coolant loss
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Member
Joined: May 2002
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From: Evanville, IN
coolant loss
I seem to be losing some coolant. Resevoir levels keeps dropping. I have heard that they have a service bullitin out on this. What exactly does that mean. Will they check it out at no cost or what. If not what will be the rough estimate to get this addressed at the dealer? Any info is greatly appreciated.
Scott
Scott
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Joined: Sep 2000
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From: Mpls, MN
Manufacturers issue recalls when there is such a wide spread
safety or quality problem that either the Federal Govt. makes them fix it at their own expense, or the manufacturer realizes their appearant guilt and knows that a recall will cost less than the cost of fighting and settling lawsuits.
A "TSB" is a Technical Service Bulletin. Manufacturers issue TSB's when they find a fix for a wide spread problem, such as a door crack or pealing paint. TSB's list the problem and the supposed fix. These are issued to dealer service depts and registered on file with the NHTSA. They are not sent to consumers and Ford will only pay for the repairs if they see a lawsuit coming or a potential to lose a valued customer. There is no Federal mandate that requires them to pay for the fix but generally, they do have a legal obligation depending on vehicle age and servicability
If you don't find the coolant on the ground, then it's entering the engine and settling in the crankcase or burning up in the cylinders and exiting through the exhaust. The only other explaination would be a faulty cap on the overflow tank but with the '97 4.2L, I suspect the worst.
This was a new engine to Ford in 1996. By 1998 they were finding lots and lots of problems with leaking gaskets. Part of the problem was with the gaskets themselves being over torqued at the factory but there were also problems specific to the gaskets. Adding to this; there were problems with the mating surfaces and the different expansion/contraction rates between the iron block and the aluminum alloy heads and intake manifold.
In 1998 the gaskets were redesigned and the torque specifications were changed.
There was a recall that affected all 4.2L engines built before 05/01/97. Recall #99B29 Engine Front Cover Gasket Replacement. A faulty gasket allowed coolant to leak into the engine crankcase.
There is also a TSB related to coolant loss and engine failure. TSB #99-20-7 Coolant Loss/Engine Oil Contamination, 3.8L, 4.2L
This one was because of leaking lower intake manifold side gaskets. Ford redesigned the gaskets in 1998.
Ford knows they build an engine with a very poor record. Depending on the milage, they may pay for the gasket replacement since it was their fault.
If you're losing coolant, you really do need to take care of this immediately. I'd suggest that you call the dealer it was purchased from (if that applies) and simply tell them that you're loosing coolant and would like it looked at. They'll check for obvious leaks and will likely perform and cooling system presure test as well as an engine compression and leak down test to see if the head gasket has failed. If it's confirmed that a gasket failed, speak to the service manager only. He has a lot of power. Ask him how much Ford is going to pay and point out the TSB's. If he still says it's your problem, "get a complete service right up". You payed for the inspection and they legally must provide the findings and repair costs in writing. Take this receipt and start contacting everyone you can related to Ford Motor Co. Call their cust service # as well as the regional contacts and also the dealership owner. You can even email Jr. himself at wford@ford.com You should also file a complaint at www.nhtsa.gov and every consumer site you can find.
If it is leaking and you're under 100,000 miles they should pick up a percentage of the cost. These are expensive gaskets to replace. The Front cover gasket is around 6 hours labor and the Head gasket is about 8 hours labor. I don't know exactly how much they'd pay but expect their initial response to be zero Remember that Ford lost a lot of money last year and doesn't want to give you back anything you've already put in their pocket.
Ford officially states that the average life of engine gaskets is 130,000 miles so you can figure out the percentages and determine how much they should pay.
Whatever you find out, if you need engine work performed, hold onto your receipt. There are reports of Ford having an unofficial 7yr/100,000 mile warranty on all '96-'97 4.2L engine gasket failures at www.lemonaidcars.com.
I have a leaking head gasket and I have done a lot of research on this. The average time of engine failure is between 60,000 and 80,000 miles. When you consider that most people drive 12,000-15,000 miles per year and these engines are now an average of 5 years old, most of the engine failures are just now comming about. I fully expect Ford will issue a full recall on all '96-'97 4.2L engines within 2 years, just like they did with the 1995 3.8L engines.
It took me about 1/2 hour to find a whole lot of 4.2L engine failures. https://www.f150online.com/forums/sh...threadid=71093
safety or quality problem that either the Federal Govt. makes them fix it at their own expense, or the manufacturer realizes their appearant guilt and knows that a recall will cost less than the cost of fighting and settling lawsuits.
A "TSB" is a Technical Service Bulletin. Manufacturers issue TSB's when they find a fix for a wide spread problem, such as a door crack or pealing paint. TSB's list the problem and the supposed fix. These are issued to dealer service depts and registered on file with the NHTSA. They are not sent to consumers and Ford will only pay for the repairs if they see a lawsuit coming or a potential to lose a valued customer. There is no Federal mandate that requires them to pay for the fix but generally, they do have a legal obligation depending on vehicle age and servicability
If you don't find the coolant on the ground, then it's entering the engine and settling in the crankcase or burning up in the cylinders and exiting through the exhaust. The only other explaination would be a faulty cap on the overflow tank but with the '97 4.2L, I suspect the worst.
This was a new engine to Ford in 1996. By 1998 they were finding lots and lots of problems with leaking gaskets. Part of the problem was with the gaskets themselves being over torqued at the factory but there were also problems specific to the gaskets. Adding to this; there were problems with the mating surfaces and the different expansion/contraction rates between the iron block and the aluminum alloy heads and intake manifold.
In 1998 the gaskets were redesigned and the torque specifications were changed.
There was a recall that affected all 4.2L engines built before 05/01/97. Recall #99B29 Engine Front Cover Gasket Replacement. A faulty gasket allowed coolant to leak into the engine crankcase.
There is also a TSB related to coolant loss and engine failure. TSB #99-20-7 Coolant Loss/Engine Oil Contamination, 3.8L, 4.2L
This one was because of leaking lower intake manifold side gaskets. Ford redesigned the gaskets in 1998.
Ford knows they build an engine with a very poor record. Depending on the milage, they may pay for the gasket replacement since it was their fault.
If you're losing coolant, you really do need to take care of this immediately. I'd suggest that you call the dealer it was purchased from (if that applies) and simply tell them that you're loosing coolant and would like it looked at. They'll check for obvious leaks and will likely perform and cooling system presure test as well as an engine compression and leak down test to see if the head gasket has failed. If it's confirmed that a gasket failed, speak to the service manager only. He has a lot of power. Ask him how much Ford is going to pay and point out the TSB's. If he still says it's your problem, "get a complete service right up". You payed for the inspection and they legally must provide the findings and repair costs in writing. Take this receipt and start contacting everyone you can related to Ford Motor Co. Call their cust service # as well as the regional contacts and also the dealership owner. You can even email Jr. himself at wford@ford.com You should also file a complaint at www.nhtsa.gov and every consumer site you can find.
If it is leaking and you're under 100,000 miles they should pick up a percentage of the cost. These are expensive gaskets to replace. The Front cover gasket is around 6 hours labor and the Head gasket is about 8 hours labor. I don't know exactly how much they'd pay but expect their initial response to be zero Remember that Ford lost a lot of money last year and doesn't want to give you back anything you've already put in their pocket.
Ford officially states that the average life of engine gaskets is 130,000 miles so you can figure out the percentages and determine how much they should pay.
Whatever you find out, if you need engine work performed, hold onto your receipt. There are reports of Ford having an unofficial 7yr/100,000 mile warranty on all '96-'97 4.2L engine gasket failures at www.lemonaidcars.com.
I have a leaking head gasket and I have done a lot of research on this. The average time of engine failure is between 60,000 and 80,000 miles. When you consider that most people drive 12,000-15,000 miles per year and these engines are now an average of 5 years old, most of the engine failures are just now comming about. I fully expect Ford will issue a full recall on all '96-'97 4.2L engines within 2 years, just like they did with the 1995 3.8L engines.
It took me about 1/2 hour to find a whole lot of 4.2L engine failures. https://www.f150online.com/forums/sh...threadid=71093
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 222
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AJ is right on with his post.
This is a bigger problem than Ford is admitting publically.
But I can tell you that they will address it and make good on helping, but they only respond if you go in armed with knowledge of the issue and technique of presentation. They have a program called PO5 that they can use to address a Non-Warranty, Non-Recall issue such as this. They don't hand it out like candy and it is a case by case basis, but I can assure you they have and do fix these engines at little or no cost to the customer.
I beleive these engines will be recalled within the next year.
Just as AJ pointed out, they are just now coming into the failure mode now.
They did a massive recall on the 3.8 engines and replaced the engines even if outside of the initial warranty. They extended the warranty to 100,000 miles for that engine and replaced them for free.
And yes it has been costly for Ford. Perhaps they will finally learn a lesson??????
This is a bigger problem than Ford is admitting publically.
But I can tell you that they will address it and make good on helping, but they only respond if you go in armed with knowledge of the issue and technique of presentation. They have a program called PO5 that they can use to address a Non-Warranty, Non-Recall issue such as this. They don't hand it out like candy and it is a case by case basis, but I can assure you they have and do fix these engines at little or no cost to the customer.
I beleive these engines will be recalled within the next year.
Just as AJ pointed out, they are just now coming into the failure mode now.
They did a massive recall on the 3.8 engines and replaced the engines even if outside of the initial warranty. They extended the warranty to 100,000 miles for that engine and replaced them for free.
And yes it has been costly for Ford. Perhaps they will finally learn a lesson??????
Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
From: Newnan, Ga.
You better take of the problem immediatly, My truck is in the shop now for the rod knocking. It has 109000 flawless miles on it till now, Ford said there is nothing they can do for me because of the miles. I do know you are ridding on borrowed time, and you better get it checked out fast. Good Luck!!
Senior Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
From: Copple Crown Mountain NH
As everybody has mentioned get it in to the dealer. I bought a 97 just under two years ago with 46,000 on it ,having no idea about this board or the issues with this motor. Before I picked it up they changed out the gaskets under the TSB. I just brought it in again,84,000 miles as I was losing coolant as well and wanted them to check out my clutch/tranny. I had also bought an extended warranty and was hoping to get anything I could handled under that.
They pulled the engine replaced both both gaskets, replaced all rod and main bearings, rear main seal, cleaned carbon off the pistons,lapped valves to seats,replaced valve seals,new exhaust manifold,completely overhauled the tranny and replace lower ball joints.
Over $4,400 worth of work. Wrote a check for $365. $265 for the wear parts for the clutch, the remaining $100 was the deductable for the ext warranty.
Needless to say with all the info I had seen on the board I pretty worked up. Luckily the service manager at my dealership takes pretty damn good care of me. Hope yours does to. Good Luck
They pulled the engine replaced both both gaskets, replaced all rod and main bearings, rear main seal, cleaned carbon off the pistons,lapped valves to seats,replaced valve seals,new exhaust manifold,completely overhauled the tranny and replace lower ball joints.
Over $4,400 worth of work. Wrote a check for $365. $265 for the wear parts for the clutch, the remaining $100 was the deductable for the ext warranty.
Needless to say with all the info I had seen on the board I pretty worked up. Luckily the service manager at my dealership takes pretty damn good care of me. Hope yours does to. Good Luck
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
From: Miami
Thanks AjRagno
Your links have been helpfull to me venting some of my frustations on this subject. the recalls that you post are correct but only for trucks built on Sept 1995 to Dec 1996.
If your truck was built after that date you are SOL. I know this because I just got the $2400 bill for engine rebuild and Ford will not help us.
Your links have been helpfull to me venting some of my frustations on this subject. the recalls that you post are correct but only for trucks built on Sept 1995 to Dec 1996.
If your truck was built after that date you are SOL. I know this because I just got the $2400 bill for engine rebuild and Ford will not help us.
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Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 78
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From: Tennessee
Hey,I have a 97' F150 xlt with a V6 4.2L. after reading this I got really worried about my truck.....I'm hearing strange knocking noises after i drive the truck for about 30 minutes or when it warrms up. The sound is there, but it is really faint. Also my service engine light just kicked on about 2 days ago. This is the second time its happened in two weeks. The first time i took it back to the dealership i had bought it from only a month ago, and they checked it and found nothing wrong so they reset it. I'm starting to think coolant may be leaking from the timing gear cover or through the head gasket into the crankcase and screwing up my engine. I've checked the coolant reservoir, and there might be a slight bit missing from it, but I'm not sure if it was already like that or what...I've only driven it 250 miles since i bought it, and this is really starting to worry me. I don't have a waranty on it and i've been looking over lemonade about this stuff, but im not sure if the dealership will fix this and ford will pay it off or if i'll be spending tons of cash on it....I really need advice.....Alot of it.......So anyone having this problem or know what is going on or what i should do or what im entitled to by ford, please give me a shout or email me at isaactaylor15@hotmail.com. Thanks,
-Isaac-
-Isaac-
