1997 - 2003 F-150

Cruise control still fails after recall fix

Old Feb 4, 2014 | 10:00 PM
  #16  
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To browniefranklin;
You clearly have issues other than the cruise control electronics.
1. hard brake pedal is not from the cruise control action.
You have a brake system issue you need to solve first.
If you cannot apply pressure to the master cylinder, the pressure switch will not cut off cruise control.
If the pedal will not go far enough to operate the brake pedal off normal switch it will not apply power to the cruise control to inhibit it.
Not being able to shut the cruise off by either the on/off switch or the interrupt switch is not really the case.
Why; because the throttle was already stuck at high rpm with the motor driving the truck whether cruise was engaged or not.

2. the high rpm stick could be be associated with the cruise control cable and may be connected to the cruise control module drive. I have doubt that is the cause.
You need to investigate the mechanics from the throttle all the way back to the module drive for some issue, even water freeze up and all the mechanics involved..
Also the brake issue happening at the same time is suspect.
Two different systems to many items appear to be involved at the same time causes the doubt.
Anything going on in the cab to interfere with braking and throttle since the two come close together in that area?
I don't doubt you had a hair raising experience but a stackup if things likely had happened.
Recommend you do the Cruise Control diagnostics to see if there is a problem with that system.
Brake system first, throttle mechanic second , CC third.
Let us know what you find.
Good luck.
 
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Old Feb 4, 2014 | 10:59 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Bluegrass
To browniefranklin;
You clearly have issues other than the cruise control electronics.
1. hard brake pedal is not from the cruise control action.
You have a brake system issue you need to solve first.
If you cannot apply pressure to the master cylinder, the pressure switch will not cut off cruise control.
If the pedal will not go far enough to operate the brake pedal off normal switch it will not apply power to the cruise control to inhibit it.
Not being able to shut the cruise off by either the on/off switch or the interrupt switch is not really the case.
Why; because the throttle was already stuck at high rpm with the motor driving the truck whether cruise was engaged or not.

2. the high rpm stick could be be associated with the cruise control cable and may be connected to the cruise control module drive. I have doubt that is the cause.
You need to investigate the mechanics from the throttle all the way back to the module drive for some issue, even water freeze up and all the mechanics involved..
Also the brake issue happening at the same time is suspect.
Two different systems to many items appear to be involved at the same time causes the doubt.
Anything going on in the cab to interfere with braking and throttle since the two come close together in that area?
I don't doubt you had a hair raising experience but a stackup if things likely had happened.
Recommend you do the Cruise Control diagnostics to see if there is a problem with that system.
Brake system first, throttle mechanic second , CC third.
Let us know what you find.
Good luck.
The brake never stopped working. The pedal was just harder to press than normal and I was able to slow the vehicle down by pressing harder. When the cruise control finally disengaged, the brake pedal felt normal and has been fine ever since. It could be that the pedal just felt harder because the engine still wanted to go 74 MPH and it wasn't a normal braking experience. Come to think of it, the brake felt normal while the engine was racing in neutral.

I took the vehicle to the Ford dealership and they diagnosed the problem as a bad cruise control module and wanted over $850 to fix it. I paid them $90 to disconnect it and won't be going back. I also checked to be sure the accelerator wasn't stuck while the cruise control wasn't disengaging and I couldn't pull it up with my foot.

I'm not a mechanic, but as I understand the cruise control system the on/off button on the steering wheel is suppose to operate independent of the brake switch that is located in master cylinder. I am absolutely certain that both switches failed to turn the cruise control off.
 
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Old Feb 4, 2014 | 11:25 PM
  #18  
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That's one way to solve the problem.
A control module from a yard would be no more then about $60 to replace it.
The problem I have in understanding all this is the following.
If you feel the brakes were working normal, the power for the system comes through the pressure switch on the master cylinder.
If that switch saw pressure from your pedal operation and the switch was not faulty, it has to open power to the CC module.
The power does not come from any other source.
My pedal pressure does not vary with speed of the motor or the moving speed of the truck.
I just wanted to make that clear for you.
Otherwise your happy, i'm happy with it.
Good luck
 
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Old Feb 5, 2014 | 10:57 AM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Bluegrass
That's one way to solve the problem.
A control module from a yard would be no more then about $60 to replace it.
The problem I have in understanding all this is the following.
If you feel the brakes were working normal, the power for the system comes through the pressure switch on the master cylinder.
If that switch saw pressure from your pedal operation and the switch was not faulty, it has to open power to the CC module.
The power does not come from any other source.
My pedal pressure does not vary with speed of the motor or the moving speed of the truck.
I just wanted to make that clear for you.
Otherwise your happy, i'm happy with it.
Good luck
Another area of concern is that the dealership is saying the problem is with the control module and not the brake switch. The brake switch was the subject of a massive recall including the 2003 Ford F-150. My truck is a 2004 F-150 Heritage which is virtually identical except for the Heritage designation. Could a faulty brake switch cause the control module to fail? The brake switches that failed were causing fires even when the vehicle is turned off and the fact that I smelled smoke leads me to believe that mechanic at the dealership may not be digging deep enough. I have a mechanic that I trust looking into the problem and I'm confident he will investigate all of the possible causes. The brake switch is only a $20 part and I'm plan to replace it regardless of what the mechanic finds.
 
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Old Feb 5, 2014 | 01:54 PM
  #20  
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The fuse in the recall harness is supposed to blow if the switch shorts out.
 
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Old Feb 5, 2014 | 03:37 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by glc
The fuse in the recall harness is supposed to blow if the switch shorts out.
Unfortunately Ford never recalled the 2004 Heritage and to my knowledge it doesn't have a fuse in the harness.
 
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Old Feb 5, 2014 | 04:00 PM
  #22  
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That's because the 2004 Heritage came with the improved "fixed" switch from the factory, as did my 2003.
 
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Old Feb 5, 2014 | 06:43 PM
  #23  
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Sounds like your servo jammed mechanically, not due to an electrical fault.
 
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Old Feb 5, 2014 | 07:15 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by projectSHO89
Sounds like your servo jammed mechanically, not due to an electrical fault.
Has anyone else experience this problem? Does anyone have an idea of what would cause it to jam? What caused it to smoke?
 
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Old Feb 6, 2014 | 01:48 PM
  #25  
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You see where the controller is mounted with I think 3 bolts.
It has a long multi lead connector and throttle control cable locks into the top in a plastic type mount.
Look it all over first. Remove the cable form the controller and test movement to be sure it works freely.
The cable is driven by an internal servo motor controlled by the electronics with feed back signals from outside sources, as speed and load changes.
A diagnostics from the steering wheel switches test this cable drive at the end of it's tests.
When you replace this unit you can test all the functions to be sure no faults are detected.
What you experienced is somewhat rare and not the normal type failure or it would have been addressed as serious long ago because the design has not changes since at least 1997 as used on the whole line of trucks and SUV.
Like anything else, anything can happen anytime to any part.
Good luck.
 
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Old Feb 6, 2014 | 08:05 PM
  #26  
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Thanks, I'll have my mechanic check it out.
 
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Old Feb 8, 2014 | 05:28 PM
  #27  
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I took the truck out on the expressway today for the first time since having the cruise control disconnected. Lo and behold, the accelerator stuck again and the pedal wouldn't move either up or down. It was stuck at the same speed as last time and I was going 70 to 74 MPH. By the time I limped back to the Ford dealership my brakes were so hot they would barely stop the truck with both feet pressing on the brake pedal. I fishtailed through snowy parking lot and turned the key off to stop. By then the brakes were smoking. The Ford dealership service department was closed today so I had it towed to my regular mechanic. They verified that the cruise control electronics are disconnected but weren't able to duplicate the problem by the end of the day. They'll get back on it Monday. If anyone has any clues as to what may be going on I'd sure like to hear from you. Also, the truck hadn't been in the garage and it was 6 degrees this Morning. It was also cold last Sunday.
 

Last edited by browniefranklin; Feb 8, 2014 at 05:32 PM. Reason: fat fingers
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Old Feb 8, 2014 | 10:59 PM
  #28  
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Without someone knowledgeable looking at the 'whole' situation this is a very strange set of afairs.
The only place CC gets close to the brakes is the pressure switch in the end of the master cylinder. Otherwise there is no other connection.
The throttle cable bind has to be a problem with the cable or throttle body linkage back the pedal in the cab.. Cable damaged, water in the cable etc.
Change the cable if it binds.
The brakes locking up at the same time would seem to indicate some physical or electrical issue with the anti lock system right under the master cylinder.
If the pedal was hard it tells me the master cylinder was not able to move fluid out to the calipers because there was already pressure to them.You can't move anymore fluid with the brake pedal under those conditions.
You should have felt the brake drag long before finding the brakes are already locked up in pressure.
Is the master cylinder in fault? Was it ever worked on? Is the check valve in place or faulty in the hose to the vacuum unit?
Don't drive the truck again especially at those speeds and endanger other drivers until it is "all" solved and accounted for. No guessing.
You have a accident and it's proven you knew you have a problem, your in deep do do over it.
Something tells me something has come apart causing all this to happen.
I feel the CC was not the original problem because to much of it did not make any sense. This is why I kept ******* it.
Let us know how it all turns out.
Good luck..
 
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Old Feb 8, 2014 | 11:23 PM
  #29  
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Bluegrass, I might have missed something here, but I think his reference to the brakes is that he has to ride the snot out of them because the motor is stuck on 900mph.

He needs to go over the whole throttle system from the pedal to the TB. Sounds as if something is worn out or broken.

Also when it is fixed he probably needs to do a fluid change on the brakes because he got everything so hot.

I'd also suspect that if he tests the CC system it could be ok. Having it disconnected obviously didn't fix or change anything.

Don't take anything I said as bagging on you please. You are very sharp and methodical and I've learned a lot from you!
 
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Old Feb 8, 2014 | 11:42 PM
  #30  
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I don't know if the 5.4 is the same way, but I had the plastic doghouse over the throttle body come loose on my 4.2 and jam the throttle open.

I agree - there's no brake issue, this is strictly something somewhere that's jamming the throttle open. It has to be physical, the clue here is you say that the pedal wouldn't move up OR down. Maybe the TB is filthy and the throttle plate is binding up?
 
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