Steve83,
These are ECU controlled regulators. They have a harness and power wires.
'Additional Details"-
1. When adding an additional alternator how do they communicate?
2. As Ford makes a 2 alt. option on the SD, is there a factory harness?
3. Do they run master, slave?
4. Will the SD bracket direct fit?

As I want to make power at an idle, 2 alts are a better option for me.

 

1. Yeah, I'm familiar with them. I temporarily put this PCM-controlled alt on an old '98 car and it worked fine wired up without a PCM connection. The PCM simply modulates the power feed coming back from the ALT light circuit to control the reference voltage that the VR uses to decide how high to run up the alt's output. But the VR works exactly like the older ones - only the pinout is different.



2. Dunno. What year, and I'll do some research?

3. Probably not. I suspect they're virtually independent, but again: I'm not familiar with that setup.

4. Dunno.

If one alt doesn't make power at idle, 2 won't either. If your only goal is to have more output at idle, you need a better alt - not one more. And low-output alts do better at low RPM than hi-outputs.

 

Steve83,

Thanks for the info. I appreciate the time responding.
I would differ on your last statement regarding output. If an alt has an output of 200 amp, it is probably at 1500-2000 rpm, with about 100 amp at idle. With out taking into account heat saturation.

If I want to put out 180 amp at idle, 2-200 amp alternators is better than 1, for my scenario.

It really depends when you want to make your power. I am looking to make it at low RPM.

I believe our stock alternator produces around 80 amp @ idle. Therefore, I'd like about 100-120 @ idle.

Just depends on the desired outcome.
-Tung

 

Nope. I've had to fix many vehicles with hi-output alts that don't put out at idle. Land Rovers come from the factory with 130-200A alts, and as they age, they idle lower, causing problems with charging & the high load of their massive A/C systems. The owners sometimes want to swap in bigger alternators, but that only aggravates the problem. They hate to hear it's gonna take a few grand of engine work & tune-up (just to raise the idle back where it belongs) to make the stock alternator work, but that's the fix every time.

Talk to your local starter/alternator shop. They'll confirm what I'm telling you.

The other option is to install a smaller alt pulley so it spins faster, but that creates other concerns: more load on the bearings; more wear on the belt; too much alt RPM at hi engine revs...

 

Steve83,
I appreciate your response. You seem to have a "hands on" background in the subject.
Then, for the sake of debate: why do many diesels have dual alternators?
When you purchase an ambulance why would they come with dual alternators?

If we can control a set RPM, at idle or at high speed. But it is a constant value.
I understand what you are stating about a tune up, and idle control.

You might be right. But I know this guy agrees with me:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yti-GQa5n0I

Additionally, look at the bottom of this link:
http://www.qualitypowerauto.com/cata...Fcategory%3D45

 

You're changing the subject, but I'll play along.

They're prepped for lots of aftermarket accessories that suck up a lot of current, so they need the extra output. But they DON'T produce it at normal idle (~700RPM); they have a switch on the dash to raise the idle to ~2KRPM, and the alts work fine at that speed.Huh? Can we have a complete sentence please? Are any of those alts "hi-output"? Or are they all normal 120-140A? And does he use them at normal idle, or does he have that same hi-idle switch on his dash?Do you mean this?OK If you go to NASA & spend a few million, they can probably build you an alt that will put out 500A at idle. But just like that link, they won't warrant your drivebelt, tensioner, engine, or even the magic alternator. Did you read all their exclusions? They say it's warranted for a year, but then they specifically exclude virtually every failure mode, including the chrome peeling off!

If you wanna risk $200, go for it. Me? I'm perfectly happy with my stock 130A alt, even when I load it up with my Ramsey RE12000. Yeah, I have to raise the idle, but considering I paid $25 in a junkyard for the alternator, I can live with it. And if I burn it up (I've been trying for a long time now), I'll throw on the other one I got at the same time. Your truck will be parked while you wait for that website to decide how badly they want to screw you.



...OR...

You could just use a stock alternator & bump the idle when you need more juice.

 

Here is some of the info from the 2006 F-250 EVTM on the dual alternator install. This is an option on a 3/4 ton and up pickup truck











I have the service manual section 414-02 for the F-250 in PDF format, if anybody wants them. Just drop me an email via my profile, and I will send them off.

This is the info direct from Ford, no opinions interjected.

 

Steve83,
Thanks for your insight.

 

Note that the factory uses a low- & a hi-output alt spinning at different speeds. That gives them the best of both worlds: good idle output, but even more at higher RPM. A diesel doesn't turn fast enough (~4500RPM max) to overrev the higher-speed alt, but a gas engine could (~6000RPM max). That's OK, Steve - my opinion's big enough to spread around.

 

I did not draw attention to it ( as the pictures had it in them ), but you did for me. This is a diesel application from Ford.

The opinion part was not pointed at you, but in reference from one of the URLs posted on the topic back on page 1, specifically post #2 from me.
https://www.f150online.com/forums/3731747-post2.html

The line :

This was the opinion that I was correcting.
Might not want to be so defensive about a posting.
Just because you have an opinion, does not mean the line was about you

 

SScully,
Thanks for the info. I see your information shows that the F250 5.4 did not have a dual Alt. option. Now I need to figure out where I saw/developed this opinion from.
Hopefully, this evening I can digest your post and Email you for the additional info.

Others,
If there is any confusion, I want to clear the air on my desired outcome.
I want to produce 150+amps @ idle.
My desired outcome is to use two stock (or Ford) alternators.

Steve83,
I did use the wrong RPM range in an earlier post.
The point I was attempting to make is:
1. Most high output Alt's do not have a constant output. (#49)
"200 Amp-130 amp idle"
2. I was changing the subject, as I used the words "for the sake of debate".
3.You state (#47):
If one alt doesn't make power at idle, 2 won't either. If your only goal is to have more output at idle, you need a better alt - not one more. And low-output alts do better at low RPM than hi-outputs.

I do want to produce power, "at a constant value", idle. I do not wish to purchase an expensive high out put alternator as you rant about in #51:
"If you wanna risk $200, go for it. Me? I'm perfectly happy".
NOTE: The link referencing the high output alt. was to illustrate it did not produce constant power across the RPM curve.

4. As for my incomplete sentence. I did a poor job articulating my understanding of the issues surrounding a tune up. The constant was a given/set RPM. Were you trying to state, that the engines had slipped below the desired, minimum RPM for idle. Therefore, no matter the ALT, they were below the lower RPM range to make power.

In retrospect, I believe our confusion comes between the last two bullets in each post in #46 & #47.
My wish is to have two alternators producing power at idle. This derives from the total demand. Not lack of performance. I want to operate numerous items that will create a load higher than the current output.

This should bring clarification about my desired outcome.
I apologize for my previous errors and appreciate the knowledge and response from others.
Thanks,
-Tung

 

Don't know if I missed this in the thread, if it was already posted sorry for the duplicate.

No mention of what to do with the wiring :
http://www.dcpowerinc.com/dual-alter...-brracket.html

Maybe it is a case of running dual alternators and dual batteries with a dual battery isolator ??
http://www.hellroaring.com/battery1.php

Sorry I have been staying out of the back and forth in this thread, and just took a quick look this AM.

No clue if this even fits the need of what the OP is trying to accomplish.

 

I wasn't defending - I was pleading GUILTY! I think you still misunderstand how an alt works, and why it does what it does. Its output is ALWAYS variable, and it NEEDS to vary. If you locked it at a minimum output (especially as high as 150A@idle), the battery would explode from the heat & Hydrogen. So "constant output" is a myth, and it'll never happen.

The voltage regulator senses the loads & controls the alt in an attempt to satisfy the loads. If the RPM is too low for that particular alt to make that much current, or if that alt is incapable of that output at any RPM, then the battery will begin to drain. If the load & RPM remain at that level long enough, then the battery will die, the alt will overheat, and the fuel pump will finally shut down for lack of voltage.

But assuming the alt CAN produce enough current at a higher RPM, there are 2 solutions:
1) raise the RPM off-idle enough to satisfy the load, or
2) install a smaller alt. pulley so it spins faster at idle, but remember the consequences I mentioned earlier.I guess it's me, but I still don't understand any of that. Sorry. Is the 4th sentence a question, or another incomplete one? I just don't follow you.I don't understand why you're hung up on 2 alts when 1 is enough. Have you ever connected all these loads & actually measured how much current they pull? Have you ever had your alt tested at idle, 1500 RPM, & 2500 RPM to see what it puts out? Be sure to have the battery tested, too.

 

SSCULLY,
Amazing. Thanks for your help. That bracket is one of the components I've been looking for. Outstanding.

Steve83,
Thanks for your effort and knowledge in the previous posts. However, I won't be needing assistance from you in the future. Good luck on your endevors.

 

Subtle, but I think I've been dismissed!