Oh, and I said that more people want it......not buy it! Thats economics. If they were priced the same I would bet that more people would get the 93. But thats a guess

 

Allright, thanks for the input guys. I appreciate the info that I recieved even from the disputors! I get that there really isnt a difference between the two unless I get a custom tune for the higher octane. (which I did). So on that note I am finished with this thread, we kind of got of topic and into talking about things that dont matter. Have a good one guys and take care

 

You guys are funny. Here's the poop right from the horse's mouth. The American Petroleum Institute says:

Octane number is a measurement of fuel’s resistance to engine knock. Engine knock is an abnormal combustion associated with using gasoline with too low of an octane number. Ordinarily, your vehicle will not benefit from using a higher octane than is recommended in the owner’s manual.

Engine Knock:
But if your engine knocks or pings at the recommend octane level, you may need a higher octane gasoline to prevent the knock. Knocking may occur under certain conditions. A small percentage of vehicles may knock because of variations in engines of the same model due to manufacturing tolerances, or because of an unusual build-up of engine deposits during the first 15,000 miles of driving. Other factors, such as extremely hot weather, changes in altitude or hard driving conditions (like towing a heavy load) may also cause knocking.

Knock Sensors:
Many modern vehicles are equipped with an electronic device that detects and eliminates light knocking before you can hear it. The devices suppress knock by retarding the spark. Those vehicles may experience some deterioration of acceleration performance, without knocking, when operating with lower octane gasolines. In this case, a higher octane number could improve acceleration.

Octane Levels:
The most common levels of octane grade are 87 (regular), 89 (mid-grade) and 91-93 (premium). The octane number of the gasolines offered for sale are set by gasoline refiners and marketers based on their perception of the technical and competitive needs in the market. Federal and most state regulations do not regulate minimum octane values, only that the postings on the dispensers accurately reflect the octane number of the gasolines being sold.

Gasoline with a higher heating value (energy content) provides better fuel economy. Traditionally, premium gasoline has had a slightly higher heating value than regular, and, thus, provides slightly better fuel economy, but it is difficult to detect in normal driving. There can be even larger differences in heating value between batches of gasoline from the same refinery, between summer and winter volatility classes, or between brands of gasoline from different refineries because of compositional differences. The differences are small and there is no practical way for the consumer to identify gasoline with a higher-than-average heating value.

So, to summarize, spending for higher octane gas is just a waste of money if your engine isn't capable of using it, i.e. tuned for it. I especially like the last sentence of both the first and last paragraphs of the quote.

 

That's what I keep trying to tell you! It's NOT recommended to run 93!!!

 

[QUOTE=chester8420]That's what I keep trying to tell you! It's NOT recommended to run 93!!![/QUOTE

I read that information and got a different perception from it. It said its better for the newer model engines due to the knock sensors and reducing the knock of engines. Thats good enough for me

But like I said previously, you have valid points but you are too definitive on them. You have no room for any variations. In the end, I will have my tuner in about 7 days and then using 93 octane gas will have its benefits.

Again, I appreciate all the information.....even from my disputors

I still cant wait to have my troyer tunes!

 

No, it was explaining the function of octane and how it relates to knock sensors. Your engine was designed to run on 87 octane. It WILL NOT KNOCK unless something is wrong with it. Just like the article said, "carbon buildups, faulty ignition timing etc" High octane fuel can "fix" it. (it really just treats the symptoms) But if your engine isn't broken, it does nothing. It is even harmful in some insances. Newer model engines are more tolerant to fuel variations than any engines ever built. They can adjust to almost anything and still give good performance. Take mine for example. I run 43% ethanol.

 

Hey guys ...

I think I saw it stated somewhere ( perhaps in these forums - haven't looked yet), that the newer (04+) trucks, which have an even more advanced knock sensing system than previous generations, can actually tolerate and even use a slightly higher octane fuel without issue. In other words, even the factory PCM programming has the built-in ability to apply some extra advance, utilizing the knock sensing system as feedback on just how far to go.

Interesting side note: In TP's max per high octane tunes, some initial incipient knock is detected in certain conditions (flooring it from a stop, say). Just a brief couple of pings, then it stops. This is by design, accroding to MT - as it's an indication that the tune is extracting every last bit of power obtainable from the fuel via ignition advance & fueling by utilizing said feedback in the system. "Right on the ragged edge" I believe was the term used.

I experience this often, as I do a lot of planting.

Cheers
bubba

 

The 97-03's can do the same, but they have to be coaxed with a tuner. You can tune for high octane, and the computer will adjust to 87. It takes about 1 or 2 minutes and a hard acceleration run, then it runs like normal. I was not aware that MT's tuning was that aggressive. I guess it advances it until the engine starts knocking. The Edge DEFINATELY doesn't do that.(unless you put 87 in on level 3) I guess that's one way he gets extra power.

 

Yeah - my point was the later MY's will make some allowances stock, within limits. Not as much as a tuner will, (and certainly no substitute for one).

Whereas a '97-'03, without 'coaxing', die on the top as the stock PCM can't deal with the slower burn rate, and actually hurts power.

 

Wow, good stuff. I cant wait for my troyer tunes! Thanks for your input MGDfan!

 

I'm not saying I'm an exper. at all. But I have pers. seen and witnessed loss in power when using a octane higher than required.

Our supercharged civic lost 8 WHP when upping the octane and not adjusting the tune for it.

My pers. car lost over 25RWHP (My GT was putting down 600+RWHP though) when upping the octane and not adjustin the tune.

 

BS. If your engine is not tuned for 93 you will get very little benefit from using it and even if you are tuned for it, it has nothing to do with longevity.
Look in the manual that came with your truck. It clearly states 87 octane. Do you think Ford wants to pay all the warranty claims if 87 was the wrong stuff to use? They tune your system for 87. Unless you have a tuner or a chip to get full benefit from the 93 you are just wasting your money but as you said it is your money to waste.

By who?

 

was reading the thread, decided to help you guys out (all of you), i came across this from the Federal Trade Commission. http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/autos/octane.shtm

Also read the first paragraph... and in the last sentence of that paragraph states as follows...

"It won't make your car perform better, go faster, get better mileage or run cleaner. Your best bet: listen to your owner's manual."

edit= as for tunes i cannot speak bc i dont have custom tunes i just have the superchips programming.. so im speaking in the light of the NOT TUNED truck and what effect does it have on your truck

 

The EPA has done extensive testing with various octane ratings, and has found that using a higher-than-recommended number is a WASTE OF MONEY. Even in the rare cases where there was any improvement in performance or mileage, it was SO SLIGHT that it didn't balance out with the added cost of the fuel, even considering long-term maintenance.

If you like wasting money, it's YOUR truck & YOUR wallet!

 

I can see this is a very sensitive topic, so I'll keep it brief.

Correct that you will gain wide open throttle performance from 93 octane with a tune. In addition, 05+ F-150's have spark adders under heavy pedal conditions. In those cases, the engine will add as much as 10 degrees of timing (depending upon the RPM and air mass in the engine, until it senses detonation. So for these newer vehicles, an engine would take advantage of the slower burn speed to increase the power output of the engine. These spark adders are not used during cruising, so you would effectively lose power and fuel economy while cruising.

Also, be careful. Most tuners calibrate the truck for Wide Open Throttle performance, but don't increase the cruising timing, as it is an unnecessary liability. For the most part, you will lose gas mileage even using a 93 octane tune.

Just the same, I would recommend the high octane fuel to anyone on the forum. The factor of safety it provides against detonation (i.e. blowing up your engine) is definitely worth a little bit of gas mileage IMHO.