http://www.industryclick.com/microsi...126&srid=10250

I found this website when I was shopping for my Screw, had to say I was really impressed by the new I6 in the Trailblazer until I saw the specs on the BMW I6, 333 normally aspirated hp from 3.2L is IMPRESSIVE!

Also impressive is the Honda VTEC, 200hp from a normally aspirated 2L 4 cylinder is good engineering.

Still, the HD is the best of my two worlds, straight-line performance and utility.

 

Superior Engineering....NO!

They put a ridiculous amount of money into their engines and over charge when all they are doing is running high-compression and shooting a bunch of gas into the cylinders.

The 333HP is at 7900RMP for goodness sake.


BMW M3 - 3.2L I6 - 16 mpg / 24 mpg
Corvette Z06 - 5.7L V8 - 19 mpg / 28 mpg

Find this slightly awkward? All you get with the M3 is a smaller engine and less power. The efficiency of each cylinder fails to impress me and this "Ultimate Driving Machine" is a bunch of BS.

 

Don't get me wrong, I love the Z06 with its LS6 and T56 and would rather have it than an M3 any day. But as an engineer I have to appreciate making the most with what you have. Compare the the 2 via different criteria, hp/L

3.2L I6 = 103
5.7L V8 = 71

In the 1/4 mile power is power, wether its at 5k or 8k. If the motor can safely get there it doesn't matter.

Just imagine what GM could do with a new DOHC V8, possibly break the 100hp/L barrier and push nearly 600hp with 350 ci! (They experimented with the ZR1 motor a decade ago.)

BTW the reason the corvette and f-bodies have such good gas mileage is because the "skip-shift" feature which forces you to go from 1st to 4th under normal driving conditions (which is really a gimmick to "cheat" the CAFE legislation) and the hella overdrive ratio (.65 I think). Normal driving will not get you 19 mpg in the city! That said, GM definitely deserves major kudos for its powertrain accomplishments with that package. If they would only take it to the next level with some of the newer technology (DOHC, variable valve timing, etc) and bring back an affordable sports car (Z28, T/A). Dare to dream

 

oh... oh back from the dead...

I've never been a fan of BMW, no offense intended to anyone. A big slice of their vehicle price is just their "name". Where I grew up, Phillippines, cars were status symbols and to be associated with BMWs and Mercedes was a high status. Now that I am more wiser and mature, they just represent images of social eliticism.

Just my 2 pennies.

 

Ganted - Not the same rides, however, considering the fact that it is a truck makes it fun for me. CTK (ChesterT)

 

Well said, ChesterC!!

 

Oh...one more thing to add...

With the safety issue...I would much rather be in my F150 Supercrew (HD) in any collision with an M3. Weight matters...and this isn't even factored into the safety ratings on our trucks. The government gave our trucks 5 star ratings on the head-on collision with a wall. Also take into consideration the amount of damage which must be sustained in order to stop a 5600lb brick (our trucks) - Crashing into a pole would be a different story...but I would take on any M3 no matter the situation in a collision.

 

I see a lot of well taken points for both sides of this coin. I just wanna know how well the M3 is going to do hauiling a load of lumber? Not too good, I think...

 

HAHHA....that sounds cute...I like it better than "Just My Two Cents"

But yea, BMWs are good cars, they used to be great, but now there are so many companies that are just about up to par with them as far as engineering goes. The reason that they are priced so high is because of their name (major part), interior materials, technological gadgets and some exterior goodies. Theres nothing super special about these cars anymore, dumb people think that they are superior to anything on the road. Alot of people know that they're jsut buying the car for status, see someone in a Benz, they must be rich ... now with leasing, just about anyone can afford to have one...they may have to give up a lot of things....like a house :P but they can still have one.

 

Reminds me of my life goal I'm gonna get one of each year and color HD, a Lightning, a F550, a Hummer H1, a few HD bikes, 55 foot trailer for my 550, and i'm gonna have a HUGE garage for all them. I don't care if my house is the size of a portapotty, as long as i got my HD's and my garage, i'll be happy

o yeah, i want a lamborghini diablo also. the previous model, not the new ones. LoL.

wishful thinking huh?

 

Seems like so long ago!

ChesterC: I totally agree with you. Growing up and living in So. Cal, every other car is a BMW, Mercedes or a Ricer. I've always hated these cars for what they've come to represent...great engineering or not.

That's another reason I love this truck so much. I'd rather have something that looks nice, is powerful and is a bit different from the norm. BMW and Mercedes are to cars like NSYNC is to music. They're popular so they have to be good.

Here's a perfect example of social pressure. I have a new 4 bedroom home with a $1600+/month mortgage and an 02 F150 loan.

Just down the street there are brand new 2 bedroom APARTMENTS for $2400/month with the owners driving BMWs, Mercedes and Ricers. Some people put more stock in their image they try to project than things that make more sense.

I could never justify spending money to impress anyone. Especially that much money on a car.

 

Oh yeah...I forgot to add one more thing...

Imports suck and they put off a bad image.

 

Boys, boys, boys,

Do you have any clue as to the markup Ford puts on every truck?! If a BMW is overpriced, then an F150 is the Hope diamond of markup. And didn't the previous quote just describe any HD F150...name, interior materials, gadgets, etc? Example: BMW and Ford both charge about $1000 for their leather. Our HD is already showing alot of wear, while the BMW still looks new. The exerior plastic is very high grade. The HD already has faded plastic around every window. The BMW still looks new. And yes, I use the same cleaning methods on both. The windshield is so thick, you cannot hear any wind noise, and a golf ball sized rock hit the windshield at 90MPH and actually "dented" the glass. No pinhole break due to the composition of the softer safety glass. Even the wiper blades clean 99% of the windshield, while the Ford's might get 70%.

I had a '95 LT1 and a '99 LS1. I can tell you I NEVER got over 14MPG. On a highway trip, averaging 70MPH, I still only got 21MPG. GM was allowed to skew the EPA numbers if they manufactured with the skip-shift.

What would you run in a 24-hr race, a Ford or anything German? The Ford would be lucky to make it 6 hours.

The government tests are a joke! Who do you think is one of the biggest contributors to the govt.? For more "real world" results, see this site: http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_rat...html/0110.htm. The BMW X5 is the safest vehicle of ALL time. Not just trucks, but car, trucks, etc. How safe do you feel now after seeing the A-pillar collapse, the roof turn into a TP, and have both your legs smashed by the steering wheel and dash? That's the same A-pillar in the screw, for those of you who think "it's a SCab and not a SCrew." I'm scared to death to ride in our '02 HD for fear of a rollover or front-end collision.

Speeds in the US average 65MPH. That crap doesn't fly on the Autobahn and backroads of Germany, where the usual speed is 80-90MPH. Who can even hear their passengers conversation at 100MPH in the HD. It feels like it wants to leave the road at any second. There's no sway, minimal noise, and a SOLID feeling at 130MPH. 130MPH in any US or Asian car get to the point of "scary," including the Z06 which I've had up to 160MPH.

Yes, these cars are for the affluent. How many rich people do you know that need to haul wood. They pay people to do it for them. Lets' face it, these are white collar workers (Dr.s, lawyers, executives). Once I started making 6-digits, I quit mowing my own grass and cleaning my own house. I'm not too good to do it, just too busy at work.

Please, just drive one and think that statement over. I'm pullin' 0-60 in 6.5secs from that I-6, while still getting 31MPG Hwy and 25MPG City. The car tells you when you have a bulb out. (Not just a bulb, but exactly which bulb.) When the airbags deploy, which deploy based off occupancy, weight, etc., the phone callse for help with you Lat/Long. There's DSC (prevents over/understeer), ASC (much better that ABS), EBD (distributes brake force over all 4 wheels and "primes" the brakes when you remove you foot from the gas suddenly for increased brake pressure). It is impossible to lock the keys in your car. Even if I do, there is an infrared sensor. If that isn't enough, you must enter a 4-digit code into the navigation/computer to start the car with its own key!

I'm on my 2nd set of rotors (9.2Kmiles) on the HD. Have 37K miles on the BMW and still stops like it was new. Where do you think the technology comes from? Almost everything comes from Germany. MB invented the airbag and crumple zone. They now have a headlight system that will orient themselves wi th a curve. Anything requiring longevity and endurance comes from Germany - electronics manufacturing equipment to clocks. These companies must be the 1st to come out with these technologies while other companies "steal" it after all the research and money has been spent by European car makers. This is where the high prices come into play. They have to offset the break-even point to turn a profit from the R&D of these devices. Almost all of these are standard on high-end cars. Take a modestly priced car, such as the HD, and price out these options. A similary equipped HD would run you $90K+. Jesus was practically driving the same chassis on his chariot as the current Mustang. Ford/GM is still working on getting out the 5spd automatic, while the Europeans are on to 6, 7, anc CVT trannies. How many of the parts in an American car are actually made in the US? The electronics are made in Asia, the technology from Europe, the plastics and assemblies in Mexico, and cloth from some 3rd world country. The car/truck is merely assembled in the US. Even the blower is German engineering, and is the same one used in the $114K Mercedes SL55, E55, S55, CL55, etc.

Why do you think this is the case? You're more likely to die in a car wreck than in a house wreck. Good to buy quality/safety for something you KNOW is going to depreciate and maybe save your life one day. Just sounds like they are car enthusiasts to me. Myself, I'd rather have a 900sq/ft house with a 2000sq/ft garage. I'm doing fairly well and have a $500K house, '02 HD, and '01 BMW. I can afford any car I want, so why do I have a HD and mid-level luxury car? The HD is my wife's (all SUV's, sport trucks, etc. are women's cars) and the BMW is the ultimate compromise for luxury, handling, performance, safety, and fun-to-drive value. I didn't pay the premium or sucky gas mileage for the M5 or 540i, but also did wimp out for a false luxury car like the Lincoln (Contour), Lexus (Toyota), Infiniti (Nissan), or Acura (Honda).

So we all bought a bling-bling truck that is priced $13K+ over a 2WD SCrew. Doesn't a base model Ranger accomplish this same task? BMW's/Mercs start at $27K. Going off MSRPs, the '02 HD has already depreciated $10K. My '01 530i has only depreciated $10K in two years, with a 3year residual of 52%. Are KBB, Edmunds, and Nada in on this overvalued import craze/hype?

We buy the HD because we can afford it, just as those that buy BMWs, Mercs, and Bentleys do. Resell value, crash tests, and reliability should tell you which is better. "The ultimate driving machine" is about as accurate a statement there is, because driving does not mean 1/4-mile straight line. You actually should have to turn the wheel to be "driving."

What's the point of my rant? There isn't one! This is an F150 board, not a bash BMW/imports board. Why do I own a HD? I'm still American. As long as I live here, I will keep at least one US car in my garage. And every home should have a truck. Being the owner of both, I can tell you it's like comparing apples with hookers. Sad to say, the F150 is one of the biggest headaches there is, but I still own one. I am not into brand loyalty, but only what is best for me.

Confusion says: "Opinions are like a55holes- everybody has one, nobody really wants to hear it, and they're usually full of *****."

 

Were you driving down Melrose heading toward the 78 today (12/4) around 1:30ish?

I believe I may have seen you.

BTW: Quotes taken out of context can be made into any ammunition you want. The fact still remains that some people buy cars they can't afford simply because thy believe it gives themselves merit. My point was very clear illustrating how people (especially So. Cal) live beyond their means. The fact that you can afford both means very little to this argument. You may in fact be the only person I know who bought the car for performance over it being a status symbol.

I bought the truck because I like it, not "because we can afford it". I passed on other trucks in its class simply because of features like leg room, power, etc.

All SUV's, sport trucks, etc. are women's cars? WTF? That's as stupid a statement as I've ever heard. Didn't know there was gender classification for vehicles.

 

Wasn't me. The HD was in the shop today from 7am-5pm. Might have been the service guy from NC Ford. Get this, I dropped off the truck with a little less than 1/8 tank and got it back empty. The service guy only went 2.4 miles. Wonder what he was doing!? Also, during the courtesy wash, the pogues stripped all the gears in the passenger side mirror while drying.

I wasn't taking quotes to benefit my post. The majority of this thread is one-sided anyway. I was summarizing the plethera of previous "opinions." (In your user agreement for this Web site, it states that you cannot quote and entire posting in your post.) Living in SoCal is unnecessary in itself. The whole place is on a giant fault line. Most of it is covered with smog and desert. We don't even have our own drinking water. To live here, it will cost you. With that cost comes expectations. This is the land of the rich. It comes down to our capitalist society of supply and demand. This climate is highly sought after. Where else does it only rain 4 times per year?

Even your analogy had no thought behind it. If you pay $1600/mo for your house and they pay $2400/mo to rent and have their German engineered cars, what is stopping them from buying a house in your neighborhood for the cheaper price? There are no priorities mixed up there. Who's going to be stupid enough to rent for $2.4K/mo with no tax deductions over owning for $800 less per month? We usually act on our 1st impressions and blurt out what seems obvious to us, but goes into much greater detail.

I'm glad you bought what suited your needs, but there were some that were going beyond the context of this Web site. It's to talk about your F150, not bash other makers. Don't we bash out of jealousy and/or hatred?

How about Miatas, VW Beetles, and Z4's? Even my wife calls them chick cars. We stereotype everything. Even the carmakers do it - ask to see any makers demographic sheet. The BMW 5-series is most likely to be purchased by a white male with an average age of 53 and average income of $90K/yr. Of all the trucks/SUVS (5 truck and 30+ SUVs) in my development, only 3 are driven by men, all of which are work trucks. Even the guys regular drivers are BMWs, Mercs, Lexus, etc. All that drive these "trucks" are soccer moms. What purpose would a guy have with an expensive SUV or sport truck? Soccer moms benefit from the four+ doors, extra storage space, and power to pull the whole team to DQ. Guys use trucks for work (to haul, move, pull). Most of us in SoCal have to travle 40 miles minimum to go almost anywhere. The next time you're on the I-15 or I-5, make note of all the SUV's/sport trucks and the gender of the driver. You'll find the guys in the base model/work trucks. This observation might prove to be the opposite in say WV, TX, OK, etc. This is all using the basic method of observation/conclusion in the Scientific Method, just as many have regarding the demographic that drives ricers and other imports.

The point to be made was that how could some on this board bash imports as a whole. No more stupid than their comments. Of the 30 HD's I've seen in SD area, 80% were driven by women.

Don't get me wrong. I also bought it for the crash test dummy symbol on the hood. Why else would I buy a 5-series over the near exact spec'd 3-series, which is $10K less? To "fit in" with your neighbors, you must have similar interests. In SoCal, that happens to be luxury sedans. The HD comes from our roots - both originally from WV.