i have seen the topic of synthetics alot. my qusetion is why did you(or would you switch to sythetics?
1. better performance.
2. better milege
3. longer engine life
4. cost
5. any other reason

i ran synthetic in my mustang and here is my thoughts.
1. i ran it at the track no performace increase.
2. gas milege was the same.
3. i have driven 6 vehicles to well over 100,000 miles with no oil related problems. I know people with 200,000 plus miles with no oil problem.
4. cost is better (maybe) only if you change the synthetic every 10,000 to 15,000 miles. i like taking my truck for service every 3000 miles to have all the fluids checked. just my opion what do you think?

 

I just recently switched to Amsoils full synthetic 5w-30. Basically, my statements are exactly the same as yours.

1. Performance is no better.. But I didn't expect it to be.
2. mileage is no better. Again, I didn't expect it to be.
3. Worst case, its protecting the engine at least as good as normal Dino oils. The better flow on cold starts of the Amsoil can only help matters. I have 194k miles on my old 89' Ranger using dino oils, changing every 3k miles.
4. Cost is roughly the same as with dino oils if you goto the extended drain intervals. I plan to have an oil analysis done at 6 months to confirm the oil is still doing its job. If it is, then I'll keep it in in for the rest of the year, (expecting around 14k miles). The oil is rated for 1 year or 25k miles, so I think I'll be ok. I plan on changing the oil filter every 3k miles as recommended.
I won't really believe what others say until I see the results of the oil analysis myself..

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Y2K F250 XLT SC 4x2 5.4L 5sp 4.10LS

 

I've tried Synthetic products (Amsoil) in 3 vehicles so far and I found the following:

1) Better performance proved by lower consistent time to MPH.
2) Better MPG (Got 1 - 3 MPG increase each time).
3) Better temperature protection, each vehicle started easier, ran smoother and had a lower RPM for a given speed (60 MPH).
4) I have run 3 Vehicle (only one of these above) over 100,000 miles and have lost two to oil/filtration related problems. So I'm done gambling with vehicles.
5) I have done oil analysis on only the most recent vehicle and am impressed with the results (which prove the stated longevity).

I really can't say enough about the products, but it depends on how you use your vehicle, how long you want to keep it, and how much performance/efficiency you want out of your vehicle. Certain applications just won't add up for you.

Hope this helps.

Randy

 

RandyW
1. how much quicker was your e.t., how much faster was your m.p.h.
2. 3 mpg better? hard to believe can anyone else back that up?
3.starts easier .. my 97' f250 starts so fast i could not imagine it starting faster. and lower rpm at given speed (this one blows all your credibility) gears change rpm cruise speed not horsepower or less friction. a v6 with 200 h.p. and a lightning with 360 h.p., with the same tire size and rear gears turn the same r.p.m. at 60.
Now who do you work for is it maybe amsoil?

 

I just switched to Amsoil 0W30 with an Amsoil filter. Not expecting anything great, but am interested in greater protection for the engine. Mileage may improve, currently 14 -15 in the city, but I don't see how performance will improve. Would like to see some numbers.

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97 F-150 Lariat, Leather, Ext. Cab
White/Champagne, 4.6L, Auto.
Tinted Windows/Bedmat
Toolbox/Lund Bug Deflector
Dual Exhaust
Grille Guard
Chrome bed rails
265/70/16 Goodyear Wrangler Rt/S

 

I have seen literature with numbers from dyno'd cars that showed 2.22 hp increase when comparing the 0w30 to castrol 10w30.

Also I believe that Redline has a bunch of info on hp increases. click on the dyno button: http://www.redlineoil.com/

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Lube-Direct


New Lubrication Forums

 

the car in the article was a corvette. the corvette picked up 2.22 h.p for a gain of about .7% on a 5.4 truck that is about 1.8 h.p. i dont know the difference in price so i guess if 1.8 h.p. means something to you than do it. i think if it helped gas milege to the tune of 1 to 3 m.p.g. there is no where on earth you could go and not see advertising stating that, especially with the current prices of gas. this board is for 97 thru 2001 ford truck, i have seen no great number of people having to rebuild their engines or complaining of oil related problems that synthetic would have solved. also even though sythetic can last 25000 mile you would still have to do a filter change every now and then, and then add oil.
with the car makers having to meet tough fuel milege requirement,if it got even 1 mpg better wouldnt everyone be using it, dont tell me it is the added expense because the automakers spend a fortune tryng to meet regulation.

 

I just bought my SCrew, about to have the first oil change at 3000 miles. I will be using Mobil 1 Synthetic 5W-30.

My company distributes industrial lubricants and we sell quite a bit of synthetic fluids to the industrial community. While you cannot directly compare industrial useage to a Ford V-8, there are similarites.

I do not expect to see much if any mpg or hp gain. What I do expect is to have lower operating temps and better lubrication. I also know that I will not be the perfect 3000 mile oil change person, so the longer life of the Mobil 1 will allow me a more user friendly 5000 miles between changes.

I just think the use of synthetics is a good investment to protect a expensive piece of machinery. If it is good enough for companies to use on their 250K pieces of industrial machinery, then it is good enough for my beloved Ford. I will say that if you use regular oil and change it faithfully at 3000K then you will not have any problems.

I enjoy your posts.



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MIKEnTN

2001 Ford F-150 XLT SuperCrew 4x4
Toreador Red with Silver Two Tone, Med. Graphite Int., 5.4 V-8, 3.55 Limited Slip, Class III towing, Skid Plates, 17" Alum Wheels, Sliding Rear Window, Remote Keyless Entry, Rhino Liner.

AWESOME Truck!

 

The gas milage thing is kind of misunderstood.
Now if we can take this in terms of percentages that might make more sense.

For instance I have some literature where Class 8 trucks were changed over. The whole drive train was changed over to synthetics with control vehicles using conventional lubes and only using certain lenghts of Highway on the same days under the exact same conditions.

The best that was gained was 8.2%. Which in terms of mpg's is only about 1/2 mile per gallon.

Imagine a fleet of 100 class 8 vehicles running an average 120,000 miles per year at an average 6.5mpg with diesel fuel at $1.20 a gallon(right!). The fleet spends $2,215,385 on fuel annually.

Now imagine the fleet improving by 8.2%(.5mgpg) The fleet now only spends $2,047,490 on fuel annually.

For a total savings of $167,895, about enough to buy fuel for 3-6 trucks for the entire year!!

Does this all make sense?

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Lube-Direct


New Lubrication Forums

 

I can pass along my experience on boat engines. I have a 23 Chris Craft with a 350 Chevy engine, and did not see any performance gains with Mobil 1. This was a good test, as I often ran top end for long periods, and top speed was the same.
On Mercury 2 cycle outboards, it is not recommended to use synthetic oil for break-in. The engines just show no wear, and the rings just don't seat, and the engines just don't break-in, due to the superior lubrication.

 

BrotherDave,

"...ask and it shall be given unto you.."

Track times dropped on average .3-.6 seconds.

Track speed increase on average 5-7 mph.

The starting easier came from long experience with two vehciles, but as your's is newer by about 6 years that may be a significant difference in technology.

Careful now. Lower speed at a given RPM, if static, say 65 mph for several miles eliminates all mechanical means as a cause. The road was flat, temperatures were similar, car load was the same, tire pressures were the same, etc, etc. So when one run was at 2300 RPM and another is at 2100 RPM, the transmission, gearing and other mechanical items are not a consideration.

Nope, don't work for Amsoil, but like the fact that they are 1 of only two oil companies on the market for gasoline engines that offers extended drains & increased protection.

To be fair, the lowest MPG increase I have seen was on a 1994 Lexus SC300 which only got .8 MPG increase. Which is impressive since the fellow cruises at 85MPH most of the time....

Randy

 

randy..claims of .3 to .6 quicker amd 5 to 7 m.p.h. are absolutely rediculous. that would represent gains of about 25 to 40 h.p not the 2 or 3 on redlines web sight. POST that b.s. on the lightning or the aftermarket board for computerchips and see what kind of response you get. those guy run at the track week in and week out. if you can drop a new lightning .3 for under 100 bucks, u will be a rich man. once you geet the speed bug you will do anything to go .1 faster and i have seen the subject of synthetic mentioned very little. dont really understand what you are saying about changing r.p.m at a certain cruise speed without changing tire size or gears and i still stand by what i say that cruising r.p.m. can not change with a switch in motor oil.
i will be looking for your post on the lightning page, should be interesting the response this subject geets. better yet i will post the question and lets see the responce it geets.

 

Few comments, cause I just can't be quiet anymore..

I see msparks point. It takes alot of miles (or alot of vehicles) to get enough statistics to conclusivly show that there is a 1/2 mpg advantge to using synthetics.. But if it really does give 1/2 mpg, then:
if you drive 200K miles at 15.0 vs 15.5mpg there's only 430 gallons difference of fuel used, (about $630).
It takes me about 10 years to drive 200k miles, which means I might be able to save $63 a year.

Randyw:
Sorry, I have to agree with BROTHERDAVE on the point that it's not possible for engine oil to cause an engine to run lower RPM for a giving MPH.

Assuming a manual tranny:
Every full turn of the engine, will drive the tranny input shaft a fixed amount. The output shaft/drive shaft will rotate a fixed amount, the rear axle rotate a fixed amount, the rear wheel will rotate the same amount as the axle, thus the distance traveled per 1 revolution of the engine is fixed.

With an auto tranny, there some slipage in the tranny during accleration, but once your at the constant speed most modern trannys have torque converter locks, thus eliminating slipage. I guess if you have an old auto tranny without the torque converter lock, its possible to see a difference in RPM vs MPH, but I doubt it would be measurable.

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Y2K F250 XLT SC 4x2 5.4L 5sp 4.10LS

 

Well I certainly don't run synthetics because of cost factor. There might be a slight savings in the long run, however this is not my motivation at all.

Cost not being an issue. I run the best quality fluids I can find for any application because,

a. Longer drain intervals (longer fluid life)

b. Supposed superior protection

I say supposed because I honestly think if you run dyno and change it like clockwork, your systems should operate almost flawlessly anyways.

A longer drain interval is important to be because time is money. So in that sense, it saves me money, because instead of spending time under the truck, I'm in the truck bidding a job or making something happen. Just my 2 cents.

I have synlube "lifetime lube" 100k mi. syn 5w30 in the crankcase. LE 7500 AlisonC4/Mercon in the trans case. synlube mileage diff in the pumpkins(pre-friction modified).

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97 XLT SC 3:55, 4.6L, 3.5" Fabtech coils w/arms & 2" add-a-leafs, snug lid, Tow package, 6CD, Auto, BFG 285/75/16 on stock alloys
immediate any-day-now mods: Trans-go stage 2 (using stage 1)
someday mods: 3" spindles, centerline rims with 35's
<creativepen@yahoo.com>

 

Hmmm, seems a bit frosty in here!!!!

Brotherdave,

The gains mentioned really are not that big of a deal, especially when you consider averages of a given engine and what it was desinged to do in the first place.

Take a common aftermarket EPROM (Superchips, Diablosport,etc) they routinely increase HP on the smallest engines by 10-15%. How do they do this??? Simply by making the fuel/ignition mapping more efficient than the garbage that comes to us from the factory. Did you know that most modern engines are mapped to work efficiently ONLY at WOT!!!

So if I have an engine/transmission that is being lubed with an oil that does not reduce friction well, that does not stay on the metal, that does not protect against wear that well, I will have an engine who has a portion of its rated HP that is 'lost' to inefficient operation.

By running with an oil that eliminates most of the above problems, you will 'rescue' HP/torque that was already there, but couldn't be used.

This is the same idea that aftermarket exhaust headers provide. Stock engines are terribly restricted and the more capable an engine you have, the more HP/Torque you will 'rescue'.

Obviously if we are talking between a stock Taurus and a 'stock' lightning we are talking too widely seperate things. Apples and Oranges.... The 'stock' lightning is designed much better than the stock Taurus for using its available power, as one would be a bit offended of having to modify a Lightning because it doesn't perform well.

The gain you get depends on what you start with, and what you have to work with. I'm sure that our Lightning friends would agree, if they've spent any time at all in engines for racing (or any other purpose for that matter).

I may very well be off on the MPH/RPM function as the level of wind resistance increase to the third power over the square of the area. I may have made my runs in effects of different air density, which could have a huge effect on this.

However, the specifics are the same. Why do aircraft of most types and ALL aircraft with turbine engines use synthetic lubricants??? Why has every auto. manufacturer gone to 'synthetic' (watch the definiton on this one as it solely relates to performance, not what makes up the fluid) in every place in the vehicle. Why has BMW gone to Mobil 1 and 12,000 mile oil changes?? Why has Corvette come with Mobil 1 for years now and will void your warranty with any oil that doesn't 'at least' have the capabilities of Mobil 1??

Brotherdave, you and I may simply have to disagree on this one. You may also choose to not use synthetics in your vehicle. That is just fine. However, the added benefits of synthetics cannot really be denied. It just depends if you want that added protection of your vehicle or not. Changes are, your engine is so over-designed for what you will do with it, that even the lowest calibre oil will take 150,000 miles to cause enough damage for you to notice.

I have had good experience with synthetics, and have seen improvments in every vehicle that I've seen them used in. But if you have enough, than go with what works for you.

Randy