Hey all, I have a few questions...

Im an infrequent offroader. I try to get the beast out on a backroad about once a month to keep the gears lubed. Today we got hit with almost 15" of snow, so I used 4X4 and 4Lo a good bit.

1) My 4Lo when engaging from Neutral, shifts in and out a couple of times then locks (thats when I shift into drive). Anyone else have this? After it gets warmed up, I can shift into 4Lo from Neutral and it sticks.

2)Is it ok to drive around in the snow for a while with 4X4 on? This was on all no traction surfaces. I no better than to keep it on, on a clear street or highway. Im just wondering if when you guys head offroad, do you set it in 4X4 and go until you head back out to the street?

3)Spinning in 4X4...got stuck in the snow and tried rocking back and forth. Wound up spinning some and heard this was bad. When it would spin, Id let off the gas and the tires would slow down then 'jolt' the truck as they got stuck in the snow again. Any advice?

I do baby my truck, so I want to make sure I give the 4X4 a good work out without blowing a seal or anything. Thanks!

------------------
The Truck: 1997 Black F-150 Flareside. Regular Cab ORP and Towing Package
The Mods: K&N Filter, Eurolid Hard Tonneau, Profile Windstream Side Deflectors and Ford Bug Deflector.
The Site:
Triton's 4.6 Liter Web Page
www.mindspring.com/~acbradley/index.html

 

Triton46
I too am a in-frequent off roader. I am a Hang Glider pilot so most of my off road time is spent driving up to our mountain launch sites. I do however live in Calgary Alberta, so snow is not very rare in the winter months. I have fun sliding my truck around in the snow in 2 and 4 wheel drive. It is very entertaining to do so in 4hi since you can steer with the trottle as well as pick you exit line. Here are my comments on you questions (IMHO only of course).

1)I too have noticed a delay/re-attempt when shifting into 4lo, it may be attempting to allign some splines (tech folks is this correct?)
2)As far as I'm cocerned it's no problem to drive around in the snow in 4hi. I do it freqeuntly. The problem with driving in the dry is when you need to turn the 4 tires will all have a different radius of cornering and therfore will all want to go at a different speed. (the fastest will be the outside front wheel since it makes the widest arc. etc.) The side to side speed differences are mostly manageable but the transfer case has little or no provisions for the front to rear speed differnetial. The stress can be enourmous and the tire traction and gear parts will have a tug-o-war over who will give in. Expensive gamble!
3)Spinning in moderation is no problem. I am assuming you had 1 front wheel and 1 rear wheel spinning 'cause you don't have LS or... you exceeded the slip traction ratio. I'm ready to be corrected but here is my understanding of spinning: Ever see the 'Meathead' in a car on snow or ice with his foot on the floor thinking he is going to spin his way out of a stuck situation? He looks down and sees the speedo reading 60mph. Since his differential is only applying power to 1 wheel (the other is likely stopped) the actual wheel/tire speed it DOUBLE the speedometer reading. If he gets traction, the car would lunge forward as the wheel would like to continue 120 mph but the inertial mass of the car will prevent that so... the tire, wheel, diff, transmission, engine will be treated to a rather rude experience to put it politely.
When you get stuck, try what I do, turn the wheel and try to move the truck sideways as well as forward/reverse. Our trucks are heavy so the more space you can make for building some momemtum, the grater your chances for getting out.
Best of luck, and have fun!
Bruce
ps. If anything I have said is incorrect and/or harmful, pls post so I can correct it thanx.

 

HEY!! Im no Meathead!!

Thanks Bruce, thats exactly what I was looking for. I did have to do a tight turn in 4Lo on snow and was a little worried about the stress (only way to get out of where I was). I hardly ever use 4X4. I had one of the first Explorers with push button 4X4, and it stopped working after three years. To this day, it still doesnt have 4X4 so I wont to use it so I dont lose it. Thanks!

------------------
The Truck: 1997 Black F-150 Flareside. Regular Cab ORP and Towing Package
The Mods: K&N Filter, Eurolid Hard Tonneau, Profile Windstream Side Deflectors and Ford Bug Deflector.
The Site:
Triton's 4.6 Liter Web Page
www.mindspring.com/~acbradley/index.html

 

Not trying to flame ya Bruce but the reading on the speedometer is what one, both or all are spinning. Your speedometer hooks to the transmission and measures RPM's to the driveshaft and converts that to MPH. It has no way of knowing how many have traction or are spinning.

------------------
Red 99.5 Lightning,
#0975,
Born 5/6/99...Adopted 5/27/99
Chipped w/SuperChip Flipchip chip,
PSP Filter(track untested),
Water Wetter,
Mobil 1,
Foglamp Covers,
13.573@101.08

 

No flame taken! The reason I know this to be true (or at least used to be) is... a LONG time ago a High School auto shop teacher expalined and then demonstrated this fact. This might be hard/impossible to do by hand if you have LS but...
You can duplicate this experiment:
Put the truck in neutral,
Chock the front wheels,
Jack 1 rear wheel of your truck into the air (Leaving the other firmly on the ground). Turn the lifted wheel or the driveshaft and pay close attention to the ratio. ie if you normally have a 3.55:1 You will notice that instead of taking 3.55 rotations of the driveshaft to make 1 tire rotation... the tire will make 1 complete rotation in 1.775 driveshaft rotations.
The other way to do this is to jack the whole rearend of the truck, turn the drivesahft so both tires turn then have someone hold one tire so that it will not turn. Then watch as the free wheel doubles in it's speed.
Since you are correct about the speedometer sensing point being the transmission and the driveshaft is nothing more than an extention of that transmission's output shaft, a wheel that is spinning will be going at TWICE the indicated speed (Providing the other wheel is stopped).
I think the biggest danger in such a condition is tire damage due to the speed exceeding it's "Speed rating" and therefore being perminently damaged.
Bruce
Holy cow I'm a long winded bugger! Sorry!

------------------
'97 F-150 Lariat,4.6, S/C, 4X4, SB, 17"wheels, no mods.

 

I understand your instructions for duplication but how/why does the single tire increase spin rate?

------------------
Red 99.5 Lightning,
#0975,
Born 5/6/99...Adopted 5/27/99
Chipped w/SuperChip Flipchip chip,
PSP Filter(track untested),
Water Wetter,
Mobil 1,
Foglamp Covers,
13.573@101.08

 

Hey thanks for all the help guys! Ive been out 4wheelin almost everyday this week (whether I wanted to or not).

Last night I got stuck turning through a snow covered back road. I switched to 4hi and tried to turn but all four wheels began to spin. I let off the gas and as the wheels slowed down the front two made a click, click, click. Didnt sound like a metallic grinding, just like a card in a bicycle spoke. Anyone know what this is?

------------------
The Truck: 1997 Black F-150 Flareside. Regular Cab ORP and Towing Package
The Mods: K&N Filter, Eurolid Hard Tonneau, Profile Windstream Side Deflectors and Ford Bug Deflector.
The Site:
Triton's 4.6 Liter Web Page
www.mindspring.com/~acbradley/index.html

 

Not a clue, but I think it's all natural. I wouldn't worry, mine makes weird sounds too sometimes when I'm out playin. Now have you ever been drivin down the road and went to change the a/c **** and changed the 4hi **** instead? That will make you sweat a little bit, especially when you are crusin at 75. But I caught myself when I did it. If I could do it all over again, I would have gotten the floor shift. Because I've heard of other people doin it too.

------------------

Patrick aka Mudder Arlington Texas (DFW), member and V.P. of Fordified.
Stone Cold edition F150 ®, Black 98 Styleside S/C F150 4x4 0RP 5.4 3.55ls, Ramsey Pro 8000 hidden winch, Grizzly roll bar, Superwhite Bulbs, 2 Baja lights, 8 165 watt KC Daylighters, 4 chrome, 4 black (I come alive at night), Manik grille guard, Westin step bars, Rhino Taillight guards (thanks Pony), Magnum bug shield, Sonic aluminum treadplate 36" tool box, Flowmaster 40 series dual exhaust, K/N air filter, 265/75/16 BFG AT/S, American Racing Baja wheels, Cobra CB radio with 3' whip antenna, Escort Laser/Radar detector, Nokia cell phone, a Mobil Speed Pass on the back window, a F150 Online sticker, and a Stone Cold sticker on the front windshield, and yes, I also have been infected with the door crack . More to come for the Daylighting machine: shocks, and Airaid. If you would like to see pics, email me at mudder46@hotmail.com or see pics at me and pony's website www.angelfire.com/ok3/ponysix8, and to hear the Flowmaster exhaust http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/ponysix8/images/T005.wav
Mr.Daylighter "Go ahead, flash your brights at me, see what happens"
Also the Moderator of the Ford Trucks vs. GM trucks forum over on fordvschevy.com so check it out.




[This message has been edited by mudder (edited 01-31-2000).]

 

4DR THNDR:
Sorry for the delay of my reply.
I think the reason for the increased 1 wheel speed has something to do with the spider gears on the diff. If I'm right, these smaller gears allow for a simotainius (sp?)increase in outer wheel speed and a decrease in inner wheel speed while cornering. This helps the truck turn whithout increasing or decreasing the speed.
If 1 wheel was directly connected to the ring gear while the other just freewheeled along (ie no connection), the truck would change speeds depending on which way it was turning.
eg. if the drivers side wheel was connected and the pass wheel was passive the truck would increase in speed while turning left and decrease in speed turning right due to it's variations in the rear wheel path's radial arc.
When they are both connected through the spider gear arrangement, the power is applied under normal conditions to both wheels during all modes of driving including cornering.
When 1 wheel loses complete traction and the other has good traction the spider gears react as though the truck is attemping a very sharp turn and therfore increases the spinning (and presummed "outside") wheel by the exact and opposite velocity that the stopped (and presummed "inside") wheel is slowed.
Does this make sense?
It does to me but I wrote it! It has been a while since I have peered into the inner workings of a diff but I seem to remember it's make-up and function.
Attn: Gear heads did I get it right?
Bruce

------------------
'97 F-150 Lariat,4.6, S/C, 4X4, SB, 17"wheels, no mods.

 

Hey guys, have you tried shifting out of drive and into "2" when you are losing traction? It lets you start off in second gear with less wheel spin. In "2" you start in second and stay in second. On a "Shevie" when in "2" it starts in low and shift into second, another reason FORD is better.

I have a steep driveway up to my garage, and with the recent ice/snow here I was able to drive up with no spinning in 4x4 high and "2".

Also when you get stuck, start off in 4x4 low, shift into "2" and cut the front wheels hard one way or the other. This lets the lugs on the tire side walls dig in for traction. I also shift to 4x4 once a month or so to keep the diff's lubricated to avoid trouble.

------------------
Mine: '97F150,XLT,SC,4x4 ORP,4.6L,3.55LS,17" ORP wheels w/265/70/17,auto,6 CD,Towing package,alarm,Rhino grill guard w/PICCA lights,dual exhaust.

Wife: '99Explorer Limited,pearl white/tan leather,4.0L,4:10LS,CD,sunroof,towing pkg.,alarm

 

Living in a cold weather area it may be best to change all the driveline fluids to synthetic. I have and the difference is noticable. synthetic oil flows better and provides extra protection. I too have used 4hi to and from work. That's a 60 mile round trip with no problems. sometimes snow can be fun!

Henry.

------------------
99 F-150 XL 4x4. RC Flareside 4.6 5spd, 3.55LS. gibson 3" cat-back, K&N Gen ll.Westin step bars.Ventshade window deflectors and bug deflector. rhino liner and a cool white shifter ball.

 

Triton46,

1- Something is wrong with it. The electric shift motor is probably not properly engaging the reduction shift fork properly. This can de caused by a faulty 4x4 selector switch, Neutral safety switch, Brake switch, transmission range sensor or T-Case mechanism (I would suspect the shift motor is faulty/needs adjustment). If all the other freatures of your truck function properly I would suspect either the 4x4 switch or the Shift motor.

2- When I go off road I usually leave it in 4x4, but it depends on the surface. I go in and out of 4Hi as I see fit. I have the manual shift on the fly so I can pull the lever to 4Lo while the truck is moving (not too fast) as long as I press the clutch. In slow or very sticky situations I use 4Lo to save on the POS clutch that comes with the POS tranny.

3- Depending on how fast the tires stop it could damage the drive train. I never heard of tires sticking in snow bad enough to jolt the drivetrain. Are you sure they are sticking in "Snow"?

Regards

Jean Marc Chartier

------------------
00 F-150 XLT SC Flairside 4x4 4.6 w/5spd
Warn XD9000i, skid plates, Draw tite class III,
Rancho RSX Reflex shocks,
SmittyBilt Nerfs, Borla Cat Back
Modified Air Cleaner Outlet Tube,
Superchips