Really need some help here. Purchased my 1st Ford 2 weeks ago. Traded in my Tundra for it due to the fact I needed just a bit more power to tow my 6,500 lb (loaded) travel trailer.
Bought a 05 F150 4X4 FX4, 5.4L, 3.73 axle, which is rated to pull 9,200 lbs.
Problem: Took the trailer last week and was not happy with it's power up the long hills. It would NOT downshift. Instead it ran at about 3,200 rpm's at 40 mph up the hill. I had the pedal floared and it just would not downshift.
With my Tundra I would just hit the pedal quickly and it would slam into a low gear at about 45-4,700 rpm's and it would accelerate up those same hillls my F150 was bogging down on. Is this normal? The Ford has a larger engine, more torque, hp, and can tow 2,000 more than the Tundra.
I had it in the dealer yesterday and at the end of the day the mechanic said there was nothing they could do and told me to manually downshift into 2nd.
My friend, who knows quite a bit about vehicles said that was a wrong answer. He said the transmission should downshift on it's own.
Any input would be great. I know you guys don't want to hear this but if a Tundra and my F150 were going up the hill at the same time (pulling 6,500 lbs) the F150 would be a spot in the Tundras mirror at the top. :o

 

Well, in your specific situation, at the time you were traveling at that speed in 3rd gear, the PCM must have thought your engine would redline (or come close to it) if it downshifted to 2nd. The computer controls your tranny based on demand and engine speed, and probably a few other variables. 3500 rpm's is about midrange on the tach (correct me if I'm wrong), so if your tranny had shifted to 2nd from that point, it probably would have jumped to around 4500 to 5000 rpm. That's cutting it close. V8's usually don't have a high redline. But Toyota may be different. That's just my guess. You can take it with a grain of salt if you want.

 

Hey John, I recognize your question from RV.NET!!

Oh, welcome to F150online by the way!

Thinking about it more.... 3200 rpms at 40 mph just does not make sense to me.... I mean, in second gear (1.53:1) my truck is pulling ~3500 rpms @ 55 mph. I can easily take it to 4 grand and go 60 mph, but I don't do that because there is no need to..... In third (1:1), I'm only at 2000 going 50 mph....

Might be a dumb question, but is the new F150 still a 4 speed auto or a 5 speed auto??? I know the Titan is a 5 speed auto, right?

Rpms vs mph do not change any with what weight is being pulled.... 3500 rpms in second gear going 55 mph is the same unloaded and on flat ground as it is towing a #4500 travel trailer going up a 6% grade.... You just have to put more pedal into it, feeding the engine more fuel, because it's working a lot harder, but the rpms remain the same.....

I guess we need to find out what your F150's transmission gear ratios are..... Also need to know what size tires you are running. We already know the gear ratio, but without the other two figures, it's hard to say 'what' gear you were really in.....

Mitch

 

Hi Mitch! Got some good answers on RVNET but wanted to get some second opinions. This is really bugging me. So much so that today I e-mailed Ford.
The gears are 3.73 and the tires are 17", I guess that is what you are asking...remember I am dumb about cars/trucks.
And another problem is, when one person says there is something wrong and another writes back that everything seems normal. What do I believe? I am hoping for someone with the same exact truck who pulls a trailer to reply. But I will still take all advise of course.

 

Yeah, I just don't have enough experience with the new F150's yet to know if they are even a 5 speed auto or not!! DOH.....

Well, there are lots of guys here with the new F150's, so I'm sure someone in the 'know' will pipe in soon....

With the 17" wheels, you probalby have the P265/70/17 size tires... So, approx 31" tall. If we can just get the new F150's trans gear ratios, we could figure out what gear you were in @ 3200 rpms going 40 mph.....

Honestly, it does not sound "normal" to me...... There is some serious 'FUBAR' going on with your truck.... (Sorry, just got done watching 'Saving Private Ryan' again on DVD with my new surround sound system the other night....)

If you were 'bogging' down at 3200, then somethings wrong... Your 5.4 is at it's peak torque at around that rpm range..... You should have been able to just press the pedal and start gaining speed.....

Well, hopefully someone with the same truck as you will chime in!

See ya on RV.NET!

Mitch

 

John - I'm a recent new owner of a 05 F150 as well. This board has educated me on some important issues with these trucks. Apparently FORD has "dumbed down" the ECU on these trucks to make them "smoother". There is a guy that posts frequently named Mike Troyer who runs a performance shop at www.troyerperformance.com who claims to be able to "wake up" these trucks. I've bought into the propaganda as of today. There were so many satisfied owners on this board, I figured it made sense. There is a unit called XCAL2 that overrides the stock ECU programming to "tunes" that mike's team sells. These apparently can modify shift points, improve throttle response and improve performance. They even have towing specific tunes.

I decided to try it out - though I don't know if it works from experience yet. I myself do a good bit of towing with my travel trailer and speedboat, though I've only had the truck for 2 weeks and have only tested the towing for about 10 miles total. However, I simply didn't want to encounter the problem you did when I'm doing my travelling.

Hope this helps. I'm not recommending Troyer from my own experience, but based on everyone elses experience. I'd be happy to let you know how it works out once everything is delivered and I get it installed.

 

Four speed auto for ford trucks, exception of the torqueshift in the superdutys. Well 3.73s arn't helpin you out, but I have towed some monster loads with "only" the 4.6L and it was happy doin it. Course I have the five speed stick...

Reason number three I don't like autos is that they never seem to be in the gear I wan't them to be in. If you feel like it, drop down to 2 manually. These overhead cam motors love to rev and will happily bounce off the rev limiter no problem. I know... hehehe

Adrianspeeder

 

Ahhhhh... not really they put really crappy valvetrain on the truck engines and they are not good at higher rpm so dont hold them there. But i understand what you mean, it felt like it should have down shifted but it just didnt. Mine does that in everyday driving. there is a set mph that the trans wont downshift. ( and it is set low ) most likely you were really close to it. Now as to fixing it. 1. you could manually downshift. ( how often do you really have to do it.) 2. if you slowed down alittle then nailed it it would downshift. 3. get a programmer and set a shift point that helps you out. P.S. these trucks have 4speeds and need 5 speeds because the ratios are to far apart in 2nd and 3rd. These engines were designed for a 5speed. Leave it to ford to cut the wrong corners.

 

Thanks all. Only my 3rd post on this forum but for some reason I believe what you guys say. I am faced with the fact that the truck is a lemon while towing uphills. I guess it's alright though, as long as it makes it up the hill.

 

Downshift before the hill and hold the gear...accelerate... until you feel it's time to downshift. Yes, a programmer will help...call Troyer!!!

As far as the statement, "really crappy valvetrains" how so, for racing?

 

Very interesting thread to me. I just got through installing a Prodigy brake controller on the SC Lariat I picked up Wednesday I backed it up to the trailer to check out the electrical hookups. Now I've got to go buy some bulbs for the clearance lights.

 

Crappy valve train? Run our 97 up at 5k all the time. Gettin to 100K prolly by christmas and still runs strong.

Really pulls up in second, and when I slam to third, hold on...

Adrianspeeder

 

Yep Adrianspeeder, my little pony puller holds 4000rpm in 2nd up the grapevine at 50mph for 15 minutes with no problems towing a 7000lb gooseneck trailer. If I let the tranny make that pitiful 1500rpm drop into 3rd I would have to let the horses out so they could help pull everything up the hill. 2500 rpm in 3rd is powerless to say the least. I suspect the new 3 valve engines have a variable valve timing nightmare that is effecting their ability to maintain high revs without hitting a valve and self destructing. That may be what 01vert is talking about.

 

Well, as far as my Crappy comment, 5000 is not a high rpm, and i was talking about the newer engines not a 97. these new cant handle much over 5500, which is pretty dam low if you ask me. and no its not the 3 valve look at the mustang. They just put crappy parts on our trucks. I think its called ford is cheap...

 

Well, how many RPMs do you think you need to be turning?

Its a truck, not a Ferrari.

All the new truck motors hit their max torque at 3500-4000 RPM and they hit their max HP rating at 4500-5000 RPM.

If you go any faster then that, all your doing is taking power away and abusing your engine.