SCT - Beware of the XC2 and the truth
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Originally Posted by Silver_2000_;)!
I never had an Xcal 1 - I had the chip burner so I dont know what the Xcal 1 did or didnt do.
BUT if your Xcal 2 doesnt do the stuff that mine does its NOT SCT's fault. Its either yours or your tuners.
There is no issue here between us - Im simply trying to mnake sure others that read this understand that there is MORE to the story than you are letting on. It may be true that your Tuner sold you something that you believed had more capability than it did at that time. And those beliefs may have been based on SCT advertising. But thats water under the bridge.
Now the product does what it says it does. AND you didnt but the Xcal from SCT - they dont sell direct. You bought it from a tuner or vendor - your beef is with them. I use a tuner I trust because I expect him to test the equipment BEFORE he sells it to me - so that we BOTH know exactly what it will do and what it wont.
My bet is your tuner didnt pay for the SCT updgrade to get the extra features and thats why you dont have them. Once - again - like a broken record - your issue is with the tuner.
Doug
BUT if your Xcal 2 doesnt do the stuff that mine does its NOT SCT's fault. Its either yours or your tuners.
There is no issue here between us - Im simply trying to mnake sure others that read this understand that there is MORE to the story than you are letting on. It may be true that your Tuner sold you something that you believed had more capability than it did at that time. And those beliefs may have been based on SCT advertising. But thats water under the bridge.
Now the product does what it says it does. AND you didnt but the Xcal from SCT - they dont sell direct. You bought it from a tuner or vendor - your beef is with them. I use a tuner I trust because I expect him to test the equipment BEFORE he sells it to me - so that we BOTH know exactly what it will do and what it wont.
My bet is your tuner didnt pay for the SCT updgrade to get the extra features and thats why you dont have them. Once - again - like a broken record - your issue is with the tuner.
Doug
There was no disclaimer on SCT's site at the time I purchased the device stating that it could not do that at the time. Simply put that is what I needed and expected I was getting. That is a fact.
I purchased the device on the second day it was released. No dealer was aware that the firmware did not support the features as advertised at that point and time. That is another fact. Talk to Sal or any other SCT dealer regarding that point if you don't believe me.
SCT promised hardware datalogging in August and failed to deliver. That is another fact.
What MORE do you feel there is to the story?
Does your Xcal2 have the capability to datalog to the device itself? If so I truly am missing something and I appologize. But my guess is it does not.
Regardless, this will be my last public post on your forum regarding the issue, as I understand you don't want this here and I will respect that.
Last edited by RustySocket; Oct 8, 2005 at 07:07 PM.
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From: NJ
i thought vendor bashing was a no no!!
Listen if you were dissappointed when you got your SCT product you should have returned it and went with something else... but like i posted earlier, your tuner needs to unlock that optin for you.. its not SCT's fault... get a new tuner if he wont unlock it for you.. i was always skeptic about SCT and when i broke my predator i decided to jump on the band wagon and go with SCT's Xcal 2.. and i have no issues with it.. SCT i tip my hat to you guys, you make quality products and as a customer i am pleased... enjoy your tuner bending you over Rusty because SCT has nothing to do what is going on.. as for the data logging you need a cable to hook up to sct's usb port and connect it to a laptop... the predator you can do it right there but it wont save unless it is hooked to a laptop.. good luck with your issues... 
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rustysocket,
The ONLY feature that is not fully supported right now is on-screen data logging. The reason you have been silenced on our board is because you constantly make statements that are not completley correct. We could either spend time constantly responding to those with correct information, or we could spend that time working on our product.
We are working hard on all of our updates, but the simple fact is that we will not release somthing until it's fully ironed out and tested. We try to make estimates on time, but with R&D you don't know how long somthing will take until it's done. I have read in other posts that you believe constantly complaining will help speed things along. This release is a priority to SCT, so all your constant board posts is doing is slowing progress because it forces us to come out and respond.
The changes to support online data logging include new firmware, shortened PID/DMR descriptions, a new livelink version, a new liveload version, and a lot of encrypted firmware upgrade testing to make sure no units fail during firmware upgrade.
When it's done, there will be a post on the SCT website. I can't say exactly when, but it will be soon. New units are already shipping with data-logging capable firmware (V1.10), and all we have left in the testing is to verify that every possible different configuration will accept the firmware update. When that is done, the release will be announced. I had hoped we would be ready August 31st, but it wasn't and there isn't anything I can change about that. Releasing somthing that is poor is not a good compromise to meet a goal, so we opted to push the date back and make sure it's right.
The ONLY feature that is not fully supported right now is on-screen data logging. The reason you have been silenced on our board is because you constantly make statements that are not completley correct. We could either spend time constantly responding to those with correct information, or we could spend that time working on our product.
We are working hard on all of our updates, but the simple fact is that we will not release somthing until it's fully ironed out and tested. We try to make estimates on time, but with R&D you don't know how long somthing will take until it's done. I have read in other posts that you believe constantly complaining will help speed things along. This release is a priority to SCT, so all your constant board posts is doing is slowing progress because it forces us to come out and respond.
The changes to support online data logging include new firmware, shortened PID/DMR descriptions, a new livelink version, a new liveload version, and a lot of encrypted firmware upgrade testing to make sure no units fail during firmware upgrade.
When it's done, there will be a post on the SCT website. I can't say exactly when, but it will be soon. New units are already shipping with data-logging capable firmware (V1.10), and all we have left in the testing is to verify that every possible different configuration will accept the firmware update. When that is done, the release will be announced. I had hoped we would be ready August 31st, but it wasn't and there isn't anything I can change about that. Releasing somthing that is poor is not a good compromise to meet a goal, so we opted to push the date back and make sure it's right.
Last edited by Brian@SCT; Oct 10, 2005 at 03:09 PM.
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From: NJ
Originally Posted by Brian@SCT
rustysocket,
The ONLY feature that is not fully supported right now is on-screen data logging. The reason you have been silenced on our board is because you constantly make statements that are not completley correct. We could either spend time constantly responding to those with correct information, or we could spend that time working on our product.
We are working hard on all of our updates, but the simple fact is that we will not release somthing until it's fully ironed out and tested. We try to make estimates on time, but with R&D you don't know how long somthing will take until it's done. I have read in other posts that you believe constantly complaining will help speed things along. This release is a priority to SCT, so all your constant board posts is doing is slowing progress because it forces us to come out and respond.
The changes to support online data logging include new firmware, shortened PID/DMR descriptions, a new livelink version, a new liveload version, and a lot of encrypted firmware upgrade testing to make sure no units fail during firmware upgrade.
When it's done, there will be a post on the SCT website. I can't say exactly when, but it will be soon. New units are already shipping with data-logging capable firmware (V1.10), and all we have left in the testing is to verify that every possible different configuration will accept the firmware update. When that is done, the release will be announced. I had hoped we would be ready August 31st, but it wasn't and there isn't anything I can change about that. Releasing somthing that is poor is not a good compromise to meet a goal, so we opted to push the date back and make sure it's right.
The ONLY feature that is not fully supported right now is on-screen data logging. The reason you have been silenced on our board is because you constantly make statements that are not completley correct. We could either spend time constantly responding to those with correct information, or we could spend that time working on our product.
We are working hard on all of our updates, but the simple fact is that we will not release somthing until it's fully ironed out and tested. We try to make estimates on time, but with R&D you don't know how long somthing will take until it's done. I have read in other posts that you believe constantly complaining will help speed things along. This release is a priority to SCT, so all your constant board posts is doing is slowing progress because it forces us to come out and respond.
The changes to support online data logging include new firmware, shortened PID/DMR descriptions, a new livelink version, a new liveload version, and a lot of encrypted firmware upgrade testing to make sure no units fail during firmware upgrade.
When it's done, there will be a post on the SCT website. I can't say exactly when, but it will be soon. New units are already shipping with data-logging capable firmware (V1.10), and all we have left in the testing is to verify that every possible different configuration will accept the firmware update. When that is done, the release will be announced. I had hoped we would be ready August 31st, but it wasn't and there isn't anything I can change about that. Releasing somthing that is poor is not a good compromise to meet a goal, so we opted to push the date back and make sure it's right.
couldnt be said any better then that Rusty... SCT is doing really well with our vehicles, and i dont think anyone is complaining other then you...
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From: Bridgeport, MI
To bad there isn't an upgrade for us X Cal 1 owners we kinda got the short end of the stick and we are told that we can trade up for an X-Cal 2 and they will give us a fraction of what we paid for it.
God Bless,
Suavy
God Bless,
Suavy
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From: O'Fallon, MO
Originally Posted by Suavy
To bad there isn't an upgrade for us X Cal 1 owners we kinda got the short end of the stick and we are told that we can trade up for an X-Cal 2 and they will give us a fraction of what we paid for it.
God Bless,
Suavy
God Bless,
Suavy
SCT's attitude is they are doing us a favor by offering an upgrade, but that ignores the fact that we bought their interim solution. The put out what they could to keep Diablo from completely dominating the market and all us Xcal 1 purchases paid for it.
Oh well, I'm still a SCT customer now with a Xcal 2. Not impressed at all with how they handled everything.
-Mark
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From: Palm Coast, FL
Originally Posted by St Louis Lightning
And they waited until after shipping the Xcal 2 to announce how much offered for the Xcal 1 trade in program. If they would have said $125 months before launch it would have killed Xcal 1 sales.
SCT's attitude is they are doing us a favor by offering an upgrade, but that ignores the fact that we bought their interim solution. The put out what they could to keep Diablo from completely dominating the market and all us Xcal 1 purchases paid for it.
Oh well, I'm still a SCT customer now with a Xcal 2. Not impressed at all with how they handled everything.
-Mark
SCT's attitude is they are doing us a favor by offering an upgrade, but that ignores the fact that we bought their interim solution. The put out what they could to keep Diablo from completely dominating the market and all us Xcal 1 purchases paid for it.
Oh well, I'm still a SCT customer now with a Xcal 2. Not impressed at all with how they handled everything.
-Mark
There was never an intention for SCT to make the first Xcal as an "interim" tool. It was their first device. It was not called the Xcal "1" as people now refer to it, which would have shown the intention of a second tool planned for the future. It was the Xcalibrator. The new tool is the Xcalibrator 2, because it's the second tool they've come out with.
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Originally Posted by Brian@SCT
Releasing somthing that is poor is not a good compromise to meet a goal, so we opted to push the date back and make sure it's right.
The fact that you banned me (effectively) for stating the truth is lame.... I challenge you to post an example of anything I have posted that was not accurate or factual.
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From: Bridgeport, MI
Originally Posted by LightningTuner
Mark, that's not quite what SCT's intentions were. The 9100 WAS the "interim" tool for SCT to get their stuff out there in the beginning, and they will openly admit that. And there was nothing wrong with the 9100, it was just that they were buying them from Superchips so the cost was more. The Xcal1 was SCTs own version of the flash tool, which is how they were able to lower the cost to the customer. It did what they wanted it to do. As time went on, there was a demand for a tool with more options and faster data transfer, so the Xcal2 was produced. The Xcal2 did NOT "take the place" of the Xcal1. The XCal1 can still be bought for those not needing all the options of the Xcal2. SCT dropped the price of the Xcal1 down to a cheaper price. That's where the trade in program came in. They were not saying "trade your Xcal1 in for an Xcal2, because we cheezed you with a cheaper tool", they were saying "trade your Xcal1 in for an Xcal2, because we dropped the price of the Xcal1, and want to allow our customers a chance to save a little money on the new tool". It was never supposed to be an even swap and you can't expect them to take an Xcal1 in on an Xcal2 for free. When Ford upped the hp on the Lightning in 2001, people didn't expect Ford to take their used 99-00s in on trade for the "new, better truck", you had to lose some money to get into the new product. Same thing here.
There was never an intention for SCT to make the first Xcal as an "interim" tool. It was their first device. It was not called the Xcal "1" as people now refer to it, which would have shown the intention of a second tool planned for the future. It was the Xcalibrator. The new tool is the Xcalibrator 2, because it's the second tool they've come out with.
There was never an intention for SCT to make the first Xcal as an "interim" tool. It was their first device. It was not called the Xcal "1" as people now refer to it, which would have shown the intention of a second tool planned for the future. It was the Xcalibrator. The new tool is the Xcalibrator 2, because it's the second tool they've come out with.
You make a good point Sal, I wished it made it easyer to swallow though! I have the X-cal 1.
God Bless,
Suavy
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Rusty,
Just as on our own forums, it looks like you are done discussing tech and want to start trouble. That is why your posts were blocked at SCT, and I am not going to respond to the same here.
The XCalibrator1 was originally the XCalibrator. When we sold that product, you could also buy a data logger seperatly. With the Raptor (data logger) and the XCalibrator1 you could data log and even tweak your vehicle with Extreme Tune. If you have a vehicle tuned with that and a raptor, there is not a need to get rid of your old hardware just to get the latest greatest thing. The XCalibrator2 was an attempt to combine those into one easy package, and bring them together for a lower price. For people that wanted to upgrade anways, we did offer a rebate. I never at any time stated that it would be a free upgrade, but we did the best we could for customers that wanted to step up.
When customers purchased the original XCalibrator they had the option to buy a seperate data logger (Raptor) for $449 more. With the $125 trade-in credit that SCT offered during the promotion, customers could upgrade to a data logging flash tool for almost half of what they would have originally paid for a seperate data logger. Many people traded in by purcahsing their XCAL2 from dealers that charged $349. With the $125 rebate their total cost to upgrade was $224.
I realize that everyone has a different opinion about how much the upgrade should cost. I would love to give it to everyone for free, but that isn't possible when you have a dealer network where dealers have their own control over product selling prices. For anyone that claims the upgrade wasn't enough, I'd like information on what other tuner companies have done in the past that you think is more fair.
Brian
Just as on our own forums, it looks like you are done discussing tech and want to start trouble. That is why your posts were blocked at SCT, and I am not going to respond to the same here.
The XCalibrator1 was originally the XCalibrator. When we sold that product, you could also buy a data logger seperatly. With the Raptor (data logger) and the XCalibrator1 you could data log and even tweak your vehicle with Extreme Tune. If you have a vehicle tuned with that and a raptor, there is not a need to get rid of your old hardware just to get the latest greatest thing. The XCalibrator2 was an attempt to combine those into one easy package, and bring them together for a lower price. For people that wanted to upgrade anways, we did offer a rebate. I never at any time stated that it would be a free upgrade, but we did the best we could for customers that wanted to step up.
When customers purchased the original XCalibrator they had the option to buy a seperate data logger (Raptor) for $449 more. With the $125 trade-in credit that SCT offered during the promotion, customers could upgrade to a data logging flash tool for almost half of what they would have originally paid for a seperate data logger. Many people traded in by purcahsing their XCAL2 from dealers that charged $349. With the $125 rebate their total cost to upgrade was $224.
I realize that everyone has a different opinion about how much the upgrade should cost. I would love to give it to everyone for free, but that isn't possible when you have a dealer network where dealers have their own control over product selling prices. For anyone that claims the upgrade wasn't enough, I'd like information on what other tuner companies have done in the past that you think is more fair.
Brian
Last edited by Brian@SCT; Oct 10, 2005 at 10:51 PM.
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From: NJ
Originally Posted by RustySocket
Your last sentence supports everything I have stated. Too bad you didn't take your own advice and finish the product before sticking me with it and lying about it in the process to promote your financial interests.
The fact that you banned me (effectively) for stating the truth is lame.... I challenge you to post an example of anything I have posted that was not accurate or factual.
The fact that you banned me (effectively) for stating the truth is lame.... I challenge you to post an example of anything I have posted that was not accurate or factual.
Hey Rusty i thought you were through with posting anything on SCT supported forums... didnt expect to hear you come back..
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[QUOTE=Brian@SCT]Rusty,
Just as on our own forums, it looks like you are done discussing tech and want to start trouble. That is why your posts were blocked at SCT, and I am not going to respond to the same here.
QUOTE]
Again,I challenge you on a public forum to show me an example of something I posted that was not based on fact. Don't respond to me and quote portions of a post that I did not origionate, as you just did. That is simply a diversionary tactic.
The tech issues are the problem..... your device does not do the things that SCT stated it did. I simply want an answer.... as to why, and you have continually avoided that point, both here and on your forum. That is why I have been relentless with you. You have avoided every opportunity to answer my questions with a straight answer. I thought we were close to some resolution... given the August date... then you simply quit updating the thread on your forum. Why is it wrong for me to ask what happened to the update...??
Simply admit that you guys made a mistake and released the XC2 before it was ready and that will be it.... end of story... but to make me out to be the bad guy... and allow people on your forum to post "that I should have done my research...., all these issues were known" is simply unnacceptable... You know who I am... you have the means to contact me personally, you know who the tuner is... yet you have done NOTHING to help resolve this issue except avoid it.....
Thats what brought us here today.
Just as on our own forums, it looks like you are done discussing tech and want to start trouble. That is why your posts were blocked at SCT, and I am not going to respond to the same here.
QUOTE]
Again,I challenge you on a public forum to show me an example of something I posted that was not based on fact. Don't respond to me and quote portions of a post that I did not origionate, as you just did. That is simply a diversionary tactic.
The tech issues are the problem..... your device does not do the things that SCT stated it did. I simply want an answer.... as to why, and you have continually avoided that point, both here and on your forum. That is why I have been relentless with you. You have avoided every opportunity to answer my questions with a straight answer. I thought we were close to some resolution... given the August date... then you simply quit updating the thread on your forum. Why is it wrong for me to ask what happened to the update...??
Simply admit that you guys made a mistake and released the XC2 before it was ready and that will be it.... end of story... but to make me out to be the bad guy... and allow people on your forum to post "that I should have done my research...., all these issues were known" is simply unnacceptable... You know who I am... you have the means to contact me personally, you know who the tuner is... yet you have done NOTHING to help resolve this issue except avoid it.....
Thats what brought us here today.