Envoy Forum?
Originally Posted by signmaster
You do understand that being a general discussion area, even on a Ford forum, doesn't mean we all own nothing but Fords right?
Let's see, more room than the Escape, more HP than the Escape, more towing capacity than the Escape, more creature comforts than the Escape, better warranty, and better fit and finish.
Other than the fact they they cheat people out of two cylinders by using an I6 that makes almost the HP of the 5.4s of the same years, I'm not seeing the down side here.
Let's see, more room than the Escape, more HP than the Escape, more towing capacity than the Escape, more creature comforts than the Escape, better warranty, and better fit and finish.
Other than the fact they they cheat people out of two cylinders by using an I6 that makes almost the HP of the 5.4s of the same years, I'm not seeing the down side here.

So, I think the Ford....I mean "Mazda" Escape is also a P.O.S.
The sad thing is you compared the Snailblazer to an Escape, now that's just too bad, gimme' an Exploder any day. As far as fit and finish, that is where GM has failed miserably, those things rattle and shake inside like there was an earthquake right under the tires, and handle like a giant brick on two rubberbands, (Thank you Toyota), and if you have to remove a trim panel, God forbid, good luck, it'll rattle more than before. At least Ford has the sense to realize there Might be a need to remove a panel some day and make the job a pleasure, well, maybee not a pleasure but you get the point. I'm sorry, but GM has gone the cheap route on everything they make, but to sell them they give them "more Horsepower", which isn't that impressive anyway, but they have always used that claim to take attention away from all the poor body designs they have, and don't get me started on Cadillac, Oh please. (If I had to though, I'll still take the Escape over a Snailblazer anyway).As far as that I6 thing goes, that is the biggest P.O.S. engine made, (besides any Mitsubishi engine). I could care less if it had 200hp more than Fords whole line of engines combined, it still is a rickety, noisey and overall unreliable hunk of Iron and Aluminum I have ever had the displeasure of working on. All of this my friend, "Is" the downside. You should have stuck with the 5.3L, at least it is "semi-reliable". That is until you have to replace the whole intake manifold at 20,000 mi. or water pumps at 75,000 mi. or develop misfires from defective rockers and burned valves from bad COP's and incorrect computer programs. They should have stuck with the good 'ol 5.7L, now there was a descent engine (for a Chevy anyway)
.P.S. Yes this is all my opinion, and I'm not trying to slam GM......Oh wait, yes I am, but that doesn't matter anyway, all in good fun, but seriously. Have a good day my brother.
Originally Posted by LUKE_DUKE
Tumba,
Did you get the help you needed from the site?
Did you get the help you needed from the site?
Thanks! I'll let you know
Originally Posted by TECHDOC
True that, I have owned a GM or two before, and the "G" does stand for General afterall.
So, I think the Ford....I mean "Mazda" Escape is also a P.O.S.
The sad thing is you compared the Snailblazer to an Escape, now that's just too bad, gimme' an Exploder any day. As far as fit and finish, that is where GM has failed miserably, those things rattle and shake inside like there was an earthquake right under the tires, and handle like a giant brick on two rubberbands, (Thank you Toyota), and if you have to remove a trim panel, God forbid, good luck, it'll rattle more than before. At least Ford has the sense to realize there Might be a need to remove a panel some day and make the job a pleasure, well, maybee not a pleasure but you get the point. I'm sorry, but GM has gone the cheap route on everything they make, but to sell them they give them "more Horsepower", which isn't that impressive anyway, but they have always used that claim to take attention away from all the poor body designs they have, and don't get me started on Cadillac, Oh please. (If I had to though, I'll still take the Escape over a Snailblazer anyway).
As far as that I6 thing goes, that is the biggest P.O.S. engine made, (besides any Mitsubishi engine). I could care less if it had 200hp more than Fords whole line of engines combined, it still is a rickety, noisey and overall unreliable hunk of Iron and Aluminum I have ever had the displeasure of working on. All of this my friend, "Is" the downside. You should have stuck with the 5.3L, at least it is "semi-reliable". That is until you have to replace the whole intake manifold at 20,000 mi. or water pumps at 75,000 mi. or develop misfires from defective rockers and burned valves from bad COP's and incorrect computer programs. They should have stuck with the good 'ol 5.7L, now there was a descent engine (for a Chevy anyway)
.
P.S. Yes this is all my opinion, and I'm not trying to slam GM......Oh wait, yes I am, but that doesn't matter anyway, all in good fun, but seriously. Have a good day my brother.
So, I think the Ford....I mean "Mazda" Escape is also a P.O.S.
The sad thing is you compared the Snailblazer to an Escape, now that's just too bad, gimme' an Exploder any day. As far as fit and finish, that is where GM has failed miserably, those things rattle and shake inside like there was an earthquake right under the tires, and handle like a giant brick on two rubberbands, (Thank you Toyota), and if you have to remove a trim panel, God forbid, good luck, it'll rattle more than before. At least Ford has the sense to realize there Might be a need to remove a panel some day and make the job a pleasure, well, maybee not a pleasure but you get the point. I'm sorry, but GM has gone the cheap route on everything they make, but to sell them they give them "more Horsepower", which isn't that impressive anyway, but they have always used that claim to take attention away from all the poor body designs they have, and don't get me started on Cadillac, Oh please. (If I had to though, I'll still take the Escape over a Snailblazer anyway).As far as that I6 thing goes, that is the biggest P.O.S. engine made, (besides any Mitsubishi engine). I could care less if it had 200hp more than Fords whole line of engines combined, it still is a rickety, noisey and overall unreliable hunk of Iron and Aluminum I have ever had the displeasure of working on. All of this my friend, "Is" the downside. You should have stuck with the 5.3L, at least it is "semi-reliable". That is until you have to replace the whole intake manifold at 20,000 mi. or water pumps at 75,000 mi. or develop misfires from defective rockers and burned valves from bad COP's and incorrect computer programs. They should have stuck with the good 'ol 5.7L, now there was a descent engine (for a Chevy anyway)
.P.S. Yes this is all my opinion, and I'm not trying to slam GM......Oh wait, yes I am, but that doesn't matter anyway, all in good fun, but seriously. Have a good day my brother.

What was really sad what that his little 3 year old girl somehow broke one of the rear seats for reclining and sliced her hand open because of faulty engineering.
He's got a 4Runner now, and it's been no winner either. His wife has went through 2, yes 2, Toyota Sienna minivans... before switching to a Freestar minivan with the 4.2l v6, and she hasn't had a problem yet.
Then look at my F150... I haven't had one bad day with it. NEVER. I don't plan to. So... who's really more reliable? Ford, hands down.
Thanks for the replies.
Ilike Ford much better than any other manufacturer. I always let my wife choose her car herself is why we have an Envoy. I think she bought it just to irritate me. I t has been a good auto, FORD just fits me better.
For my kids I always build them a Ford. Gave my last F150 to my 16 year old boy. He has been driving it for a year now and had less problems than when I drove it
I'll see what gas prices are going to do before I build myself another one..
Ilike Ford much better than any other manufacturer. I always let my wife choose her car herself is why we have an Envoy. I think she bought it just to irritate me. I t has been a good auto, FORD just fits me better.
For my kids I always build them a Ford. Gave my last F150 to my 16 year old boy. He has been driving it for a year now and had less problems than when I drove it
I'll see what gas prices are going to do before I build myself another one..
Originally Posted by TECHDOC
True that, I have owned a GM or two before, and the "G" does stand for General afterall.
So, I think the Ford....I mean "Mazda" Escape is also a P.O.S.
The sad thing is you compared the Snailblazer to an Escape, now that's just too bad, gimme' an Exploder any day. As far as fit and finish, that is where GM has failed miserably, those things rattle and shake inside like there was an earthquake right under the tires, and handle like a giant brick on two rubberbands, (Thank you Toyota), and if you have to remove a trim panel, God forbid, good luck, it'll rattle more than before. At least Ford has the sense to realize there Might be a need to remove a panel some day and make the job a pleasure, well, maybee not a pleasure but you get the point. I'm sorry, but GM has gone the cheap route on everything they make, but to sell them they give them "more Horsepower", which isn't that impressive anyway, but they have always used that claim to take attention away from all the poor body designs they have, and don't get me started on Cadillac, Oh please. (If I had to though, I'll still take the Escape over a Snailblazer anyway).
As far as that I6 thing goes, that is the biggest P.O.S. engine made, (besides any Mitsubishi engine). I could care less if it had 200hp more than Fords whole line of engines combined, it still is a rickety, noisey and overall unreliable hunk of Iron and Aluminum I have ever had the displeasure of working on. All of this my friend, "Is" the downside. You should have stuck with the 5.3L, at least it is "semi-reliable". That is until you have to replace the whole intake manifold at 20,000 mi. or water pumps at 75,000 mi. or develop misfires from defective rockers and burned valves from bad COP's and incorrect computer programs. They should have stuck with the good 'ol 5.7L, now there was a descent engine (for a Chevy anyway)
.
P.S. Yes this is all my opinion, and I'm not trying to slam GM......Oh wait, yes I am, but that doesn't matter anyway, all in good fun, but seriously. Have a good day my brother.
So, I think the Ford....I mean "Mazda" Escape is also a P.O.S.
The sad thing is you compared the Snailblazer to an Escape, now that's just too bad, gimme' an Exploder any day. As far as fit and finish, that is where GM has failed miserably, those things rattle and shake inside like there was an earthquake right under the tires, and handle like a giant brick on two rubberbands, (Thank you Toyota), and if you have to remove a trim panel, God forbid, good luck, it'll rattle more than before. At least Ford has the sense to realize there Might be a need to remove a panel some day and make the job a pleasure, well, maybee not a pleasure but you get the point. I'm sorry, but GM has gone the cheap route on everything they make, but to sell them they give them "more Horsepower", which isn't that impressive anyway, but they have always used that claim to take attention away from all the poor body designs they have, and don't get me started on Cadillac, Oh please. (If I had to though, I'll still take the Escape over a Snailblazer anyway).As far as that I6 thing goes, that is the biggest P.O.S. engine made, (besides any Mitsubishi engine). I could care less if it had 200hp more than Fords whole line of engines combined, it still is a rickety, noisey and overall unreliable hunk of Iron and Aluminum I have ever had the displeasure of working on. All of this my friend, "Is" the downside. You should have stuck with the 5.3L, at least it is "semi-reliable". That is until you have to replace the whole intake manifold at 20,000 mi. or water pumps at 75,000 mi. or develop misfires from defective rockers and burned valves from bad COP's and incorrect computer programs. They should have stuck with the good 'ol 5.7L, now there was a descent engine (for a Chevy anyway)
.P.S. Yes this is all my opinion, and I'm not trying to slam GM......Oh wait, yes I am, but that doesn't matter anyway, all in good fun, but seriously. Have a good day my brother.

I have owned mostly GM cars, one Chryler product (Eagle Talon) that i would never own another Dodge product again. The F150 has been pretty good to me, just one problem with carbon buildup on the T.B. causing CEL light to come on. I just turned 100,000 this week on her....
Originally Posted by LUKE_DUKE
Tumba,
Did you get the help you needed from the site?
Did you get the help you needed from the site?
Thanks for the URL !
I found exactly what I was looking for, and also saw a couple of user names from this site how about that!
Originally Posted by signmaster
I've found a couple, but never looking for anything specific really.
www.trailvoy.com seems to be decent
There are more active users on there right now than there are on here.
www.trailvoy.com seems to be decent
There are more active users on there right now than there are on here.

I didn't find that site using Meta tags!
Guees I have to much ford in me
Originally Posted by LUKE_DUKE
I had a 2000 Trans Am before my F150... LS-1 with a 6 speed. A lot of other guys complained of piston slap on start-up, excessive oil usage. I never had either problem. Put 88,000 miles on her, most of it hard, never used oil, never made a peep. Only time i ever had a problem, a plastic bag got sucked into one of the electric fans and burned it up. Car got hot, took it to the dealer, they replaced the fan. Car had dozens of 1/4 miles passes, ran as consistent as my crappy self could run 13.5 1/4 miles.... I would take that car back in a second. Should have never sold it....
I have owned mostly GM cars, one Chryler product (Eagle Talon) that i would never own another Dodge product again. The F150 has been pretty good to me, just one problem with carbon buildup on the T.B. causing CEL light to come on. I just turned 100,000 this week on her....
I have owned mostly GM cars, one Chryler product (Eagle Talon) that i would never own another Dodge product again. The F150 has been pretty good to me, just one problem with carbon buildup on the T.B. causing CEL light to come on. I just turned 100,000 this week on her....
Originally Posted by TECHDOC
Yeah, my friend had an 01' and loved it, no probs etc..... Whatever, I say drive what you want and I'll fix'em when it breaks.


As for the Explorer, it was overpriced, boring, and lacking in comparison. I suggested to my wife to not even bother looking at it. They are catching up some though. 2 years, 2 cylinders, and some displacement later, they are up to the same output that "POS" I6 made a couple years back.
Originally Posted by signmaster
Doubtful. "Technicians" that struggle with simple items such as trim pieces are the reason our vehicles rarely even drive past a dealership. Hell my 8 year old helped me put trim pieces back on after some audio install... and they didn't rattle.
As for the Explorer, it was overpriced, boring, and lacking in comparison. I suggested to my wife to not even bother looking at it. They are catching up some though. 2 years, 2 cylinders, and some displacement later, they are up to the same output that "POS" I6 made a couple years back.
As for the Explorer, it was overpriced, boring, and lacking in comparison. I suggested to my wife to not even bother looking at it. They are catching up some though. 2 years, 2 cylinders, and some displacement later, they are up to the same output that "POS" I6 made a couple years back.
Well, thats true, an 8 year old probably designed those silly "cars"(they sure look like it)
. Now you just said your vehicles rarely pass a dealership, mine always pass them just fine, thats what I mean about those POS's, It's too bad you just don't know enough to actually see the flaws those things have, but hey, no one said you have to see them for what they are, just buy'em and fix'em. I thank you for supporting the boom in the repair business G.M. trucks have brought to the repair industry.Sorry I gave you so much hassle about your General Mess.....I mean General Motors product
, The main thing is if you are happy with it, that's what matters. I felt like messing around a little.
Originally Posted by TECHDOC
You can slam us Technicians all you want, but hey, when you need us we are always here regardles of what rip-off, under trained place you may go to, and you would be lost without us and this site.
Well, thats true, an 8 year old probably designed those silly "cars"(they sure look like it)
. Now you just said your vehicles rarely pass a dealership, mine always pass them just fine, thats what I mean about those POS's, It's too bad you just don't know enough to actually see the flaws those things have, but hey, no one said you have to see them for what they are, just buy'em and fix'em. I thank you for supporting the boom in the repair business G.M. trucks have brought to the repair industry.
Sorry I gave you so much hassle about your General Mess.....I mean General Motors product
, The main thing is if you are happy with it, that's what matters. I felt like messing around a little.
Well, thats true, an 8 year old probably designed those silly "cars"(they sure look like it)
. Now you just said your vehicles rarely pass a dealership, mine always pass them just fine, thats what I mean about those POS's, It's too bad you just don't know enough to actually see the flaws those things have, but hey, no one said you have to see them for what they are, just buy'em and fix'em. I thank you for supporting the boom in the repair business G.M. trucks have brought to the repair industry.Sorry I gave you so much hassle about your General Mess.....I mean General Motors product
, The main thing is if you are happy with it, that's what matters. I felt like messing around a little.Being I can handle it all myself, I don't have to worry about getting ripped off anywhere. Other than oil changes and minor crap a shop has a hard time screwing up, I'm living proof that I don't need technicians. Not that I have a problem paying for a quality tech, but the key word is quality. The "boom" we have contributed in GM repairs is less than that spent on Ford repairs, even though we have 2 GMs and only 1 Ford at the time.
I can see the flaws in both our GM and Ford products. It's simply just a matter of not being brand loyal blinded enough to only knock the ones on the GM and ignore the ones on the Ford.
So in case you haven't figured it out, nobody here needed or asked your permission to spend out money how we want. And really unless we wanted some juvenile "mine is better than yours" argument, you've proven that you have no clue what the owner base of another vehicle thinks about that vehicle.
Originally Posted by Tumba
Thanks for the replies.
Ilike Ford much better than any other manufacturer. I always let my wife choose her car herself is why we have an Envoy. I think she bought it just to irritate me. I t has been a good auto, FORD just fits me better.
For my kids I always build them a Ford. Gave my last F150 to my 16 year old boy. He has been driving it for a year now and had less problems than when I drove it
I'll see what gas prices are going to do before I build myself another one..

Ilike Ford much better than any other manufacturer. I always let my wife choose her car herself is why we have an Envoy. I think she bought it just to irritate me. I t has been a good auto, FORD just fits me better.
For my kids I always build them a Ford. Gave my last F150 to my 16 year old boy. He has been driving it for a year now and had less problems than when I drove it
I'll see what gas prices are going to do before I build myself another one..

Ours is the wifemobile as well, and it works just fine for what she does with it. Overall I'd say it's less boring than an Explorer, though nothing in the class is really exciting if you ask me. Hers is actually the Isuzu, which had a better price break at the time, and a better warranty (which I'll never figure out!).
To me it's just a 3/4 or maybe 7/8 scale SUV bore mobile. All the disadvantages of a full sized SUV, and the only advantage being the smaller size to park it.
Overall the powerplant is fine, a fairly flat torque curve, and willing to rev. Really the only thing I don't like about it is the steering ratio is way too quick for the wheelbase. Just thinking about moving the wheel is a lane change.
Whatever dude, just relax and it'll be o.k.,
take slow deep breaths, I'm sorry I have insulted the "all mighty" General Mistake.... once again, I mean General Motors, I never meant anything was better than the other, just yours sucked
(just kidding, at least I was trying to). I'm glad to hear your self sufficient at everything, could you come fix my dishwasher, I don't feel like it. Being a proffesional Tech. for over twenty years I see the flaws in "all" makes and models therefore I "can" give you an opinion based on "fact", not, "I like my little car so stop making fun of it", like yours. I know all to well they all have flaws, but your argument is not based on anything other than your ownership experience, not based on many hands on experiences like mine.
"nobody here needed or asked your permission to spend out money how we want.".............
What???
"you've proven that you have no clue what the owner base of another vehicle thinks about that vehicle."
Actually, you have proven for me that I have more than a clue of what "owners" think about their vehicles, due to the fact that I have a customer database "full" of those facts. Don't be stupid dude, I'm glad you like your little soccer mom vehicle, now go fix the mistakes you made on it.
take slow deep breaths, I'm sorry I have insulted the "all mighty" General Mistake.... once again, I mean General Motors, I never meant anything was better than the other, just yours sucked
(just kidding, at least I was trying to). I'm glad to hear your self sufficient at everything, could you come fix my dishwasher, I don't feel like it. Being a proffesional Tech. for over twenty years I see the flaws in "all" makes and models therefore I "can" give you an opinion based on "fact", not, "I like my little car so stop making fun of it", like yours. I know all to well they all have flaws, but your argument is not based on anything other than your ownership experience, not based on many hands on experiences like mine. "nobody here needed or asked your permission to spend out money how we want.".............
What???
"you've proven that you have no clue what the owner base of another vehicle thinks about that vehicle."
Actually, you have proven for me that I have more than a clue of what "owners" think about their vehicles, due to the fact that I have a customer database "full" of those facts. Don't be stupid dude, I'm glad you like your little soccer mom vehicle, now go fix the mistakes you made on it.
Originally Posted by TECHDOC
Whatever dude, just relax and it'll be o.k.,
take slow deep breaths, I'm sorry I have insulted the "all mighty" General Mistake.... once again, I mean General Motors, I never meant anything was better than the other, just yours sucked
(just kidding, at least I was trying to). I'm glad to hear your self sufficient at everything, could you come fix my dishwasher, I don't feel like it. Being a proffesional Tech. for over twenty years I see the flaws in "all" makes and models therefore I "can" give you an opinion based on "fact", not, "I like my little car so stop making fun of it", like yours. I know all to well they all have flaws, but your argument is not based on anything other than your ownership experience, not based on many hands on experiences like mine.
"nobody here needed or asked your permission to spend out money how we want.".............
What???
"you've proven that you have no clue what the owner base of another vehicle thinks about that vehicle."
Actually, you have proven for me that I have more than a clue of what "owners" think about their vehicles, due to the fact that I have a customer database "full" of those facts. Don't be stupid dude, I'm glad you like your little soccer mom vehicle, now go fix the mistakes you made on it.
take slow deep breaths, I'm sorry I have insulted the "all mighty" General Mistake.... once again, I mean General Motors, I never meant anything was better than the other, just yours sucked
(just kidding, at least I was trying to). I'm glad to hear your self sufficient at everything, could you come fix my dishwasher, I don't feel like it. Being a proffesional Tech. for over twenty years I see the flaws in "all" makes and models therefore I "can" give you an opinion based on "fact", not, "I like my little car so stop making fun of it", like yours. I know all to well they all have flaws, but your argument is not based on anything other than your ownership experience, not based on many hands on experiences like mine. "nobody here needed or asked your permission to spend out money how we want.".............
What???
"you've proven that you have no clue what the owner base of another vehicle thinks about that vehicle."
Actually, you have proven for me that I have more than a clue of what "owners" think about their vehicles, due to the fact that I have a customer database "full" of those facts. Don't be stupid dude, I'm glad you like your little soccer mom vehicle, now go fix the mistakes you made on it.
We have nothing to fix. With all that supposed experience you must be blinded, as you don't seem to know about the awards GM has got for that engine, or much about it other than your database. How many miles have you driven one?
The big mistake you're making is that you seem to think that I care what you think. I don't. I'm sure my wife doesn't either. We're both secure enough in our lives we don't have to try to convince people that our choice of cars makes us better or worse people.
If you want to see stupid defined, go Google "internet troll". Then grab a mirror. Apply as it fits.
P.S. Don't forget to put the drain plug back in before you add the oil.


