true duals on a 2001 sc?
Thread Starter
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Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
From: Austin, Tx
true duals on a 2001 sc?
So i want to get a true dual straight out the back on my 2001 king ranch super crew. I went to leonard garage here in austin, tx and they said they could not do it because they would have to cut the y-pipe and by doing so they would void my warranty. So they said they would do si/do i really want a true dual out so i was wondering if this is really true. 
they also said there was no performance difference between the single in dual out and true duals. How much of that is true and does anyone know a place in austin that'll work on exhaust?
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2001 King Ranch F-150: 5.4l, 3.55LS, Towing Package, 4x4, ORP, K&N FIPK, MoonRoof, LUND bugshield, Pioneer DEH-P920R Head, Pioneer CDX-PD6 in dash changer, JL 10w6, Earthquake 2.5 amp
[This message has been edited by fallen (edited 01-27-2001).]
they also said there was no performance difference between the single in dual out and true duals. How much of that is true and does anyone know a place in austin that'll work on exhaust?------------------
2001 King Ranch F-150: 5.4l, 3.55LS, Towing Package, 4x4, ORP, K&N FIPK, MoonRoof, LUND bugshield, Pioneer DEH-P920R Head, Pioneer CDX-PD6 in dash changer, JL 10w6, Earthquake 2.5 amp
[This message has been edited by fallen (edited 01-27-2001).]
Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
From: Texas
I live in TX and had true dual exhaust on my old truck. (98 F150) It is legal, you have the cats to run straight back. It sounds awesome if you use the right muffs. Don't know about the warranty?
Down side, I had 2 Flowmaster 2 chambers side-by-side with a H pipe installed for equalization. The muffler guy seemed like he knew what he was doing and did a super job making them look good. Off the lot with the new muffs I lost quite a bit of low end punch @ < 50MPH. May have gained a bit after 50MPH. BUT, THEY SOUNDED GREAT. BETTER THAN ANY F150 V8 I HAVE EVER HEARD... I came straight to this site and did some "hind sight" research and found that true dual exhaust low end loss is common. New Ford motors need a little back pressure in my mechanically illiterate opinion...
Learning from this, although I never thought of it as a problem because they sounded soooo good, my new truck will get single in dual out to save the low end for towing.
Hope this long non-thechnical opinion helped.
TS
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2001 SUPERCREW 4X4
No mods. YET!
Wife still PO'd about trading a 98' S-Cab for same color same everthing 01' S-CREW.
[This message has been edited by Fireman-N-TX (edited 01-29-2001).]
Down side, I had 2 Flowmaster 2 chambers side-by-side with a H pipe installed for equalization. The muffler guy seemed like he knew what he was doing and did a super job making them look good. Off the lot with the new muffs I lost quite a bit of low end punch @ < 50MPH. May have gained a bit after 50MPH. BUT, THEY SOUNDED GREAT. BETTER THAN ANY F150 V8 I HAVE EVER HEARD... I came straight to this site and did some "hind sight" research and found that true dual exhaust low end loss is common. New Ford motors need a little back pressure in my mechanically illiterate opinion...
Learning from this, although I never thought of it as a problem because they sounded soooo good, my new truck will get single in dual out to save the low end for towing.
Hope this long non-thechnical opinion helped.
TS
------------------
2001 SUPERCREW 4X4
No mods. YET!
Wife still PO'd about trading a 98' S-Cab for same color same everthing 01' S-CREW.
[This message has been edited by Fireman-N-TX (edited 01-29-2001).]
Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
From: Albuquerque, NM USA
I wanted true duals too. The mechanic at Midas said that leagally he couldn't. It would have to be routed too close to the gas tank. He could have routed them over to the right side and then one back to exit on the left but that seemed Ridiculous. I just had him install a Z-33 ravin and left it single.
BTW I grew up in Austin. Went to Westlake.
G
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2000 F-150 S/C S/B 3.55LS
5.4L
MODS
4WD valence W/hooks
K&N air filter
Hellwig rear sway bar
Raven muffler
Superchip
Cervini ram air hood being painted/installed
'67 Honda CL77 305 scrambler
'67 Honda CL160 scrambler
12 string Ovation
Mid-mo mandolin
Ovation mandolin
BTW I grew up in Austin. Went to Westlake.
G
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2000 F-150 S/C S/B 3.55LS
5.4L
MODS
4WD valence W/hooks
K&N air filter
Hellwig rear sway bar
Raven muffler
Superchip
Cervini ram air hood being painted/installed
'67 Honda CL77 305 scrambler
'67 Honda CL160 scrambler
12 string Ovation
Mid-mo mandolin
Ovation mandolin
Member
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
From: SW OK
True duals are certainly possibe on your truck! Modifying the stock pipes will void the warranty on the exhaust system ONLY! I got the same story from the muffler shop until I showed them the information I have included below. I am very happy with the Flowmaster DF-70 with dual in / dual out. Very nice tone without the highway drone. Good luck!
The Law
Federal law sets forth requirements for warranties and contains a number of provisions to prevent vehicle manufacturers, dealers and others from unjustly denying warranty coverage. With regard to aftermarket parts, the gist of the law is that warranty coverage cannot be denied simply because such parts are present on the vehicle, or have been used. The warranty coverage can be denied only if the aftermarket part caused the malfunction or damage for which warranty coverage is sought. Disputes in this area usually boil down to arguments over facts and technical opinions, rather than arguments over interpretations of the law.
Federal Warranty Laws
1.The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))
This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of this law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle makers brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:
“No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name....” (15 U.S.C. 2302(C)).
2. Clean Air Act Warranty Provisions (42 U.S.C. S 7541 (C) (3) (B))
The federal Clean Air Act requires vehicle makers to provide two emissions-related warranties -- a production warranty and a performance warranty. The production warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle is designed, built and equipped so that it conforms with emissions requirements at the time of sale. The performance warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle will comply with applicable emissions requirements as tested under state vehicle emissions inspection programs for the warranty periods specified in the law (for model year 1995 and later vehicles, the warranty is 2 years/24,000 miles for all emissions-related parts and 8 years/80,000 miles for the catalytic converter, electronic emissions control unit and on-board diagnostic device). The performance warranty is conditioned on the vehicle being properly maintained and operated.
The Magnuson-Moss Act states that vehicle manufacturers may not refuse warranty repairs under the Clean Air Acts performance and defect warranties merely because aftermarket parts have been installed on the vehicle. The only circumstance under which the vehicle manufacturer can void the emissions warranties is if an aftermarket part is responsible for (causes) the warranty claim.
The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act may also be helpful. Under this federal law, you can sue on breach of express and implied warranties. The main point of interest here is that the Act says warranty coverage may not be conditioned upon the use of only the vehicle manufacturers parts unless the parts are provided free of charge. In other words, use of a non-carmaker product should not void your warranty unless it caused the problem.
Knowledge Isn't Enough
Just knowing the law may not be enough. What happens if a vehicle dealer denies a warranty claim? If the claim is in reference to a part governed by the Clean Air Act and you believe the claim was improperly denied, a call to the EPA at (202) 382-2640 would be in order. The EPA maintains a staff who looks into situations where vehicle manufacturers have failed to honor warranty claims.
If the failure to honor a claim involves the new warranty, and it appears that the vehicle dealer improperly denied the claim, the matter should be raised with the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) at (202) 326-3128. The FTC is responsible for monitoring compliance with the warranty law. Between these two federal agencies there should be sufficient authority to work out any warranty problems.
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2000 F-150 Lariat SC Flareside ORP, Chestnut w/Arizona Beige two-tone; 5.4L, 3.55LS; 4wDisc-ABS; Remote Keyless Entry; Factory 6-Pack CD changer; Signal Mirrors; Ford Duraliner; Retrax Roll-top Cover; Flowmaster 70 Series Dual Exhaust; Cold AirBox Mod; Tinted windows; VentVisors
The Law
Federal law sets forth requirements for warranties and contains a number of provisions to prevent vehicle manufacturers, dealers and others from unjustly denying warranty coverage. With regard to aftermarket parts, the gist of the law is that warranty coverage cannot be denied simply because such parts are present on the vehicle, or have been used. The warranty coverage can be denied only if the aftermarket part caused the malfunction or damage for which warranty coverage is sought. Disputes in this area usually boil down to arguments over facts and technical opinions, rather than arguments over interpretations of the law.
Federal Warranty Laws
1.The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (15 U.S.C. 2302(C))
This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of this law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle makers brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:
“No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name....” (15 U.S.C. 2302(C)).
2. Clean Air Act Warranty Provisions (42 U.S.C. S 7541 (C) (3) (B))
The federal Clean Air Act requires vehicle makers to provide two emissions-related warranties -- a production warranty and a performance warranty. The production warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle is designed, built and equipped so that it conforms with emissions requirements at the time of sale. The performance warranty requires the vehicle maker to warrant that the vehicle will comply with applicable emissions requirements as tested under state vehicle emissions inspection programs for the warranty periods specified in the law (for model year 1995 and later vehicles, the warranty is 2 years/24,000 miles for all emissions-related parts and 8 years/80,000 miles for the catalytic converter, electronic emissions control unit and on-board diagnostic device). The performance warranty is conditioned on the vehicle being properly maintained and operated.
The Magnuson-Moss Act states that vehicle manufacturers may not refuse warranty repairs under the Clean Air Acts performance and defect warranties merely because aftermarket parts have been installed on the vehicle. The only circumstance under which the vehicle manufacturer can void the emissions warranties is if an aftermarket part is responsible for (causes) the warranty claim.
The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act may also be helpful. Under this federal law, you can sue on breach of express and implied warranties. The main point of interest here is that the Act says warranty coverage may not be conditioned upon the use of only the vehicle manufacturers parts unless the parts are provided free of charge. In other words, use of a non-carmaker product should not void your warranty unless it caused the problem.
Knowledge Isn't Enough
Just knowing the law may not be enough. What happens if a vehicle dealer denies a warranty claim? If the claim is in reference to a part governed by the Clean Air Act and you believe the claim was improperly denied, a call to the EPA at (202) 382-2640 would be in order. The EPA maintains a staff who looks into situations where vehicle manufacturers have failed to honor warranty claims.
If the failure to honor a claim involves the new warranty, and it appears that the vehicle dealer improperly denied the claim, the matter should be raised with the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) at (202) 326-3128. The FTC is responsible for monitoring compliance with the warranty law. Between these two federal agencies there should be sufficient authority to work out any warranty problems.
------------------
2000 F-150 Lariat SC Flareside ORP, Chestnut w/Arizona Beige two-tone; 5.4L, 3.55LS; 4wDisc-ABS; Remote Keyless Entry; Factory 6-Pack CD changer; Signal Mirrors; Ford Duraliner; Retrax Roll-top Cover; Flowmaster 70 Series Dual Exhaust; Cold AirBox Mod; Tinted windows; VentVisors
Member
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
From: Texas
I recently had true duals installed and love them. I went with FM 40 delta-flows. The muffler guy cut a 10-12 inch section out of the drivers side pipe at the Y-pipe and put a freeze plug in the Y. Then he went with 2.5" pipes with a crossover to the mufflers & 2.25" over the axle straight out the back.
When I left the shop I noticed a loss in the low end. After I got home I disconnected the battery for a while. After that I noticed an increase in low end power. The tranny does not have to downshift as much around town when I go up small inclines.
Fallen: I can't speak for a performance difference between true duals and SI/DO, but in my case true duals seem to help across the powerband.
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1999 F-150 XLT SC Stepside, 5.4L (replaced), 3.55 Limited Slip, Towing Package, Captain's Chairs, Bright Red
Added: K&N, B&M Deep Aluminum Tranny Pan, Westin Nerfs,
True Duals with FM 40DF's & 2.25" tail pipes,
JVC CD Player, Pioneer 6x8 3 ways, 12 disc add-on CD changer
When I left the shop I noticed a loss in the low end. After I got home I disconnected the battery for a while. After that I noticed an increase in low end power. The tranny does not have to downshift as much around town when I go up small inclines.
Fallen: I can't speak for a performance difference between true duals and SI/DO, but in my case true duals seem to help across the powerband.
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1999 F-150 XLT SC Stepside, 5.4L (replaced), 3.55 Limited Slip, Towing Package, Captain's Chairs, Bright Red
Added: K&N, B&M Deep Aluminum Tranny Pan, Westin Nerfs,
True Duals with FM 40DF's & 2.25" tail pipes,
JVC CD Player, Pioneer 6x8 3 ways, 12 disc add-on CD changer
Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 60
Likes: 0
From: Albuquerque, NM USA
How close did the drivers side pipe get to the gas tank?
G
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2000 F-150 Supercab Shortbed 3.55LS
5.4L
MODS
4WD valence W/hooks
K&N air filter
Hellwig rear sway bar
Raven muffler
Superchip
Cervini ram air hood being painted/installed
'67 Honda CL77 305 scrambler
'67 Honda CL160 scrambler
12 string Ovation
Mid-mo mandolin
Ovation mandolin
G
------------------
2000 F-150 Supercab Shortbed 3.55LS
5.4L
MODS
4WD valence W/hooks
K&N air filter
Hellwig rear sway bar
Raven muffler
Superchip
Cervini ram air hood being painted/installed
'67 Honda CL77 305 scrambler
'67 Honda CL160 scrambler
12 string Ovation
Mid-mo mandolin
Ovation mandolin
Member
Joined: Apr 1999
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
From: Texas
He still ran both pipes down the right side of the driveshaft with the mufflers mounted vertically under the heat shield for the factory muffler. When he cut the pipe ahead of the Y-pipe it gave him room to put a 90-degree bend from there to run the pipes side-by-side down the right side of the truck. The left muffler sits about 3-4 inches from the driveshaft.
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Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 601
Likes: 0
From: West Virginia
i have true duals on my 97 with 5 inch tips and i gained more power than imaginable. icouldnt believe it i am plannin on crawlin under it to get a few pics of how it was run my echaust man did it no problem nad it wa scheap as hell too 155 bucks
thats with the 5x24 inch chrome tips
checkem out at www.f150world.com/southernthunder
jj
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97 4x4 ORP
flareside supercab
rear blackouts
westin step bars(black)
side window louvers
lund shadow wiper cowel
true duals 5 in tips
k&n F.I.P.K
17in' wheels 265/70 Bridgestone dueler A/T's
ventshades
tinted windows 5%
thats with the 5x24 inch chrome tips
checkem out at www.f150world.com/southernthunder
jj
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97 4x4 ORP
flareside supercab
rear blackouts
westin step bars(black)
side window louvers
lund shadow wiper cowel
true duals 5 in tips
k&n F.I.P.K
17in' wheels 265/70 Bridgestone dueler A/T's
ventshades
tinted windows 5%
Thread Starter
|
Junior Member
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
From: Austin, Tx
Just wanted to thank all of you for your input i will be headed back out there this weekend to see what i put on it.
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2001 King Ranch F-150: 5.4l, 3.55LS, Towing Package, 4x4, ORP, K&N FIPK, MoonRoof, LUND bugshield, Pioneer DEH-P920R Head, Pioneer CDX-PD6 in dash changer, JL 10w6, Earthquake 2.5 amp
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2001 King Ranch F-150: 5.4l, 3.55LS, Towing Package, 4x4, ORP, K&N FIPK, MoonRoof, LUND bugshield, Pioneer DEH-P920R Head, Pioneer CDX-PD6 in dash changer, JL 10w6, Earthquake 2.5 amp