I would think the same thing . But whats strange about that is when he ran it that last time and ended up at the dealership, the tech pulled the plug and it WAS NOT bent again. I'm thinking he must have sucked it out the cylinder and didn't realize it when he vacuumed it out.

Idunno, I would do a little more to it - at least try to get 5 to fire since it seams whatever was in there is now gone.

 

If the piston is damaged it's not much longer for this world and when it goes it will probably turn the block and the head on that side into a boat anchor. Pulling it apart now will let you get away with a new piston and some head work.

 

I agree with getting fire first! It does sound fishy, but, I believe I have read about one other person having bent plugs, with the same causes. I will search and be for sure. But, MAINLY, you need fire before you change your motor. The MULE HAS A SPRAINED ANKLE, NOT A BROKEN HOCK! DON'T SHOOT IT YET!

 

Am I wrong or right, that the 98 has the same head as the 2001?

Anyone?

Heres you a smorgusbourg! https://www.f150online.com/forums/se...archid=1394556

 

Link doesn't work

They changed the heads in 99 .. 98's are non-PI - 99''s are PI Heads.

But , that really doesn't matter in this case , see if you can find the rest of that link , I want to check that out. Yea, I would get it to fire and run her until she drops.. Theres a good chance that it won't make a bit of difference with a few scratches on top of the piston

 

I see what your saying , how much is it going to cost the guy? If it was me, well , you know what I think

 

Man! what luck you are having! Readin through the post here and just want to throw something else out there. oil getting past the valve guides/seals. maybee some oil is gettin down one of the guides, on to the valve and fouling the plug causing the misfire. any oil consumption that you have noticed?
as far as the bent plug thing? someone must have dropped it as they were changing them out on a friday afternoon, and forgot to re check the gap!

 

First of all thank for all the suggestions.

The motor has been burning about a quart or so between oil changes (every 3-4K). The tech took off the valve cover to check for cam follower issues because the I told him that I have been hearing a noise on the drivers side valve train area and the noise seems to get much worse while the engine is misfiring.

Some history:
I have been hearing some slight noise on the drivers side for about a month. Seemed to really notice it after being out of town for a month and not driving the truck. I also notice a about a month ago when I was traveling on the freeway and accelerated hard to pass someone, that the engine just started shuttering and appeared to misfire. (no backfires and very little tach jump, which I am attributing to some large damping on the tach) If I backed off on the throttle it stopped then continue until I pulled off the road at the next exit and it came down to a good idle. I just pulled back on the freeway and continued my trip with no other problems.

The truck had 100K so I did some tune up/maintenance items including plugs, fuel filter, COP, Trans Filter & Fluid.

The noise in the valve train seemed to be getting slightly worse, but nothing that the tech doing the filter flush seemed to concerned about. (but it sure bugged me)

Then the engine shuttering/misfires started occuring more often and at lower speeds. After doing some work on the truck in my garage I let it warm up and as it came to temp it started running really rough for about 1 minute then started running smooth again.

I drove down town about 10miles and it ran ok.

The next day I was driving to an appointment and it started running rough after about 5 minutes and this time the noise in the valve train sounded much worse, I made it to the appt and then after the appt on restart the engine was missing and running very rough and was noisy. It would not idle at all so I had to keep some throttle at stop signs.

I headed for the Ford dealer and right before entering there parking lot the engine started running better (valve noise still present) but not misfiring or at least not enough to affect the idle. The check engine light came on about the same time the engine started running smoother. (code was cylinder #5 misfire).

I am also still puzzled by how rough the engine runs at times if the only problem is #5 not firing I would expect the engine to continue to idle. When it was going through a rough and noisy spell it would not hardly run at all.


I am headed back to the dealer tomorrow afternoon. I will probably asked to see the bore scope photo's of the cylinder damage (my guess is they wont have any) but I would like to see the damage for myself before deciding what to do next.

Currently, my thought is to drive or tow it back home and pull the head myself (depending on the scope results) and decide whether or not to just fix the head (if I can find what is causing the problem) or to either rebuild or buy a rebuilt engine. I am not really the type to spend $1000-$1500 to just repair the 1 cylinder when I could spend another $1000 and get a complete rebuilt engine.

As for all of the comments related to plugs and cops, I get the idea that it should be firing if it has fuel, spark and compression. But I still have a few symptoms that don't fit the easy fixes:
1. abnormal noise in the valve train
2. oil fouled plug on #5
3. 2 of 3 bent plug in #5 (good news though that the last one was not)

Again thanks for all the support

 

As for the bent plug, no I changed it and it was not dropped. Believe me if I could explain that one away as something I screwed up I would be happy. The tip was not bent flat but move sideways and down and had more than 1 mark on it.

The original plug pulled (that ran 100K) also appeared that the tip was bent. I tried to blame that one on Ford until I saw the second one.

 

I really have to stand by my diagnosis - there is something quite wrong inside that cylinder somewhere - and you probably won't be able to really see what it is till the head is off. I'm thinking you may have pieces missing from a valve or valve seat. I don't know how visible that would be through a borescope.

Extending my guesses a bit - abnormal valve train noise? Might be a valve that's not closing all the way, this will cause noise exactly the same as a loose or stuck lifter/follower. Why isn't the valve closing all the way? A deposit of some sort on the valve mating surface or seat. Oil fouling? Cracked ring or scored valve stem allowing oil past the seal. Whatever, this all points to a head-off examination.

It's also possible that you may have dropped a screw or something into the intake at one time and it found its way into the cylinder.

I think it's time to start thinking like a mechanic instead of a technician, if you know what I mean. This may becoming a lost art.

 

If he did have a burnt value and it broke off he would lose compression right,
if some one work on the truck and dropped some thing in the intake track it could take awhile before it got to the cylinder take a while to get beat up in the cylinder then go out the exhaust ????

 

maybe even a small piece of the valve guide itself went through it

 

Well, I went to the dealer and talked to the tech who did the work. He said he just borrowed a bore scope from of the other tech's and he said he thought the cylinder was damaged and he could not see the valves. he was rather non committal on the amount of damage he actually saw.

Does anyone have a source for a low cost bore scope, web cam, etc.. that will fit through the plug hole? (yes, I know I am just delaying the inevitable head removal but I am just curious)

I am planning on going to see if I can drive the truck home (~5 miles) tomorrow and prepare for a head removal.

Any words of wisdom to get the dealer to reduce the $400 bill for just telling me that it's broken?

I have an old HAYNES repair book for the 1997 F150, I have not read it completely but I was wondering if anyone else has pulled a head on one of these and what special tools are required and any words or cautions etc..

Thanks

 

I already told you what to do - I think your foolish not to listen IMO - go for it .. why are you removing the head ? Specially after your last experience at the dealership...You have compression - You have compression- You have compression- YOU HAVE COMPRESSION.. - Just wanted to get that in one more time .. The problem is electrical..

 

JBrew,

I was expecting a response from you, Ouch!!. I do appreciate your help and I am listening.

I have been looking online for motorcraft plugs in my area, but only the dealer seems to have them (unless I order online for ~$5ea) Also, their are 2 plugs shown an SP459 and also a AWSF22E (which is what was in mine originally). What is the difference?

Now that were back on the subject of plugs where exactly does the dielectric grease go. The old COPs only had it on the inside of the spark plug boot on the plug end. I also saw grease on the COP primary wire connectors and on the injector wire connectors.

Where would you suggest it go?

I was planning on working through your recommendation above related to testing spark using an old COP and plug to see how the spark compares between 2 adjacent sets of primary plug wires.

I don't want to pull the head, but if the engine sounds like it's got marbles bouncing around the intake it may be necessary.

again thanks to all who have been providing ideas and things to check.