next 11 nations, and 8 of them are considered allies of the US. WTH is wrong with this picture, if correct.
China and Russia are on the side of Iran.
I still cannot tell where Israel falls with us, some days they seem to be an ally of the US, others they thumb their nose at the US...
Think if it hit the fan, this could be a problem.
Putin appears ( in my opinion ) to be from the old school KGB days.
He is looking for a reason to bring Russia back to where it was in the 70s, and this could give him that reason.
Israel seems to have been itching for a reason to attack Iran.
They are a bit pissed off from the Palestine statehood via what they describe as a back door ( security council ).
Iran is backing Palestine's bid for statehood, the US is trying to buy off Palestine with money to stop pushing for statehood, and all the while China and Russia are on the side of Palestine in the UN.
If Israel starts the mess, Iran is going to answer pretty hard, and China and Russia might get involved ( either directly and overtly or as Russia and China did to the US in Vietnam ). The US will feel the need to lead the charge for the answer, and this will not turn out well. EU news sources paint a better picture of what is going on with this, while the US MSM leads with stories like America's next top looser type infotainment.
The US got involved in Iran's democracy a long time ago, and the current state of the country is still in turmoil over what the US did, just for the sake of commerce.
The last elections where the UN tried to make sure the election was not a typical sham election, the rebuttal from Iran 'The US already messed with our elections before, this is just them trying the same thing again'. The mess that is there with current leaders ( and their actions ) is a direct result of the US messing around with a democratic country, and wanting someone in control that is sympathetic to the US's desires.
'Not nice' is a kind way of putting what the US did to Iran.
It would be akin to an action that is 20x the size of OWS ( and violent ) being funded by China or Russia to create issues inside the US to the point of having a coup and the POTUS that was elected by the people ( as close as the electoral process allows that, these days ) be replaced by one that is picked by China or Russia so they can have the US economic structure revolve around what is beneficial to them.
While I do not agree with Ron Paul's foreign policy thoughts on how Iran is not a threat to anyone, I do agree with his thought of exit all external actions and use the troops at home. We cannot afford to keep things running here, the money we borrow from China to run these actions needs to stop. I would go as far as to say cut off all countries that get economic help from the US, and the US scales the UN involvement back to the level of the UK and France ( the US is contributes almost the same amount as the 2nd and 3rd largest UN members combined ).
I don't know if it is accurate, and if I read it here or somewhere else, but the US military is the size of the next 11 nations, and 8 of them are considered allies of the US. WTH is wrong with this picture, if correct.
Last edited by SSCULLY; Dec 18, 2011 at 04:57 PM.