Since I tow on occasion I will continue to use my 5W-30. The 20 weight, in my opinion, as well as the three Ford dealers in my area, feel it is to light a grade of oil for proper protection of the motor. Along with that the fact that Ford used a 20 weight to fall within the CAFÉ standards. Since they used it they have to “recommend” it in the owners manual, however nothing changed in the motor like bearing clearances etc. that would “require” one to use a 20 weight.

Not saying there is anything wrong with a 20 weight because I am far from an oil expert, however since the dealers in my area won’t use it when they perform oil changes (I do my own) and I would never think of using anything lighter then a straight 50 weight in my race car when I was racing, due to wanting the proper protection for the motor and if you talk to anybody that races or more specifically anyone that builds high performance motors they would tell you that lighter is not always better.

Dennis:

Where the heck have you been? Great to see you back old friend…

 

See Dennis , I told ya

 

Every so often, I go off and recharge the batteries by driving around visiting friends and just plain having fun. This time, I only took my cellphone which has email. Then, as usual, got involved in another venture. This time, invested in a 200+ acre tract of former agriculture zoned land and have been working practically 24/7 to get the zoning changed to residential.

RE: oil at the dealer. If the dealer uses only 5W-30, then that's what you can use. Personally, I think the dealers are opening themselves up to a liability issue. If they put 5W-30 oil in my truck when the manufacturer says to put 5W-20 oil in, I'll definitely hold my dealer responsible for any oil related failures no matter how long I own the truck! I think you got yourself an extended warranty on your engine.

Look at it this way. If the dealer put in the wrong antifreeze in your truck and it caused extensive damage, who should be held responsible? I'd have to say it's the dealer's fault and the dealer will have to pay for the repairs.

In my book, if something is operated and maintained within the manufacturer's specs, then the manufacturer is liable if something happens. If somebody says the manufacturer's specs are wrong and you should do something different, then that person assumes the liability for anything that goes wrong since you are no longer following the specs of the manufacturer, but those of a third party. Of course, you would have to assume a portion of that liability for your decision to not follow what the manufacturer says.

 

Dennis,

What about all of the people that say why not just use water or cooking oil instead. Mention a 0W or 5W oil and they go ballistic.

 

Dennis:

Good to see you back, always nice having a friendly disagreement or debate. You do indeed bring up some good points that I can not deny. As you correctly stated the owners manual, thus the manufacture, recommends 5W-20. I do not know when that began. I have an 01 and my owners manual does indeed recommend 5W-20.

However, with that said I have done a lot of reading and found that nothing internally in the engine changed which would require the use of thinner oil. Some have incorrectly stated that Ford changed the oil specs due to tighter clearances in the motor, bearings etc. That is not correct. I also read in a few places about CAFÉ and I can not recall the percentage increase in mpg required from one year to the next they are raised. I do not want to go into the complete details about CAFÉ because I do not have all of them. I do know, from reading, that Ford went to the 5W-20 in order to be able to meet the CAFÉ standards for their fleet of trucks (light duty trucks) thus keeping them from paying fines for not meeting CAFÉ standards.

5W-20 will provide a “little” more mpg then would a 5W-30 due to it being thinner. I know you know this, just stating it for someone that may not know. However, just because it may help, very little, in mileage so that Ford would meet the CAFÉ standards, it does not mean it is “better” for the motor “long term”.

Now I may be a conservative but that does not mean I believe everything big business does is always in the consumers best interest. If it is good for profit and the consumer then big business thinks great, if it is good to maintain profit, but will take years for the consumer to notice or even know they have a problem related to a business decision (CAFÉ standards) then to big business no big deal they may be able to explain it away.

As I have said in previous debates about oil, thinner is not always better. If it was then why not just pour 6qts of WD-40 in the motor, that’s quite thin and would flow very well with much less resistance then 5W-30, and 5W-20 may even get 2 – 3 more miles per gallon, Ford would meet CAFÉ for most likely then next 5 – 8 years without having to do anything.

Something to think about, ball’s back in your court…

 

I also use Mobil 5W 30 and would not go usually go lighter but I would like to know what all the talk is about the 0W20. Is ther news on it?

What Oil consumption have the rest of you had with your 5.4?
I have 50,000 miles on my truck and seem to use a quart every 1 to 2 thousand miles. Is that normal? I do drive it hard and regularly cuise at 90+MPH and am not shy in getting it there.

 

FWIW -- on a consumer website I found an article that stated specifically that Ford suggests the 5-20 in order to elevate a poor mpg rating on their 4.6 (thinner oil = less resistance). True to form, I am getting only a tad better in my 03 4.6 4x4 than my 5.8 GM got (about 17 hwy).

So, please advise FordLords , other than slightly lower mpg, is a slightly heavier oil (5-30/10-30) actually harmful to the engine or even more protection?
Thanks

 

I noticed earlier in this thread the comparison of Mobil 1 0w20 to Motorcraft...

Is the Mobil 1 0w20 a FULL synth oil?

Dan

 

Yes, Fully Synthetic is stated on the bottle and it cost $5 a quart

 

5w30 would be no problem in these engines.

Does it offer better engine lubrication than 5w20?

No analysis I've seen would suggest that 5w20 does a poorer job than any quality 5w30.

In fact, I will be a bit of a guinea pig here - My '97 is due for an oil change soon, and I just happen to have 6 qts of 5w20 Conoco Hydroclear in the garage. It should be similar to the motorcraft 5w20, as that is made by Conoco also. Other results on 5w20 have been very encouraging, so I am going to take the plunge here too.

I have two analysis of the 5w30 on the '97, and I will be comparing the 5w20 to those numbers.

Oh, and yes, the Mobil 1 0w-20 is a REAL synthetic. Currently 4.75 a qt at my local Wal-mart.

 

Part of Fords spec 153-H calls for reduced deposits on a double length TEOST MHT-4 test. Ford requires only 30 mg of high temp/high speed deposits compared to the normal single lenght test of 45mg of deposits. Running a Ford speced oil will result in a much cleaner engine over a standard Xw-30. There is no advantage to the M1 as the VI's between M1 and Motorcraft are close and the HT/HS is identical at 2.6. You might pay more but you aren't getting more. If you want a good synthetic that costs more, has a higher HT/HS (directly related to ring and bearing wear), you need to be using Amzoil (HT/HS=2.9). You also need to know that it is not API approved.

 

I think these questions about 5W-20 and Ford needs to be answered.

Lots of people quote things about the reason Ford changed the specs on the oil is because of gas mileage. Are there any documents from Ford to support this claim or is it just what people "hear?"

Is the use of 5W-20 oil detrimental? Any proof that it is?

Are there any advantages to using 5W-30 oil over the use of 5W-20 oil? Any proof?

I go back to what I've said in the past. There was a time, not too long ago, that people were up in arms over Ford's specs calling for the use of 5W-30 oil, claiming it would cause premature wear because the oil was too thin. That argument has died down to practically nil. Now that Ford calls for the use of 5W-20 oil, we hear the same arguments again.

Why is it that nobody seems to say that the use of Mobil 1 0W-20 oil is bad for their engines?

I think what people are forgetting is the fact that oils of today are not the same oils that were used 20 years ago. As engine technology advances, so has oil technology. In the case of the Triton engines, my guess is oil technology finally caught up with engine technology.

If fuel economy was the major factor in switching to 5W-20 oil, why was it approved for use in most engines all the way back to the late 1980 models? If the oil is so bad for the engines, why did Ford say we can use in in the 5.8L engine, for instance? Why risk the litigation? Like I said before, I think oil technology is not what it was even 5 years ago.

Anecdotal postings by members of this board have pointed to problems with the use of heavier than spec'd oils in their Triton engines. The latest was markedly decreased fuel mileage. Previous postings spoke about clattering noises at startup.

Again, I ask you. Is there any proof that the use of 5W-20 oil is detrimental? How about Mobil 1 0W-20 oil? What's the proof that using 5W-30 or 10W-30 oil is better than what Ford specs?

 

Analysis is showing that 5w20 is working just fine in the engines that Ford says it is OK in.

Reality is it was done for CAFE reasons. Does that mean its is affecting wear? So far, it doesn't look that way.

The major problem Ford faces here is skepticism by the EPA that people will actually use the 5w20 oils. That is why Ford is pushing backwards compatibility in many older engines. The EPA is measuring compliance by Ford based on Sales of 5w20 oil. If the sales aren't high enough, then Ford loses the CAFE credits generated by the oil. If Ford pushes backwards compatibility, 5w20 is sold more, and maybe the EPA buys into folks actually using the oil.

As I stated above - 5w30 is fine in these motors. No changes that require 5w20 have been made. Does 5w30 protect better than 5w20? The jury is still out, but the results I have seen to date are encouraging.

To further that understanding, thats why I am trying the 5w20 in my '97 to see if there is an appreciable difference in engine wear. I'll have some idea in a few months, and a better idea after a full season running it.

 

Thanks, gopher. You have posted the most reasonable explanation yet.

I'm still betting that the backwards compatibility wouldn't have been made if there was a chance that older engines could wear out faster with the lighter oil. Why open yourself up to class action suits?

Are any manufacturers using the 5W-20 standard other than Ford and Honda? I'm betting the rest will follow soon and this controversy will die down just as the controversy over 5W-30 died down about 3 or 4 years ago.

Does anybody remember what it was like in '96 and '97? I was hard to find 5W-30 oil anywhere. 10W-30 and 10W-40 oil was the standard and that was what people wanted to put in their Tritons. Now? You can find it in the supermarket.

Anybody else remember when you were lucky if your engine lasted 100,000 miles? These days, engines running on "thin" oil are running upwards of 200,000 miles. I find it hard to argue with what Ford is telling us to use in our engines.

 

Another thing to think about with so many of the doom and gloom crowd on 5w20 is that many of them were (are) mobil 1 users. Funny thing is that Mobil 1 5w30 or 10w30 is the oil that comes the closest to being a 20 weight oil of ANY 5w30 or 10w30. Yet those were the smae owners claiming a slightly thinner oil could never protect their engines. Go figure?