American capitalism gone with a whimper

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Old May 31, 2009 | 01:29 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by BHibbs
For the Record, I've been complaining about the Government (specifically the Executive) getting too much Power for the last 8 Years.

9/11 was used to give the government WAY too much power. First the patriot act, then their interpretation of Laws, secret prisons, etc. They acted like Republicans would be in charge of things forever. Now Pelosi and Obama have all the power...

I don't like ANYONE to have this much power. I want the government out of my business. They've been tapping Civilian phone lines and who knows what else under the guise of The War on Terror.

So what, anyone that has an AR15 at their home makes the "potential" terrorist list? Giving the government the right to spy on me with no real cause??

That's the kind of power the government's taken the last 8 years. If you were against it 5 years ago, you weren't an American or hated our troops.

Once they have the power, it's hard to get it back...

I always wonder why people are bragging about their guns. It is just asking for big brother to notice. IMHO
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 02:11 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by Wade06XLT
1) BHibbs, in reference to your first post, you want an explantion of Socialism? Ok, how is it Obama can fire the head of a PRIVATE OWNED car company? Gov't run health care? Citizens of the USA paying for all this bailout BS without being asked? Come on!

2) Your second post makes sense, but do you really think they are listening to "average joe's" phone calls? I'm all about them listening to anyone if they have hard evidence that they are doing something to threaten your childen's and mine's future. Speaking of our children. Are you aware that your kids kids are going to be paying off the current debt?

3) Bailouts are crap!!!!! Since when is a business/corporation to big to fail? If you or I, and anyone else here fails at something, do you think the government bails us out? Heck no. I say let GM and The People's Republik of Kalifornia fix their own problems.
I agree with most of that, but what is wrong with government run health care? Doesn't the UK and Canada have that? If the US were to gradually, but not completely start dealing with health care, then all those evil health insurance companies can go away. I'm also not saying that all health care should be government run, but basic health clinics could be, not cosmetic surgery offices. If you still want to go to a privately owned hospital then that's cool, you'd just be paying their fee's.
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 02:33 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by 4.6 Punisher
I agree with most of that, but what is wrong with government run health care? Doesn't the UK and Canada have that? If the US were to gradually, but not completely start dealing with health care, then all those evil health insurance companies can go away. I'm also not saying that all health care should be government run, but basic health clinics could be, not cosmetic surgery offices. If you still want to go to a privately owned hospital then that's cool, you'd just be paying their fee's.
I work at a hospital in the E.R. One of the doctors that works here on the weekends runs a government run healtch care facility that provides free or low cost health care to those who can't afford it. I was talking with her today and she was complaining about how people over abuse the system and are always wanting more for free. She told me about a specific incident with a female who wanted free blood pressure medicine. The doctor told her that she had given her a prescription that would cost $4 to fill at Wal Mart so maybe she should spend her money on that rather than cigarettes. The lady went on to cuss her out and tell her kids (while she was on the phone) that if she died they were to sue the doctor and the hospital.

I went on to talk more about govt. ran health care with the doctor (who is a big Obama supporter) and asked her if she though it would make regular doctor visits more expedient for the patients. She said no.

I asked her if she thought she would be able to spend the proper time and have "patients" rather than just numbers if govt. ran health care. She said no.

I asked her if we would maintain the same level of progress made in the medical field for the last 20 years if govt. ran health care. She said no.

I asked her if she had changed her position on govt. ran health care (which she supported very strongly not too long ago this year) and she said she did.

That's why the govt. shouldn't run health care. It stops advancements in technology used to keep us alive and healthy. It lets the government decide if we need treatment to cure a disease (ie. Chemo for cancer) based upon our age and what they see as fit. No one should decide that but myself or my family.

Health care is not a right, it wasn't written in the constitution. If American got their friggin priorities straight and stopped spending all this money on frivilous things and saved then we probably wouldn't be in this pickle.
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 02:35 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by Wade06XLT
1) BHibbs, in reference to your first post, you want an explantion of Socialism? Ok, how is it Obama can fire the head of a PRIVATE OWNED car company? Gov't run health care? Citizens of the USA paying for all this bailout BS without being asked? Come on!

2) Your second post makes sense, but do you really think they are listening to "average joe's" phone calls? I'm all about them listening to anyone if they have hard evidence that they are doing something to threaten your childen's and mine's future. Speaking of our children. Are you aware that your kids kids are going to be paying off the current debt?

3) Bailouts are crap!!!!! Since when is a business/corporation to big to fail? If you or I, and anyone else here fails at something, do you think the government bails us out? Heck no. I say let GM and The People's Republik of Kalifornia fix their own problems.

3)
I was Totally against Bush's Bail out plan:

I think my letter says it all (written September 30, 2008):

Representative Murtha,

I would like to urge you to Vote AGAINST the Bail Out Bill presented by President Bush's Administration.

I realize there may be some tough times ahead but I as an American am prepared to endure these hardships while the Markets go through their much needed re-adjustments.

700 Billion dollars is just TOO much money. I would rather have the burden placed on Myself and experience the economic down turn, than have my Children pay down our Deficits later.

Sincerely,


You're worried about the few billion we gave GM?? What about the TRILLION we've given the banks!!

YES, if there is Real reason to spy on someone, get the warrants and follow the law. Cheney and Bush have been getting around this for years now. I suspect Obama and Pelosi are doing it now... Be careful what you say out there, they are listening.... Way too much power...

Again, these are complaints I've been making for YEARS now but was called "unAmerican", or a "Liberal non-troop supporter". Now the SAME stuff is going on, but with a Democrat in office and it's Socialism and Marxism.

I wish the sheep would have opened their eyes 5 years ago and said something then. The Power's already lost. The Money's been spent.

Obama "Says" he for a more transparent government. Only time will tell...
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 03:02 PM
  #35  
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Houstonfour: thank you for that post,,,exactly why we don't need gov't run health care. Guys, think about it,,this president of ours has (with our money) bought a car company and is thinking about buying California w/YOUR money! Yes, Bush didn't help anything w/the housing market buyouts either. Politicians, all of them, have forgotten what public service is!!!!!

Folks, Democrats WANT you to depend on them. They want you to think that they are going to take care of you. If socialized medicine goes into effect it's one more step to Socialism.

I'll say it again, WE THE PEOPLE need to rescue ourselves and this country of ours. If we don't do something we are all gonna be in deep kimshi.
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 03:05 PM
  #36  
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It has been brought to my attention by a fellow member of the resistance (via a secure land line) that I may have incorrectly used the word “comrade” in my previous post. I informed my contact that I had checked on proper usage in a draft copy (leaked to me) of an upcoming booklet from the new Democratic Party for Freedom of Oppressed Peoples entitled “Proper Words, Phrases and Definitions for the Glorious New United States of America.”

The booklet has a foreword by Nancy Peosi. She would have written more of the booklet, but she is busy with two other writings at this time. One is the New Constitution of the United States of America. (Nancy’s staff discovered that the original Constitution “was written by a bunch of white males who couldn’t possibly have been inclusive of other points of view.”) Therefore, Nancy and her staff is busy re-writing the document to bring it into the 21st century. The other document is a new national anthem (needed for similar reasons) with lyrics in the more proper Spanish language. An English translation will be available at a later date.

So, should any of you have concerns about proper words, phrases and definitions, in the future, this new booklet should come in might handy. Then again, if you truly believe in the current Constitution of the United States (as written), you should probably forget the whole thing.
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 03:54 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by Wade06XLT
Folks, Democrats WANT you to depend on them. They want you to think that they are going to take care of you. If socialized medicine goes into effect it's one more step to Socialism.

I'll say it again, WE THE PEOPLE need to rescue ourselves and this country of ours. If we don't do something we are all gonna be in deep kimshi.
Depending on someone for something gives them power and control. You'll do what I say to get what you want or you will go without it.
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 09:33 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by houston_four
Depending on someone for something gives them power and control. You'll do what I say to get what you want or you will go without it.
That sounds rational to me but when I read BHibbs argument about how Bush and Cheney had too much power when they protected the country from terrorists, it confuses me.

So, we depended on the federal government to protect us from terrorists and we did what they wanted or we'd go without protection? Obama is doing the same thing only he's protecting the poor from having less than the non-poor? See how it's a little confusing?

Protecting the life and liberty of the American people. Making sure that everyone has an equil amount. These are both jobs of our elected representatives?
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 11:25 PM
  #39  
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At the root of it all is the international bankers. They run the show, and have conspired against America since it's inception. The snowball is growing...
 
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Old May 31, 2009 | 11:53 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by wittom
That sounds rational to me but when I read BHibbs argument about how Bush and Cheney had too much power when they protected the country from terrorists, it confuses me.

So, we depended on the federal government to protect us from terrorists and we did what they wanted or we'd go without protection? Obama is doing the same thing only he's protecting the poor from having less than the non-poor? See how it's a little confusing?

Protecting the life and liberty of the American people. Making sure that everyone has an equil amount. These are both jobs of our elected representatives?
I understand what they are saying about the wire taps etc... via the Patriot Act. In reality, how does it really effect you and I? For me...it doesn't. I don't do anything wrong and I have no reason to worry about who know what I say on the telephone....are they going to go tell my wife?

I also don't agree with what Bush started with the bail outs. It's not the job of our government to bail companies out and declare a private corporation, "Too big to fail".
 
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Old Jun 1, 2009 | 12:26 AM
  #41  
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Bailing out failing companies proves 2 things IMO

1) The concept of capitalism is failing by the way our nations leaders has handled it.
2) It rewards failure, if you grow too big you won't be allowed to fail.

Mopar, back when the dinosaurs were roaming around the earth was bailed out, then the airlines way back when as well. These companies should have failed long ago due to their incompetence, their failure to plan ahead, and failure to provide a service/product that people actually want. AMC failed because no one wanted their cars, the Tucker car failed, why can't the banks, Chrysler, and GM fail?

The way I see it, you can't buy your way out of an economic recession. You have to get over it and work through it, or fight in a war to boost and stimulate the economy. N. Korea sounds like the new **** Germany to me. I think that would be a pleasant little war to get out of all this mess.
 
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Old Jun 1, 2009 | 07:01 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by 4.6 Punisher
Bailing out failing companies proves 2 things IMO

1) The concept of capitalism is failing by the way our nations leaders has handled it.
2) It rewards failure, if you grow too big you won't be allowed to fail.

Mopar, back when the dinosaurs were roaming around the earth was bailed out, then the airlines way back when as well. These companies should have failed long ago due to their incompetence, their failure to plan ahead, and failure to provide a service/product that people actually want. AMC failed because no one wanted their cars, the Tucker car failed, why can't the banks, Chrysler, and GM fail?

The way I see it, you can't buy your way out of an economic recession. You have to get over it and work through it, or fight in a war to boost and stimulate the economy. N. Korea sounds like the new **** Germany to me. I think that would be a pleasant little war to get out of all this mess.
It's an economic cycle. When the Real Estate Bubble started and these banks got greedy and started bundling high risk mortgages it when it turned bad. We are going to have ups and downs and we were way over due for a down. So it's going to be tough, people are going to lose jobs and companies are going to fail. Putting your finger in the pot trying to fix it is only going to make it worse. People don't see that though
 
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Old Jun 1, 2009 | 07:30 AM
  #43  
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on the way into work this morning i heard that the income tax revenue is down 44% as compared to the same time of one year ago. they said that it is due to unemployment and the hiding of income by those that have the ability to do so. i assume they were referring to cash businesses and the ones that are wealthy enough to move it off shore.

so based on that, how can this governmet sustain itself and the rate at which it is spending?
 
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Old Jun 1, 2009 | 07:33 AM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by 4.6 Punisher
Bailing out failing companies proves 2 things IMO

1) The concept of capitalism is failing by the way our nations leaders has handled it.
2) It rewards failure, if you grow too big you won't be allowed to fail.
The failure isn't capitalism. The failure is our elected representatives inability to responsibly handle the tax payers money. The failure is our elected representatives inability to accurately represent the people who elect them.

Capitalism doesn't reward failure. Our elected representatives have choosen to reward failure with OUR MONEY. Not just "too big to fail" either. They are also proping up the bottom by pulling us down, closer to it.

Which system do you think is better for the American people?

Originally Posted by Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary
capitalism

: an economic system characterized by private or corporate ownership of capital goods, by investments that are determined by private decision, and by prices, production, and the distribution of goods that are determined mainly by competition in a free market
Originally Posted by Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary
socialism

1: any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods
2 a: a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b: a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state
3: a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done
Whether an American believes that the government gained excessive powers under the guise of protecting the people from terrorists threats or that the government is gaining excessive powers under the guise of saving a cyclical economy, the answer is for the American people to take the government back from the people who have devoted their lifes work to gaining excessive powers. If more of us just took a little more of our time to understand what the founding fathers envisioned for our country and a little more time paying attention to what our elected representatives are actually doing, we might be able to elect people who are interested in serving the people.
 
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Old Jun 1, 2009 | 07:43 AM
  #45  
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Goovnoh Pravda!
 
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