OK Assuming you are correct with you think China should handle their currency differently ( which would make it #1 ), that would make the US #2 ?
Would #2 still be one of the largest ?
The line above gave the US as one of, if not the top. Since you say it is not the top.....

There has not been jobs created in the US since Ronnie was in office ?
The number of tax payers indicates that there has been quite a few more jobs created, even with the unemployment rate where it is at today.
How many more jobs would you say there needs to be, to have this be true ?

 

People willing go to Walmart to purchase things that are made in China or one of the ROC with their money left over after taxes.

Where do you think that money goes to ? Oddly enough full circle, from Walmart's bank to China so they can loan it back to the US at a premium, so the government can spend it again.
If you are one of the many shoppers at Walmart, you are willingly sending profits to China ( supporting their way of life & politics ), so they can loan it back to the US government.

What was I to think about for a minute ? Something else so I do not notice the hypocrisy.

GM started this joint venture some time back, and has 49% ownership. China has 51%. If something is voted on, who wins ?
Fast forward to today, the joint venture is selling cars in China, and the US gov has decided that owning companies with tax dollars is a good thing.
The gov owns 30% ( by the post above, I have not confirmed this myself ) of 49% of a Chinese joint venture, including 30% of 49% of the profits from China ( left it long form, so the trail is easy to see )

This is Chinese money purchasing items on the Chinese economy, that 49% of the profits comes back to the US, keeping the stock value up, which is a good thing for your tax dollars, and good for the US as a whole. for Chinese money to be coming into the country, other than a loan.

Sounds like what China has done to the US for decades, only in reverse.

China set aside political differences, so they could profit ( actually a non communist action ).
Think they have not lost as many lives ( or more for how the US hung them out to dry in WW-II ), but for the matter of capitalist intentions, China set aside political differences, and took every bit of US money Walmart customers were willing to send there.

GM finally has an option to make money in what K-Mac notes as the largest economy in the world.

Strange, the Communists are better at capitalism than the democracy...

The way business in done outside of North America is unknown to 85% of the population in the US, due to being so self righteous and full of ourselves.
The film is something that is done, to be able to do business with the Chinese government ( the ones with the deep pockets in China ).
Get used to doing business their way, if you want the profits to come back to the US. China has gotten used to the way we do business, and it has profited them quite nice.
Else just get used to the only way money comes from China to the US in the form of a loan.

 

Lost $ 2.1 B.
oddly enough, the government had planned on losing $ 34B of the $ 85B loaned to GM & Chrysler. Going in the government knew it was a money loser, and still did it. That is so much better than the loans to the Banks....

 

Maybe this is specific to you ?

There is a current thread in this section on refi of a 2nd home, that is at a pretty good rate.
Banks seem to want to loan that person money on a second home in these times. Might be from the member being a good credit risk.

 

There have been more jobs made as there are more people but the jobs created are certainly not of the same quality.

Working at McDonald's or Wal-Mart certainly does not provide the same quality of life as a union factory job did in the late 70s and early 80s.

Unskilled laborers had a much better opprotunity then than now.

 

All the high tech jobs created ( due to changes in how investments could be made, and the tax rates ) are not the same quality as what ?

They pay better than factory wages, with less sweat.

 

How exactly is an unskilled laborer worse off today than 2-3 decades ago, as you allude to?

 

Sure technology has helped make some jobs but many of those jobs have found themselves outsourced to places like India.

The reality is that we have moved from a manufacturing based economy to a service based economy. Service based economies aren't sustainable in the long term like we are seeing.

Most of the unskilled manufacturing jobs that still paid well are gone. Now those people either have to gain more education to be competitive or they are taking jobs in security and retail that just don't pay as well.

It is hard to compare jobs that pay $15 an hour to those that pay $8 an hour and say they are equal.

While creating 5 jobs that pay $50k a year is better than one job that pays $250k a year...it is better to create 50 jobs that pay $30k a year than 100 that pay $15k year. There is a breaking point for the overall benefit.

 

Surely you are not so disconnected from the rest of the world to see the plight of unskilled labor.

People didn't need to have much of an education to be successful. Most would leave high school (if they graduated at all) and were able to find jobs that had benefits and paid reasonably well in the manufacturing sector.

Companies like Caterpillar, Barber-Greene, Ford, GM, All-Steel, etc were booming and paying very well. As time went on during the 1980's those jobs have gone away.

People coming into those manufacturing jobs are not making money like they did 30-40 years ago either. My grandfather started at Caterpillar in the early 70's (with no high school diploma) and made $14 an hour to start and when he retired he had a $3k a month pension plus Social Security. Today they bring people in at $14 an hour and they do not have the pensions they had back then. The cost of living is certainly more today than it was 30-40 year ago as well.

Today if you don't graduate from high school, you are lucky to find a job in fast food. Even with a high school diploma, one is lucky to find a job that pays even a little over minimum wage.

 

Because of union wages, those jobs have migrated to other countries. Think about it. The foreign manufacturers always build their plants in the southeast, where they pay a fair wage of around $18/hour for assembly workers.

The UAW has ran GM and Chrysler into the ground and forced them to shift work to the eastern countries and even build many of their parts in China.

But hey, Mcdonalds is hiring.

 

Many? Not really.
The feet on the street part of the job cannot be sent to India. Look at the number of these position that are in the Gov section alone, schools have 1 or 2 people at each location ( grade school, HS usually have 2 to 4 depending on the size ) doing this kind of job, that 30 years ago did not exist.

Call centers ( which are now circling back to the US due to quality issues after 2 decades of trying to make it work ) are bringing back those jobs.
Where does your call go now when you call AT&T for support on a DSL line ? NC or MO, not India. Cable companies ? US again.

How do you come to this conclusion ?
Is the economy issues based on not having manufacturing, or backed upon someone thinking a chicken in every pot, and a pot in every house ?

Due to not being cost competitive, those items could only be sold to very few places ( had to find a country that had a higher cost of manufacturing - wow the US was China back in the day for Europe ), and most people that worked in the factory could not afford the items they made.
In the early 70s people had very little, and things were not as great as most recall. This was prior to the OPEC embargo. Now most look back and call them the good old days, and in reality they were not that good.

That is exactly what I was getting at, and while the number of 8.00 jobs has grown, those jobs that pay 15-25 / hr have also grown.
Let's keep in mind a job paying minimum wage is not meant to be a living wage ( as most think it is today ), it is meant to stop one of the many things that made working prior to WW-I a nasty proposition in most cases ( people bidding for jobs, cutting the wages until the lowest bidder got it ). That is the real meaning of MINIMUM wage.

The concept that "back in the old days" things were better is a repeating story.
In the 80s, thing were better in the 70s.
In the 70s things were better in the 60s.
In the 60s, thing were better in the 50s.
Unless you hit a really bad time ( 30s, early 40s and that was not as bad as the 30s ) this is a repeating story, and depending on the year of the decade, was how much better is was prior.

If Cat was paying 28K / yr in the early 70s, your grandfather was making top income levels for the country. These were the ones that JFK made the Supply side tax cuts for ( 91% down to 70% ) in the 60s, he was what we called the ultra rich. That was 7x minimum wage, which I have to call BS on. That was a stupid amount of money, the lower executive staff might have made that much, but a guy on the production line ?

 

The reality is that the average UAW worker isn't making conserably more than the workers for the foreign manufacturers are making.

When we hear numbers being thrown around saying these guys are making $75k a year on average, that is deceptive. They are totalling all outlays for benefits and wages for past and current workers devided by the number of active workers.

Foreign manufacturers don't have near as many retirees so of course their numbers are considerably lower. In time, their legacy costs will go up as well because they will also have built up more retirees.

Are unions perfect? Of course not. Do they deserve the scorn they get by people...I don't think so. Union workers were once highly regarded and now the in fighting between the middle class has caused scorn. Are some union rules rediculous, yes...are all of them bad...no.

 

When you say that people in the 70's had very little, that isn't exactly true. Somethings we have today weren't invented back then so true there. Many people only had black and white TVs, computers were not common as many took up rooms, VCRs and microwave ovens were very expensive, etc.

Looking back on better times is the conservative ideology, isn't it?

In order to get those super high paying jobs, one needs a good education and a skill that others don't have. Short of maybe working the oil rigs or lobster boats, most people can't get high paying jobs with minimal skills and the desire to work really hard.

As far as minimum wages, many conservatives have argued about getting rid of them completely. That would put us in a good spot, huh? Back to working for a buck an hour!!!

As far as jobs coming back...not sure about that. Most of the time if I call for customer service I get someone from a land far far away. I hope they are bringing them back but I haven't seen much that way.

 

If you think this is the way it is, you really have no idea what the hell you are talking about.

 

Ok...if you are a high school drop out...what kind of jobs are you going to get that will allow you to make a solid middle class income?

What jobs can a high school graduate find out there that will give them a solid middle class income?

Ok...maybe if you have athletic skills beyond belief and can make it in professional sports but otherwise most people that are unskilled are lucky to have any job regardless of pay.