5.4 #s are in... FINALLY
#31
09-12-2008, 01:16 AM
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Lets look at the past:
1980s: Ford had the 460, Chevy had the more powerful/faster 454.
late 80s/early 90s: Ford had the 5.8/351, chevy had the more powerful 5.7/350.
late 90s: Ford came out with the 5.4 2v, chevy's redesigned 5.7 was still more powerful.
2000: Chevy's 5.3 comes out, more powerful than Ford's redesigned 5.4 2v.
2004: Ford's new 5.4 3v rated more powerful than chevy's 5.3, but the 5.3 still much faster.
2009: Ford's redesigned 5.4 3v rated below chevy 5.3, 6.0, and 6.2 engines.
Dont you guys see the trend here?!?! Ford's never been the fastest (outside of the lightning). The other trend? Ford has more trucks with 200k miles+ by a longshot. Ford is bestselling by a long shot. Ford doesnt build it to be fast....so you're not going to get a fast truck. period.
Their engines/trannys might not be the fastest, but they last. If you buy a truck and plan to keep it for 10 years, get a Ford. If you want a new truck every 2 years, a "faster" Tundra or Ram might be for you.
You want to take pride, do it: your truck may line it up against your buddies Tundra and get burned today. But ten years from now, you'll still be in that same truck going strong: will he?
1980s: Ford had the 460, Chevy had the more powerful/faster 454.
late 80s/early 90s: Ford had the 5.8/351, chevy had the more powerful 5.7/350.
late 90s: Ford came out with the 5.4 2v, chevy's redesigned 5.7 was still more powerful.
2000: Chevy's 5.3 comes out, more powerful than Ford's redesigned 5.4 2v.
2004: Ford's new 5.4 3v rated more powerful than chevy's 5.3, but the 5.3 still much faster.
2009: Ford's redesigned 5.4 3v rated below chevy 5.3, 6.0, and 6.2 engines.
Dont you guys see the trend here?!?! Ford's never been the fastest (outside of the lightning). The other trend? Ford has more trucks with 200k miles+ by a longshot. Ford is bestselling by a long shot. Ford doesnt build it to be fast....so you're not going to get a fast truck. period.
Their engines/trannys might not be the fastest, but they last. If you buy a truck and plan to keep it for 10 years, get a Ford. If you want a new truck every 2 years, a "faster" Tundra or Ram might be for you.
You want to take pride, do it: your truck may line it up against your buddies Tundra and get burned today. But ten years from now, you'll still be in that same truck going strong: will he?
#32
09-12-2008, 01:22 AM
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The point that's being missed in this whole "I want more power thing" is big power demands higher octane to control detonation. Sure, the Ram and Tundra are both approaching the 400 HP mark but both trucks need premium fuel to do it. The trusty F150 may be the most "underpowered" but you can top it with regular and it'll pull 10K up a hill all day long and never once will you get the slightest hint of ping or detonation.
With the price of fuel costing over $5/gallon in Canada and over $4/gallon in the U.S. I would much prefer to get my work done burning regular over paying the inflated price of premium. I say to wait until the '09's are on the lots and go drive one before passing judgment. It's torque that moves things, not HP and 390 lb/ft hooked to a 6 speed will move very nicely.
On a side note, the reworked 5.4 appears to have a very nice sound even through stock exhaust. Can you imagine how good it'll sound through a Roush or Maggie SI/DO.
With the price of fuel costing over $5/gallon in Canada and over $4/gallon in the U.S. I would much prefer to get my work done burning regular over paying the inflated price of premium. I say to wait until the '09's are on the lots and go drive one before passing judgment. It's torque that moves things, not HP and 390 lb/ft hooked to a 6 speed will move very nicely.
On a side note, the reworked 5.4 appears to have a very nice sound even through stock exhaust. Can you imagine how good it'll sound through a Roush or Maggie SI/DO.
If the did actually require prem I would agree. But they don't! At least the owners I know here don't use prem. News to me. Are you sure? BTW while looking it up denali 6.2L 12/18 mpg(4wd).
Based on your logic a 5.4L should require prem cause it has much more power than a 4.6L? Size matters too! I can and have pulled 10k up a hill and the hole time I was wishing for more.
Fairness in conversation act:
- Dodge has such low gcwv its out of consideration if you tow more than 5-6000 lbs.
- Nissan will soon be a Dodge in Nissan skin so same here.
Last edited by Power Kid; 09-12-2008 at 01:41 AM.
#33
09-12-2008, 01:23 AM
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Why would you ignore the gm 6.0l and 6.2L? Other than the obvious reason that it helps you make some kind of point?
#34
09-12-2008, 01:34 AM
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I'm not the one crying. You totally missed the point. So let me clarify. I was pointing out that I was tired of folks such as yourself crying whenever real Ford truck owners demand more and better performing engines. You can't handle any critic of your fov truck manufacturer without bashing that person. Why? Do you own Ford stock? Do you work for them is your last name Ford? If so.... fine.
I'm not saying I want more motivation at the expense of a breaking tailgate, or faulty camshafts, or the fugly Silverado Grille, or the Cheap Ram interior. I want what I have PLUS more ooomph. and while yes it had plenty of tq down low, that does not help me when I'm merging onto a interstate at 40mph with a trailer and I need to go NOW. Then its HP....
If power is not important why did you all (or 98% of you) get the 5.4L and not the 4.6L. Perhaps because it was the only engine offered on the FX4 and Lariat? Or was if cause you wanted as much motivation as possible?
I'm not saying I want more motivation at the expense of a breaking tailgate, or faulty camshafts, or the fugly Silverado Grille, or the Cheap Ram interior. I want what I have PLUS more ooomph. and while yes it had plenty of tq down low, that does not help me when I'm merging onto a interstate at 40mph with a trailer and I need to go NOW. Then its HP....
If power is not important why did you all (or 98% of you) get the 5.4L and not the 4.6L. Perhaps because it was the only engine offered on the FX4 and Lariat? Or was if cause you wanted as much motivation as possible?
#35
09-12-2008, 01:39 AM
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The point that's being missed in this whole "I want more power thing" is big power demands higher octane to control detonation. Sure, the Ram and Tundra are both approaching the 400 HP mark but both trucks need premium fuel to do it. The trusty F150 may be the most "underpowered" but you can top it with regular and it'll pull 10K up a hill all day long and never once will you get the slightest hint of ping or detonation.
With the price of fuel costing over $5/gallon in Canada and over $4/gallon in the U.S. I would much prefer to get my work done burning regular over paying the inflated price of premium. I say to wait until the '09's are on the lots and go drive one before passing judgment. It's torque that moves things, not HP and 390 lb/ft hooked to a 6 speed will move very nicely.
On a side note, the reworked 5.4 appears to have a very nice sound even through stock exhaust. Can you imagine how good it'll sound through a Roush or Maggie SI/DO.
With the price of fuel costing over $5/gallon in Canada and over $4/gallon in the U.S. I would much prefer to get my work done burning regular over paying the inflated price of premium. I say to wait until the '09's are on the lots and go drive one before passing judgment. It's torque that moves things, not HP and 390 lb/ft hooked to a 6 speed will move very nicely.
On a side note, the reworked 5.4 appears to have a very nice sound even through stock exhaust. Can you imagine how good it'll sound through a Roush or Maggie SI/DO.
Based on that you tube video the 5.4 does sounds great! Nice improvement. My 04 all you hear is the cam phazers. A louder exhaust would be a nice distraction!
And hey you might be right. If and when I drive a 09 I might be surprised? The 6 speed alone did wonders for the Expy?
#36
09-12-2008, 02:59 AM
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As for the 6.0...
2008 Silverado 6.0l
367hp @ 5500
375tq @ 4300
13 / 18 - city/hwy
2009 F150 5.4l
320hp @ 5200
390tq @ 3500
14 / 18 - city/hwy
Ford will be down on hp, but up on torque and up on fuel economy. That will hold us over for a year. Also Ford has the best towing and payload numbers in the business.
To quote Richard Jensen,
"Although, in all fairness, those hp peaks are kind of meaningless.... Trucks almost never rev that high in daily use, and if Ford's torque curve is as flat as it's been, Ford's engine will be producing more HP all the way up to the torque peak. In fact, the boat anchor will probably be making more hp and torque than the iForce up to 2 grand, given the difference in torque curves."
-
"Oh, they'll be around to bellyache about the HP number, oblivious to the fact that all that extra hp is useless, as it comes well past 4 grand, oblivious to the fact that an engine with that much torque will be producing far more hp all the way up to the torque peak, and likely some ways beyond it.
And granted, the HP number isn't that impressive, but then again, this is a truck engine, and that just doesn't matter much.
You see, HP is a number derived from torque. An engine producing more torque at a given RPM will be producing more HP at that RPM. As long as your truck is operating within a normal range (say up to about 3 grand), your boat anchor will be more powerful than any engine except the more thirsty iForce. And it will give up precious little to that one."
"Although, in all fairness, those hp peaks are kind of meaningless.... Trucks almost never rev that high in daily use, and if Ford's torque curve is as flat as it's been, Ford's engine will be producing more HP all the way up to the torque peak. In fact, the boat anchor will probably be making more hp and torque than the iForce up to 2 grand, given the difference in torque curves."
-
"Oh, they'll be around to bellyache about the HP number, oblivious to the fact that all that extra hp is useless, as it comes well past 4 grand, oblivious to the fact that an engine with that much torque will be producing far more hp all the way up to the torque peak, and likely some ways beyond it.
And granted, the HP number isn't that impressive, but then again, this is a truck engine, and that just doesn't matter much.
You see, HP is a number derived from torque. An engine producing more torque at a given RPM will be producing more HP at that RPM. As long as your truck is operating within a normal range (say up to about 3 grand), your boat anchor will be more powerful than any engine except the more thirsty iForce. And it will give up precious little to that one."
#37
09-12-2008, 08:22 AM
I'm not the one crying. You totally missed the point. So let me clarify. I was pointing out that I was tired of folks such as yourself crying whenever real Ford truck owners demand more and better performing engines. You can't handle any critic of your fov truck manufacturer without bashing that person. Why? Do you own Ford stock? Do you work for them is your last name Ford? If so.... fine.
I'm not saying I want more motivation at the expense of a breaking tailgate, or faulty camshafts, or the fugly Silverado Grille, or the Cheap Ram interior. I want what I have PLUS more ooomph. and while yes it had plenty of tq down low, that does not help me when I'm merging onto a interstate at 40mph with a trailer and I need to go NOW. Then its HP....
If power is not important why did you all (or 98% of you) get the 5.4L and not the 4.6L. Perhaps because it was the only engine offered on the FX4 and Lariat? Or was if cause you wanted as much motivation as possible?
I'm not saying I want more motivation at the expense of a breaking tailgate, or faulty camshafts, or the fugly Silverado Grille, or the Cheap Ram interior. I want what I have PLUS more ooomph. and while yes it had plenty of tq down low, that does not help me when I'm merging onto a interstate at 40mph with a trailer and I need to go NOW. Then its HP....
If power is not important why did you all (or 98% of you) get the 5.4L and not the 4.6L. Perhaps because it was the only engine offered on the FX4 and Lariat? Or was if cause you wanted as much motivation as possible?
I dont see how you would have a problem getting onto a interstate with current f150's let alone the 09's I have a 6000lb trailer that i load up to maybe 7000-8000lb at times with materials onboard and i can get upto 60mph onto the interstate every day i leave for work and i have to come up a pretty step slope right before i merge onto interstate and thats with just 230hp 295tq from my Suv. If my 09 performes the same or better i will be extremly happy with it's performance.
#38
09-12-2008, 11:37 AM
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Kid your not being realistic, or you don't quite understand how HP and torque work. The latter not being an insult, as I would say 90% or more of America don't quite understand, hence the old "HP" wars of the muscle car days.
Your towing a trailer, need to get on the interstate now, you slam the pedal, its torque that drives you forward, its torque the gets that heavy load going, and its Ford higher torque numbers down low, that let you get a heavier load moving sooner and easier on the drivetrain, allowing the drivetrain to last longer, which then equal more reliability, longer lasting life, on the road longer, used as work trucks more, etc etc etc.
Am I Ford biased ? I guess you could say that. Then again, you do realize your on a FORD FORUM, right ? We are nto suppose to be open minded ! lol I have owned dodge, Chevy, Suzuki, Mercedes, and Ford, I have worked on a huge variety of trucks and suv's along with some cars. Ford simply seems built best, toughest, and seems to last the longest. I am not saying the other companies are crap, in any stretch. I am saying if you want the power of the Hemi, buy a hemi. You want the pull of the Yota, buy it. But do realize the high HP comes at a price. These engine wont last as long, wont see as many miles, and eventually wont get you from point A to B and always seems at the worst moment.
Like I have said (and you were willing to pick apart everyone else's comments except mine.... interesting) Ford DOES make a good truck with HIGH HP numbers. The HD edition has higher HP, the Lightning is a all out race truck in my eyes, the things can be wicked fast. They used to offer the Boss version of the 5.4, again more HP. They do offer what you want, and they offer what the majority of people want. Ford does an outstanding job with mass appeal IMO. They have a motor, a body style, even a bed size AND style for just about everyone. Thats not enough for you ? The largest selection of truck ?
Basically what I get from you, is you want bragging rights (nothing wrong with that) ? You want to be able to line up next to your buddy at a light, punch it, and beat him (again, nothing wrong with that) but this isn't what Ford's F series is about, and never has been, thats what mSall was trying to show you. Ford designs their trucks around rigidity, around strength, and around long lasting parts. Cranking up the HP only shortens the engine's life.
Rambo has som goo quotes, and hopefully will help you understand. I don't mean to come off as a ****, or whatever your problem is, I am simply trying to have a simple debate with you, no need to throw a hussy. Just pick apart my answers and show me where I am wrong.
Your towing a trailer, need to get on the interstate now, you slam the pedal, its torque that drives you forward, its torque the gets that heavy load going, and its Ford higher torque numbers down low, that let you get a heavier load moving sooner and easier on the drivetrain, allowing the drivetrain to last longer, which then equal more reliability, longer lasting life, on the road longer, used as work trucks more, etc etc etc.
Am I Ford biased ? I guess you could say that. Then again, you do realize your on a FORD FORUM, right ? We are nto suppose to be open minded ! lol I have owned dodge, Chevy, Suzuki, Mercedes, and Ford, I have worked on a huge variety of trucks and suv's along with some cars. Ford simply seems built best, toughest, and seems to last the longest. I am not saying the other companies are crap, in any stretch. I am saying if you want the power of the Hemi, buy a hemi. You want the pull of the Yota, buy it. But do realize the high HP comes at a price. These engine wont last as long, wont see as many miles, and eventually wont get you from point A to B and always seems at the worst moment.
Like I have said (and you were willing to pick apart everyone else's comments except mine.... interesting) Ford DOES make a good truck with HIGH HP numbers. The HD edition has higher HP, the Lightning is a all out race truck in my eyes, the things can be wicked fast. They used to offer the Boss version of the 5.4, again more HP. They do offer what you want, and they offer what the majority of people want. Ford does an outstanding job with mass appeal IMO. They have a motor, a body style, even a bed size AND style for just about everyone. Thats not enough for you ? The largest selection of truck ?
Basically what I get from you, is you want bragging rights (nothing wrong with that) ? You want to be able to line up next to your buddy at a light, punch it, and beat him (again, nothing wrong with that) but this isn't what Ford's F series is about, and never has been, thats what mSall was trying to show you. Ford designs their trucks around rigidity, around strength, and around long lasting parts. Cranking up the HP only shortens the engine's life.
Rambo has som goo quotes, and hopefully will help you understand. I don't mean to come off as a ****, or whatever your problem is, I am simply trying to have a simple debate with you, no need to throw a hussy. Just pick apart my answers and show me where I am wrong.
#39
09-12-2008, 11:44 AM
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#40
09-12-2008, 12:38 PM
Well this is the problem with people these days Lumadar. They believe what they see on the on TV and youtube. They see qoutes from Toyota about being the most sold car in the US but what people dont realise is Toyota get that figure by combining 3 car types they make on one production line. Ford could quite easy turn around and say the f series is the best selling but they dont combine the f series sales. A lot of people also believe that they are built stronger than the rest just because Toyota says they are. There was a time when compaired to other brands of truck they was built well. A lot of trucks wernt built well 10+ years ago and toyota with the famous hilux turned that around and everyone had to bring the quality back up again. But no way are they better built than any other truck these days and if anything they have more problems with there car's/truck's than any other big car brand. My bro is a Mechanic and even he admits Toyota trucks aint a spot on ford trucks and he aint a Ford or Toyota person He loves Audi and VW. In the end you have to buy it for what you want it for. If you want the best looking truck which will be a serious work horse then get the Ford. If you want a truck what is fast from the lights get the Toyota and if you want a truck with big numbers for power get the Chevy,Gmc or Dodge. There is a truck designed for everyone and the ford for me just happens to be the truck that fits my needs perfect.
#41
09-12-2008, 04:56 PM
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+20 HP over the current 5.4, more torque at a lot lower RPM than a Chevy, and improved and mileage too?
Sounds good to me!
I do hope they at least OFFER the BOSS engine as an option, if not for the 2009 model year, in future years. But an improved 5.4 is still a great truck engine, you've just gotta love that low RPM torque.
Sounds good to me!
I do hope they at least OFFER the BOSS engine as an option, if not for the 2009 model year, in future years. But an improved 5.4 is still a great truck engine, you've just gotta love that low RPM torque.
#42
09-13-2008, 08:30 PM
Kid your not being realistic, or you don't quite understand how HP and torque work. The latter not being an insult, as I would say 90% or more of America don't quite understand, hence the old "HP" wars of the muscle car days.
Your towing a trailer, need to get on the interstate now, you slam the pedal, its torque that drives you forward, its torque the gets that heavy load going, and its Ford higher torque numbers down low, that let you get a heavier load moving sooner and easier on the drivetrain, allowing the drivetrain to last longer, which then equal more reliability, longer lasting life, on the road longer, used as work trucks more, etc etc etc.
Am I Ford biased ? I guess you could say that. Then again, you do realize your on a FORD FORUM, right ? We are nto suppose to be open minded ! lol I have owned dodge, Chevy, Suzuki, Mercedes, and Ford, I have worked on a huge variety of trucks and suv's along with some cars. Ford simply seems built best, toughest, and seems to last the longest. I am not saying the other companies are crap, in any stretch. I am saying if you want the power of the Hemi, buy a hemi. You want the pull of the Yota, buy it. But do realize the high HP comes at a price. These engine wont last as long, wont see as many miles, and eventually wont get you from point A to B and always seems at the worst moment.
Like I have said (and you were willing to pick apart everyone else's comments except mine.... interesting) Ford DOES make a good truck with HIGH HP numbers. The HD edition has higher HP, the Lightning is a all out race truck in my eyes, the things can be wicked fast. They used to offer the Boss version of the 5.4, again more HP. They do offer what you want, and they offer what the majority of people want. Ford does an outstanding job with mass appeal IMO. They have a motor, a body style, even a bed size AND style for just about everyone. Thats not enough for you ? The largest selection of truck ?
Basically what I get from you, is you want bragging rights (nothing wrong with that) ? You want to be able to line up next to your buddy at a light, punch it, and beat him (again, nothing wrong with that) but this isn't what Ford's F series is about, and never has been, thats what mSall was trying to show you. Ford designs their trucks around rigidity, around strength, and around long lasting parts. Cranking up the HP only shortens the engine's life.
Rambo has som goo quotes, and hopefully will help you understand. I don't mean to come off as a ****, or whatever your problem is, I am simply trying to have a simple debate with you, no need to throw a hussy. Just pick apart my answers and show me where I am wrong.
Your towing a trailer, need to get on the interstate now, you slam the pedal, its torque that drives you forward, its torque the gets that heavy load going, and its Ford higher torque numbers down low, that let you get a heavier load moving sooner and easier on the drivetrain, allowing the drivetrain to last longer, which then equal more reliability, longer lasting life, on the road longer, used as work trucks more, etc etc etc.
Am I Ford biased ? I guess you could say that. Then again, you do realize your on a FORD FORUM, right ? We are nto suppose to be open minded ! lol I have owned dodge, Chevy, Suzuki, Mercedes, and Ford, I have worked on a huge variety of trucks and suv's along with some cars. Ford simply seems built best, toughest, and seems to last the longest. I am not saying the other companies are crap, in any stretch. I am saying if you want the power of the Hemi, buy a hemi. You want the pull of the Yota, buy it. But do realize the high HP comes at a price. These engine wont last as long, wont see as many miles, and eventually wont get you from point A to B and always seems at the worst moment.
Like I have said (and you were willing to pick apart everyone else's comments except mine.... interesting) Ford DOES make a good truck with HIGH HP numbers. The HD edition has higher HP, the Lightning is a all out race truck in my eyes, the things can be wicked fast. They used to offer the Boss version of the 5.4, again more HP. They do offer what you want, and they offer what the majority of people want. Ford does an outstanding job with mass appeal IMO. They have a motor, a body style, even a bed size AND style for just about everyone. Thats not enough for you ? The largest selection of truck ?
Basically what I get from you, is you want bragging rights (nothing wrong with that) ? You want to be able to line up next to your buddy at a light, punch it, and beat him (again, nothing wrong with that) but this isn't what Ford's F series is about, and never has been, thats what mSall was trying to show you. Ford designs their trucks around rigidity, around strength, and around long lasting parts. Cranking up the HP only shortens the engine's life.
Rambo has som goo quotes, and hopefully will help you understand. I don't mean to come off as a ****, or whatever your problem is, I am simply trying to have a simple debate with you, no need to throw a hussy. Just pick apart my answers and show me where I am wrong.
I understand there are limits to each platform and what they can reliably produce powerwise. Honestly, I have never been impressed with Fords mod engines. I think in mustangs and crown vics they are fine but I have always had my doubts in the back of my mind in the trucks. Mind you, I have never owned on in a f150 either. Personally, I think the GM small blocks are bullit proof as you get. The seem to do better on fuel as well but they do have to be revved a bit higher to reach peak power and the torque curve may not be as flat as the Fords now.
I understand peoples frustration with ford being so short on hp. They honestly are not competitive at all there but they did find some nice gains in torque. They have squeezed the 5.4 for all its worth and they just lack the cubic inches to get anymore out of it. I often wonder if they could do it all over again if OHV engines would not have been a better choice. GM has done ok with theirs.
I think also Ford builds the best truck overall as far as being tough. If I were to drive a 5.4 ford and 6.0 GM back to back I may be swayed to the Gm truck. People remember how it feels when they step on the gas far more than how good the frame is built underneath them. Ford fans will just have to live with what they have an maybe the 6 speed will wake up 5.4.
#43
09-13-2008, 08:42 PM
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You make some valid points no doubt. My question is why do you assume that a higher hp engine will not last as long? Im not being a smart a@@ by asking by the way but somehow I have my doubts about this. Sometimes, you can take a smaller engine and work it to death and it will die early simply because it didnt have enough power to begin with. Would a 4.6 last as long doing the exact same work as a 5.4? It has to work harder so I doubt it would.
I understand there are limits to each platform and what they can reliably produce powerwise. Honestly, I have never been impressed with Fords mod engines. I think in mustangs and crown vics they are fine but I have always had my doubts in the back of my mind in the trucks. Mind you, I have never owned on in a f150 either. Personally, I think the GM small blocks are bullit proof as you get. The seem to do better on fuel as well but they do have to be revved a bit higher to reach peak power and the torque curve may not be as flat as the Fords now.
I understand peoples frustration with ford being so short on hp. They honestly are not competitive at all there but they did find some nice gains in torque. They have squeezed the 5.4 for all its worth and they just lack the cubic inches to get anymore out of it. I often wonder if they could do it all over again if OHV engines would not have been a better choice. GM has done ok with theirs.
I think also Ford builds the best truck overall as far as being tough. If I were to drive a 5.4 ford and 6.0 GM back to back I may be swayed to the Gm truck. People remember how it feels when they step on the gas far more than how good the frame is built underneath them. Ford fans will just have to live with what they have an maybe the 6 speed will wake up 5.4.
I understand there are limits to each platform and what they can reliably produce powerwise. Honestly, I have never been impressed with Fords mod engines. I think in mustangs and crown vics they are fine but I have always had my doubts in the back of my mind in the trucks. Mind you, I have never owned on in a f150 either. Personally, I think the GM small blocks are bullit proof as you get. The seem to do better on fuel as well but they do have to be revved a bit higher to reach peak power and the torque curve may not be as flat as the Fords now.
I understand peoples frustration with ford being so short on hp. They honestly are not competitive at all there but they did find some nice gains in torque. They have squeezed the 5.4 for all its worth and they just lack the cubic inches to get anymore out of it. I often wonder if they could do it all over again if OHV engines would not have been a better choice. GM has done ok with theirs.
I think also Ford builds the best truck overall as far as being tough. If I were to drive a 5.4 ford and 6.0 GM back to back I may be swayed to the Gm truck. People remember how it feels when they step on the gas far more than how good the frame is built underneath them. Ford fans will just have to live with what they have an maybe the 6 speed will wake up 5.4.
What I meant by shortening the life, was based on the 5.4 platform. By cranking up its HP numbers, making mods, and tuning it for maximum HP gains, will shorten its life span. The high compression, the high torque loads, the higher strain on the drivetrain and the entire truck in general just take its toll far quicker.
Would I be mad if Ford went with a new engine ? Heck no, and eventually I think they will drop this modular motor, and go back to a more traditional gasser, or better yet, introduce more diesel options (
)I wouldn't mind running a 6.5 or larger engine, having the bigger HP numbers, but I also want Ford to stay true to it's "Built Ford Tough" and being one of the hardest working, longest lasting trucks out there. To crank up the HP numbers, just for the sake of having higher HP.... I guess just isn't for me. I like the "real world" power the Ford provides.
#44
09-13-2008, 08:49 PM
You make some valid points no doubt. My question is why do you assume that a higher hp engine will not last as long? Im not being a smart a@@ by asking by the way but somehow I have my doubts about this. Sometimes, you can take a smaller engine and work it to death and it will die early simply because it didnt have enough power to begin with. Would a 4.6 last as long doing the exact same work as a 5.4? It has to work harder so I doubt it would.
I understand there are limits to each platform and what they can reliably produce powerwise. Honestly, I have never been impressed with Fords mod engines. I think in mustangs and crown vics they are fine but I have always had my doubts in the back of my mind in the trucks. Mind you, I have never owned on in a f150 either. Personally, I think the GM small blocks are bullit proof as you get. The seem to do better on fuel as well but they do have to be revved a bit higher to reach peak power and the torque curve may not be as flat as the Fords now.
I understand peoples frustration with ford being so short on hp. They honestly are not competitive at all there but they did find some nice gains in torque. They have squeezed the 5.4 for all its worth and they just lack the cubic inches to get anymore out of it. I often wonder if they could do it all over again if OHV engines would not have been a better choice. GM has done ok with theirs.
I think also Ford builds the best truck overall as far as being tough. If I were to drive a 5.4 ford and 6.0 GM back to back I may be swayed to the Gm truck. People remember how it feels when they step on the gas far more than how good the frame is built underneath them. Ford fans will just have to live with what they have an maybe the 6 speed will wake up 5.4.
I understand there are limits to each platform and what they can reliably produce powerwise. Honestly, I have never been impressed with Fords mod engines. I think in mustangs and crown vics they are fine but I have always had my doubts in the back of my mind in the trucks. Mind you, I have never owned on in a f150 either. Personally, I think the GM small blocks are bullit proof as you get. The seem to do better on fuel as well but they do have to be revved a bit higher to reach peak power and the torque curve may not be as flat as the Fords now.
I understand peoples frustration with ford being so short on hp. They honestly are not competitive at all there but they did find some nice gains in torque. They have squeezed the 5.4 for all its worth and they just lack the cubic inches to get anymore out of it. I often wonder if they could do it all over again if OHV engines would not have been a better choice. GM has done ok with theirs.
I think also Ford builds the best truck overall as far as being tough. If I were to drive a 5.4 ford and 6.0 GM back to back I may be swayed to the Gm truck. People remember how it feels when they step on the gas far more than how good the frame is built underneath them. Ford fans will just have to live with what they have an maybe the 6 speed will wake up 5.4.
#45
09-13-2008, 08:58 PM
Lol there you go again about another truck being quicker. It's a truck man not a race car. My bro in law has 2007 GMC Denali with the 6.2-liter Vortec and i can tell you now that it is no quicker than my 4.7l suv with 230bhp. I have drove his car many a time and they feel about the same in performance. also how do you work out they are not competative?? They can tow more than the other trucks and they have TQ figures that are up there with the others. In the end you could have 10hp and 10000ft/lb of torque on your truck but im sure you would still think its better to have more HP. Sounds like you want a motorbike mate???