Don't forget about the Federal Reserve fellas. One of the main reasons for inflation is the Federal Reserve and their lending practices to the U.S. government. They loan the government money that must be paid back with interest yet they never put the interest money into circulation. That's where all of us come in. They are robbing us of our savings through inflation. They keep printing money out of thin air and flooding the market with more and more worthless dollars driving the value down even more.

Now add in the fact that we borrow $3 billion a day from China to finance this ridiculous war in Iraq which also has to be paid back with interest. The Federal Reserve, our empirical foreign policy to police the world, deficit spending and government bureaucracies wasting money are all bankrupting this country.

Before and after 9/11, al qaeda told us that they could not defeat us head to head in a fight. But what they also said is that they would hit us where it hurt most, the economy. So back to 9/11. Al qaeda attacked the world trade center (at the time the center of the world economy) and the pentagon (symbol of our military industrial complex). So fast forward to today, our economy is in the tank, we are stuck in two wars that are bankrupting this country and al qaedas numbers are growing around the world EVERYDAY. So tell me who is truly winning this war?

 

Also the government dosent produce anything further dragging down the dollar at who's expense? They vote higher pay and benefits for themselves year after year.

Republicans were supposed to be about fisical responsibility...for 20 of the last 28 years we have had republican presidents and mostly republican dominated congress but most want to believe it's democrat policies that got us where we are now?

 

You and I both may understand small business write off but corporations are another story.
They have different rules.
The stimulus package is a good example of a wast of time and money. Compared to what it spends and gives away in tax shelters and loopholes you are talking about peanuts they give to the poor....Then they borrow money to stimulate the economy? Corporations benefit much more from their cuts.
How about some government benefits cuts instead?
It is supposed to be public service...speaking of service did you know many military families also qualify for food stamps....guess they dont deserve it either?

Im telling you again that there are ways for businesses to write off nearly or all of their taxes they were supposed to pay and individuals dont have the same benefit of write off on their expenses.

Then you consider millions of individuals paying something and it also adds up. I hear the quote that the upper 20% pays 80% of taxes but they also probably make 80% of the GNP?
We are talking about billions and trillions earned and spent and you focus on the few millions they give the poor?

 

Signmaster, your words are like sunshine on a cloudy day. The problem is, as the discussion currently runs in this country, there is no room for reason and logic. I think people find it much easier if they just don't try to look any further than their own hand in front of their face.

It doesn't take a brain surgeon to look at all of the numbers and see that what we are being told, by the media and some of our elected officials, isn't the truth. I'm not rich. I wish I were. I'm not though. I understand that I have to pay taxes. I don't have any problem paying my fair share. I have a problem when the government want's to give the taxes that the rich, and the taxes that people like me have paid in, to people who haven't paid anything in. That's not any more fair to the rich than it is to me.

The numbers don't lie. The rich pay most of the taxes. The rest are paid by the rest of us. The government seems to think that giving that money to the poor is some how supposed to stimulate the economy. Why would we want to give our money away to people who have shown that they aren't capable of managing it?

Thanks signmaster. I wish more people were singing that tune.

 

I asked for examples. I've given examples of my point that individuals can in fact write off large amounts of money, and it is no longer subject to taxes. Show me the tax code that allows corporations these huge breaks that avoid taxes.

Another case in point is the poor military families you speak of. Because much of their pay isn't taxable, they pay a much lower rate, all while being able to qualify for more assistance. I didn't tell them to have 4 kids, and if they did that on an E-3 salary, they aren't responsible parents. The same applies to anyone else military or not.

Take a look at how credits and such work for single parents. A single parent can get back more than they earn, even if they make decent pay in some cases. My wife worked with a girl who got back almost twice as much as she paid in, and at the time was making about 30k. While that isn't huge money, why should my wife and myself pay more because this woman didn't get married? And for the record, the girl lived with her boyfriend who was the father, and they split expenses just like many married couples do.

I told my wife maybe we should get a divorce just for the sake of taxes.




Wittom,

Good to see you around now and then. I just call them like I see them. Like yourself I don't at all mind paying my fair share. And actually even though we have a daughter now I still think that if anything people with kids should pay MORE in taxes, since they create more burden on the government system. Maybe in my tax code it would be called the "extra non breeder tax" for single people without kids.

But back to the point. I don't have a problem with government existing where it's needed or beneficial to all. I do have a problem with government screwing things up for no reason. I don't need an interest free loan to stimulate my spending. I'm not spending because I don't need things at the moment, and I'm content to live within my means. In the long run I know it will cost me, you, and everyone else money to get this free loan I don't need. And to top it off since I'm self employed, I'll be getting an advance on a tax return that I would have never got in the first place, because I have to pay quarterly taxes.

So now I guess I've have to deposit a check I never desired, and then write larger checks to the IRS through the year to avoid penalty, because that advance will offset the taxes I would normally have owed.

I think the main problem is that we're dealing with idiots running the country. Because some of us know they are idiots, and we know it's election year for the idiots, some people are tightening up and making sure they live within their means. So the idiots then worsen the plot, giving us some of our own money to spend.

I don't even really think idiots is the word.

 

There would be no example in the tax codes that allow companies to avoid taxes. They usually write laws after the fact. There are many laws since 2003 prohibting the ones they were using up to that time.

http://www.irs.gov/businesses/corpor...120633,00.html
http://www.irs.gov/businesses/corpor...=97384,00.html
http://www.house.gov/jct/x-25-00.pdf

Something just dosent feel right explaining how someone does something questionable regarding the IRS but the fact that corporations account for less than 10% of federal tax recipts is all over the internet as are new laws year after year as the abuse continues.

These are a few characteristics that are usually found in tax shelters, either separately or in combination:

Taxes are deferred to later years; Engaging in a "like-kind" exchange under IRC section 1031 is available to corporations and other business entities engaging in disposition transactions. In a like-kind exchange, the taxpayer sells business property and acquires similar replacement property of equal or greater value within 180 days. By following the various requirements under section 1031, the taxpayer can defer gain on the sale of the "relinquished" property until the "replacement" property is sold at a future date.

Ordinary gains (100 percent taxable) are converted to capital gains (only 40 percent taxable), or capital losses (only 50 percent deductible), are converted to ordinary losses (100 percent deductible); in both cases producing a lower tax liability;

Leverage obtained through various financing arrangements.

Derivatives

 

If there are no examples, that goes back to what I stated before. Large companies and corporations are simply taking advantage of the tax laws better, and if they get a bigger break yet do nothing illegal then they are simply doing what the average person does.

I suspect that many (large companies) looked for relief much harder, as a lot of laws essentially ended up in double taxation. The corporation paid taxes on the profit, and yet when they distrubuted the profit to shareholders they in turn paid taxes in it again. Think about that for a minute. I don't wonder why people looked for shelters, as they were getting nailed on both sides of the coin. That money was subject to the corporate tax of up to 35% AND the individual taxes regarding dividend and/or capital gains if they sold company shares distributed.

Just as with individuals they have options to weigh. You can rent and get no break, you can buy a home and get a break on interest. Buy a car and depreciate it, or lease a car and get immediate larger credits. A large company or corporation is in the same position, simply on a larger scale. They could have dividends taxed at the corporate rate and then give them to employees or shareholders. But that person lost out on the 35% the government already took from the company, even if that person was in a substantially lower tax bracket.


If laws are changed after the fact, that doesn't make the previous actions illegal, it simply prevents them in the future.